Axefx Ultra after 2 hours of plugging in...

[MOSHWITZ]

Sup?
Sure brother,,,hit me with your E-mail Addy

MOSHON
DAVE

[MakeAJazzNoiseHere]

So, I hope this question has not been beaten to death... I have been considering getting one of these. The other day, I was playing through the Mark V at about 11:00 at night and, with the volume turned down low, obviously the tone is not good. The clean sounded thin and shitty, the rhythm channel sounded thin and shitty, the lead channel sounded thin and shitty...

How's the Axe through a FRFR setup for "bedroom quiet"? I would imagine with a full-range speaker that the bass response could be dialed up quite a bit to get the speaker moving so the bottom end comes through, but I don't want to spend the $$ to find that it still "isn't there."

I'm pretty happy with the tone of the Mark when I'm recording (Direct Out > Cab Emulator in Pro Tools) but it's not getting used for day-to-day practice just because it sound so weak turned down (which, I would expect any 12" guitar speaker/amp to do the same).

[emperor_black]

Hate to disappoint you, but that's just the laws of physics. At lower volumes, the speaker cones are not moving as much and as differently than at higher volumes and there will be a loss of tone. The axe behaves exactly the same way as a tube amp. I built a patch from scratch at moderate volumes, volumes where my wife was still talking to me and my kid's loud talking could still be heard. I labelled it 'Warm Uber'. The next day, when I cranked up the volume, it was no longer "warm". it was bright and tight and all the goodness. So, you have to turn up the axe if you want a great tone.

On the upside, you can feed the axe's o/p to a mixer and use its onboard equalizer knobs to further change the tone and then feed it to either a pair of headphones or a home stereo's IPOD in. That's the beauty of the axe where it can be used in many situations.

[MakeAJazzNoiseHere]

Right, I understand the limitations of pushing .5 watts into a 100-watt guitar speaker. According to your signature, you are using "DIY 2x12 cabs" so that's what you're doing, which is also what I'm doing when I play my Mark V at very low volumes.

However... Headphone drivers are just tiny speakers, and they manage to sound excellent with a few milliwatts driving them, because that is what they are designed for.

That is why I specifically asked about FRFR speakers, which will have excellent frequency range & response, and should allow a lot more loudness compensation than a 12-inch guitar speaker (which skews way toward mid-range) would. I can somewhat simulate this with the graphic EQ on the Boogie, but, it's still a guitar speaker that is designed to put out 120 Hz - 2KHz roughly.

[Spivonious]

+1, although guitar speakers are very efficient (100-105dB/1W/1m), running 1 or 2 watts through them isn't going to sound too good.

I'd try to get a 1x8 and see how that goes. You'll lose some low end from the smaller cone size, but you should gain in sound quality at the same volume, since there's less speaker to push.

[emperor_black]

hmm...then maybe the best way would be to hook up the AXE to cabs when you're playing loud and to FRFR if playing at low volumes? The only reason I've not gone to FRFR's yet is because there are so many options out there, and the good ones are pretty expensive. $700+ for each speaker I think. Also, I dont want to lose the "Amp in the room" feeling that people experience going FRFR. I've A/B'd the AXE with the Uberschall and the Mark IV and with my present setup I dont lose anything; feel, tone, etc. The only things I lose are a bunch of pedals and cables.

[MakeAJazzNoiseHere]

Not sure what you mean about the "amp in the room" aspect but the idea with the FRFR is so you can use the different cabs. Now, I'm not that concerned if, say, my Fender Twin Reverb is running through a (real) ported 1-12" cab instead of FRFR and a virtual 4x10" cab or whatever.

I'm under the impression that a good FRFR setup will fill up a room just as well as any guitar cabinet. Maybe not some little teeny 6" monitor speakers, but, the big 900-watt 12" FRFR setups, should rock a club just like a 1-12" combo amp would... Am I wrong? :dunno:

I'm pretty sure I'm going to do this. My Boogie never gets used, it's kind of a waste. Plus once I get it sounding good into the recorder, I take the headphones off and it's like "WTF?" so I'm just endlessly twiddling knobs and can't ever get back to what I had before... At least with the AxeFX I can save a preset, twiddle away, make something new, and save a different preset.

[Robert Burns]

Me too please? Im not afraid... [email protected] Thanks in advance!

In reply to Moshwitz post.. )

[Rupe]

I've tried mine through a 2:90 into a 4x12 with 75w Celestions and a FBT Verve 12ma FRFR...the FRFR wins hands down for any application IMO. It sounds great for low volume in-home playing and absolutely crushes at live volume (although you will most likely want to have different eq curves for your presets for those dynamically different situations). The FBT easily hangs with the 4x12 in volume and allows the IR section of the Axe to truly shine.

[emperor_black]

I must agree that even though I have all these models and effects and what not, when playing through my cabs, all amps have the same "flavor" thanks to my cabs. To get truly different tones, I guess FRFR is the way to go.

Rupe, before settling on the 12ma, which other FRFR's did you try? Honestly, I feel the FBT's are way too expensive. How much do they usually cost? $800 per speaker?

[MakeAJazzNoiseHere]

I've tried mine through a 2:90 into a 4x12 with 75w Celestions and a FBT Verve 12ma FRFR...the FRFR wins hands down for any application IMO. It sounds great for low volume in-home playing and absolutely crushes at live volume (although you will most likely want to have different eq curves for your presets for those dynamically different situations). The FBT easily hangs with the 4x12 in volume and allows the IR section of the Axe to truly shine.

Cool, thanks for the info! I am considering a pair of either the QSC K12 or K10 but the Verve units do get a lot of praise.

I was going to handle the loudness compensation externally, with an EQ. I was thinking I'd put an EQ between the Axe's output and the FRFR and bypass it as necessary (at high volumes), and run the other out direct to the recorder inputs.

That way I get a consistent tone into the recorder, but I have the EQ to dial up some extra lows and low-mids when I'm turned down, and can easily just hit the bypass when I can cut loose with the volume.

[emperor_black]

you dont need to use an external eq. the axe has a two global eq's, one for each output.

[MakeAJazzNoiseHere]

Oh, that's very cool.

I was thinking I would set up the internal EQ for "loud" and then use the external EQ to add loudness compensation, but I can probably set the recorder output EQ up, leave it alone, and then just use the "monitor" EQ to adjust for loudness. Seems like I would want to re-adjust the monitor EQ if I was to pack my gear up and take it somewhere else anyway, so it shouldn't be a big deal, I just would not want to be fiddling around with something that globally affects the sound going to the DAW.

[Hellbat]

I have checked out the QSC HPR122I at a local dealer (not with an axefx, just as a PA speaker) and they sound devastating. Built like tanks and just really great flat frequency response. The Mackie SRM series seem like toys in comparison.

[roodyrocker]

I have checked out the QSC HPR122I at a local dealer (not with an axefx, just as a PA speaker) and they sound devastating. Built like tanks and just really great flat frequency response. The Mackie SRM series seem like toys in comparison.

Thats what I use, the QSC HPR 122i. I bought one new then later found a good used one so I picked that up for stereo use and saved some monwey I think these sound much better than when I went through a Mesa 2:90 power amp and Mesa 4x12 cab. The QSC/Axe Fx combo sounds better at bedroom volume as well as live. When I gig the Axe Fx I use only one QSC and there is no problem with volume or filling up the stage or whatever you want to call it. I don't know much about using IR's either, this is just with Axe Fx patches