BBE Sonic Maximizeror EQ Debate!!

[jgcable]

There are lots of debates online as to whether or not the BBE Sonic Maximizer is nothing more than a 2 band EQ and if compared to a good EQ the EQ would be the better choice for guitar because of the added flexibility.
Some say that the BBE splits the frequencies and "retimes" them so that there is more bottom and sparkling highs but some say that this results in a scooped midrange. Others say that an EQ is a better choice even if its only a 7 band Boss or a 10 band MXR put in the loop of an amp.

What do you guys think?

[Hellbat]

I use a 10 band EQ & the BBE sonic stomp in my loop. The BBE isn't just eq, there is multiband compression and time alignment (delay) going on in there too. I go between using it and not using it myself but probably 80% of the time it's on, the low countour is great for adding some thump in without getting mud. Gentle use of the process knob is key for exploiting this pedal.

[Axegrinder87]

What's a maximizeror?

[Sharkfin]

I've never used one so I can't say anything about it. However, I was curious about the BBE SM and recently say this video on the tube about it. I did find it to be informative sooo I thought I'd pass it along.

[jgcable]

I am thinking about buying one. Either a rack mount or that stomp version. I probably owned a few of them in the past and don't remember!
The before and after clips online are fairly impressive. I am thinking one would give my Rivera a nice little needed bottom end boost.

[Hellbat]

I've never used one so I can't say anything about it. However, I was curious about the BBE SM and recently say this video on the tube about it. I did find it to be informative sooo I thought I'd pass it along.

Interesting video that confirms some of my experience (noticing the loss of bass when it was bypassed in the loop) but he doesn't explore the time/phase side of things and basically just looks at frequency. While I appreciate that BBE has a lot of marketing hype, this guy says a lot of stuff that shows he's basically out there as a 'negative marketer'. Things like "I assure you no professional studio uses one of these" and "I prefer to call it a sonic minimizer" show he's set aside time to just film an assassination of it, not provide an objective review.

[jdr94]

It depends on how your amp takes it is my opinion. Had a crate bv which worked great with it. But using it with my mesa dual rec it made it sound "processed". When I had a hafler t3 I ran it to a gmajor, a 31band eq,to a bbe, then a mesa 50/50 and it sounded awesome.

[roodyrocker]

I am thinking about buying one. Either a rack mount or that stomp version. I probably owned a few of them in the past and don't remember!
The before and after clips online are fairly impressive. I am thinking one would give my Rivera a nice little needed bottom end boost.

I'm not sure I can answer what the Sonic Maximizer does exactly but I did use one with my ADA MP-1 back in the day. At the time I used the BBE Sonic Maximizer 422A rack version and liked it. In fact every now and then I would keep changing the settings on it and found more settings that sounded good. I still have that BBE 422. Years later I tried the pedal version through my Mesa Dual Recto and quickly sold it. If you're going to use a BBE, I'd suggest looking for an older rack mount 422 rather than the Sonic Stomp version.
I'm just finishing up wiring a rack with Marshall JMP-1 and ADA MP-1 rack stuff and this time around I'm using old rack mount MXR EQ's with them rather than the BBE. I'll find out soon enough if the MXR EQ works better than the BBE 422 or not

[sambencuda]

Hey John, I've got a rack version if you want it. It made everything I owned sound better except the Fireball. It just doesn't need it. Trade me a pedal or something for it. It's a 482. I also have a Monster power supply and an OSP 12 space 12" inch deep shock rack case with wheels if you want to trade anything else. The case is brand new. Let me know.

[Nimitz]

I use a 10 band EQ & the BBE sonic stomp in my loop.

Used to do the same thing, worked very well together.

[dvscool]

I actually had one of these in my rack "back in the day" as well. I never had a multiband EQ to compare it with, but it made everything sound pretty fuckin good I have to say. At the time, it was almost a cliché to use one cause just about every shredder/mothafucka on the circuit I played used one. As a result we all had a similar tone !! Having said that, it really does bring just about any tone it touches to life. If memory serves....

[javert]

Interesting video that confirms some of my experience (noticing the loss of bass when it was bypassed in the loop) but he doesn't explore the time/phase side of things and basically just looks at frequency.

I didn't watch the whole thing, but his software does show phase response which should reveal the "time alignment". However, I am sceptical of this way of analyzing the functionality of the maximizer as, as has been mentioned, there is likely some nonlinear stuff going on like compression, and that is not going to be easy to analyze in the manner he does here. The spectrum can be used to see the filtering effect of the unit and people with extensive experience with spectral analysis can probably detect nonlinear processing from it, but it's generally not a good way.

While I appreciate that BBE has a lot of marketing hype, this guy says a lot of stuff that shows he's basically out there as a 'negative marketer'. Things like "I assure you no professional studio uses one of these" and "I prefer to call it a sonic minimizer" show he's set aside time to just film an assassination of it, not provide an objective review.

Yeah, there's certainly a bunch of marketing bullshit surrounding these things, and I'm a bit sceptical about its use in certain applications like in reproduction systems. However, I do think it makes sense in the context of other nonlinear processing like guitar amps where a lot of nonlinear stuff is already going on.

[javert]

I forgot to say that I use one myself.

Perhaps I should do a student project aimed at exploring and modeling the behavior of these units... that would be interesting.

[tonemonster]

I use a 10 band EQ & the BBE sonic stomp in my loop..

I did that too for a while, then I found everything to just be too much shit going on. I stripped down my pedal board to the bare essentials and I like it alot better. Just too many variables in the setup. your twistin knobs for days. I eventually got fed up with it all, and started from the ground up and got alot better sound. but to each his own, alot of folks swear by them. I used to use the rack unit in my rack wiht my JMP-1 as well, but now I only use it on the clean sound in there. the gain sounds I just dont use it anymore. it sounds more natural and "amp like" without it. call me kooky, but thats how it goes sometimes.

[Hellbat]

I did that too for a while, then I found everything to just be too much shit going on. I stripped down my pedal board to the bare essentials and I like it alot better. Just too many variables in the setup. your twistin knobs for days. I eventually got fed up with it all, and started from the ground up and got alot better sound. but to each his own, alot of folks swear by them. I used to use the rack unit in my rack wiht my JMP-1 as well, but now I only use it on the clean sound in there. the gain sounds I just dont use it anymore. it sounds more natural and "amp like" without it. call me kooky, but thats how it goes sometimes.

I hear you. Sometimes I just plug straight in and unplug the loop and I can dial in a great tone no problem. But sometimes I really dig that smooth processed sound all the stuff in the loop gives me too.