High wattage tube amps in small rooms

[warlok]

I'm sorta new to tube amps. I never gig'd or anything, just played with friends in garages etc and always with solid states. Now i have a Crate BV120H and 4x12 cabs I play with. I understand when tube amps are turned up you get tube saturation and the sound is different/better however you look at it. I've played with low wattage amps and seen what it does cranked up. I have my rig setup in a big room in my house. About 40'x25' with vaulted ceilings. How the hell can I get anywhere near full use/sound out of a 100 watt head when even in a big room (i mean comparable to a bedroom or something)? I turn it up to 2.5 and my head and the windows are ready to blow. I like the sound of the amp but want to get the full potential sound, saturation, etc. if possible. Other than buying a lower wattage amp, what can I do?

[Firebird V]

put a volume pedal in the fx loop or get a attenuator like a thd hot plate. keep in mind that both of these may/will alter the tone.

[6string40]

I have not used one in several years, but I found that the Weber attenuators were more transparent than the THD hot plates.

[jgcable]

A 5 watt tube amp could blow the windows out.

[tonemonster]

Agreed on the volume pedal. I have two tube amps that have a "master" volume pot in the FX loop on them and they work like a champ. I am able to get really good tone at comfortable listening levels. there are other tricks you can use like throwing a carpet over the speaker cab or turning the speaker cabinet against the wall.....but they affect the tone and arent as effecting IMO.

You can get a volume pedal for a decent cost and have the best results. they are cheaper than attenuators and give better results I think.

[tonemonster]

A 5 watt tube amp could blow the windows out.

the power of tube amps.

[fordsho90]

If you have a seperate channel volume from the master volume crank the channel volume up and then start playing w/the master. Only use one of the cabs as apposed to two or if you gotta have both of them then dont stack them put them side by side but not right next to each other; break them up a bit and dont stand right in front of them stand next to them lol. I use a 100w head and a 4x12 cab in a bedroom and I can get it up to 4 or 5 and still not have my head explode and get the tube saturation and sound. Cabinet placement is very important dont have it facing a wall 10 feet in front of you or it will just make it worse lol. And your windows shouldnt blow out mine havent yet lol.

[warlok]

No master volume, now i understand what that means when people say that about the older marhshalls. I'll look around for a volume pedal and give that a shot. Thanks!!

[Racerx2k]

Agreed on the volume pedal. I have two tube amps that have a "master" volume pot in the FX loop on them and they work like a champ. I am able to get really good tone at comfortable listening levels. there are other tricks you can use like throwing a carpet over the speaker cab or turning the speaker cabinet against the wall.....but they affect the tone and arent as effecting IMO.

You can get a volume pedal for a decent cost and have the best results. they are cheaper than attenuators and give better results I think.

Yeah, but you are not driving the power tubes, then. what you are doing is pushing the preamp section, getting the preamp tubes cooking, but that does nothing for achieving power tube distortion. you need either a power soak for that OR an isolation speaker cabinet. In his case, the iso cab isn't the proper choice, the soak is.

[Cygnus X1]

A 5 watt tube amp could blow the windows out.

There is your answer, you need to know no more.

I have constructed my entire tube amp building around this,
and a single ended amp with a 6550 power tube will literally
shake the windows at the other end of my house, 85 feet away.

It's all about efficiency, and a little secret.
You don't have to push the power tubes that hard to get great tone.
Pushing power tubes for sustain is a somewhat of a myth.
Most of what identify with that "singing sustain" is usually an
envelope of what happens in the preamp, and the phase inverter.

Google "Tales of the Tone Lounge", he explains it much better than I do.
"Marshall Myths" is what you'll be looking for.

[warlok]

Damn Cyg... That's alot of reading!! lol

Looking around and seeing how much some of this stuff costs (good quality, not going to damage an amp, etc..) I'm thinking a volume pedal is MY best bet right now.

I do have a question though as I am cheap, as in... I don't like paying extra money for that can do the same thing cheaper. Is a volume pedal basically 2 jacks, a pot, and a mechanical pedal to control the pot? If it is, I have a aluminum box, a bunch of different value pots, and some extra jacks. Is it really that simple? I don't care if it's controlled by a pedal or my hand so if it is, I'll have a volume controlling box in about 5 minutes...

[toejam]

Is a volume pedal basically 2 jacks, a pot, and a mechanical pedal to control the pot? If it is, I have a aluminum box, a bunch of different value pots, and some extra jacks. Is it really that simple? I don't care if it's controlled by a pedal or my hand so if it is, I'll have a volume controlling box in about 5 minutes...

Yep, a volume box or pedal will do the same thing. I've got one. There's a few guys that sell them on ebay, too.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Amp-Volume-Box-lets-you-crank-your-amp-up-at-low-vol_W0QQitemZ220532751077QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3358c6bae5

[warlok]

Cool. I'm gonna go build one free.. Thanks.

[warlok]

Alright wait a fucking minute... Playing and looking at my amp got me thinking again. Albeit drunk now (which may be better at this point). What exactly is a "non master volume amp"? Is it just an amp without a master volume for the whole amp, like has a separate for each channel? I always thought it was an amp where there is no "gain" knob, and the "volume" controls the gain... I have a distortion channel with a bass, mid, treble, GAIN and a VOLUME knob, and a clean with Bass, mid, treble, and VOLUME. Each has separate reverb and there's a master presence. How is this a "non master volume" amp as alot of the internet says... Or are they just idiots and I was dumb enough to listen to them. I think this is the most likely option.. So, the volume box or pedal would be useless as it's already done by the amp, right?

[DonP]

Or are they just idiots and I was dumb enough to listen to them. I think this is the most likely option.. So, the volume box or pedal would be useless as it's already done by the amp, right?

+1

I don't know shit about the Blue Doo Doo:ROTF:, but if there is a gain control and a volume control, you should be able to dime the gain and turn down the volume to get distortion. That's how the DSL100 is laid out. Separate Gain, Volume (and reverb) for each channel.