Modeling vs Tube amps live

[roodyrocker]

Again, it depends on which modeler and how it's set up. My old Line 6 Pod Pro no, my Axe Fx Ultra yes I've played it in a two guitar band live and it does just fine

[jgcable]

Why exactly was your rig supposed to be louder?

It had to be louder in order for me to hear it. His Rectifier was at less volume but it had so much more presence than the Vetta live.

[xenophobe]

It had to be louder in order for me to hear it. His Rectifier was at less volume but it had so much more presence than the Vetta live.

His settings are probably fucked. You can get some great low end with tube amps, more than you should have if you're actually playing band instead of playing yourself in a little room.

People tend to get offended if you tell them right off the bat that their eq is bad or they're running way too much gain. You have to record it, either audio or video and show them. I dunno how many bands I've been in with at least one person with either a totally fucked rig or one they don't know how to use...

[catzodellamarina]

I've owned 3 Line 6 amps: Spider, PodPro, and their first big 212 bastard I think called Ax2. All were super cool at home and playing along to tapes/cds. Live, they were thin and got lost in the mix. No matter what I did, they never sounded hearty when used live. I can excuse the Spider because it was a 112 and I used it only a couple shows when I was still shopping for a new tube rack. I had high expectations for the PodPro combined with my tube power amp. It was a feedback mess on stage and I lost my patience trying to dial it in. I sold it the next week.

Today I'm Line 6 free but if I had to buy another, it would probably be the 40 watt Bogner powered combo. It would be for home use, and I'd only take it live in an emergency.

[markD]

i DO like the bogner alchemist....i have only played it in the store, but it seems like it would be a very usable amp.

[Cygnus X1]

The Alchemist has a bad rep amongst the amp repair crowd I hang out with.
They are poor quality.

[markD]

THAT would explain why i see them so cheap on craig's list. thanks for the heads up!!

[Cygnus X1]

Just passing it along.
Otherwise, Bogner has a great rep, kickass amps.

[roodyrocker]

Let me put this another way. Just as not all modelers are equal neither are all tube amps. Just as an Axe Fx is a much higher quality piece than a Line 6, something like a Bogner or Soldano etc... is in a much different category than a B52 although both are tube amps. There are varying degrees of both.

[xenophobe]

I'll say it again but in a different way... it's up to the user to make settings gig-worthy. Both tube and modeling amps can be a disaster in the wrong hands. As has been said Line 6 is geared and marketed towards new users, which means a lot of beginners who don't know how to keep their eq in the proper frequencies. Most beginners want that chugga chugga sound from their favorite NU Metal band and steal far more dynamic range than they should have. Either that or the bassist completely compensates and goes mid-range. I had to do that in a band, and fortunately it somewhat worked. I would have rather just kept the low end like I should have but I had issues stealing that from the guitarist. His mids were scooped so badly that once I adjusted literally everything, it sounded pretty good. I had to completely work around a bad eq because the guitarist loved his tone too much. Oh, and my bass rig is pretty badass. I'd usually steal the show.

[Chief_CrazyTalk]

I am not a fan of boutique amps and don't use EQs or effects. I use simple tube amps and good speakers cabinets. But I would agree with the above opinions on EQing an amp correctly for live ensemble situtations. I know when I was a kid, I used a Boogie w the graphic EQ set to maximum gain and classic scooped-V EQ and thought it sounded great. It did at home but not playing with a band. I hated the way that amp sounded turned up. Loud yes but not in a good way.

Back then I used to jam LPs on my dad's component stereo system and of course, everything sounded better using the "V" EQ setting...until I tried recording to tape with it. It surprised me how much of the sound disappeared.

I only play at home these days but I still go for the classic Marshall sound. I think everyone likes low end but I try to keep mine where it belongs. I use mainly a 50W JCM800 or a 74 Super Bass through two greenback 412s. No effects other than a pretty flat boost, and most of the controls above 6. I think this gets me there. With the 100W non-MV I have no problem hearing and feeling everything I'm doing. Consider the fact that greenbacks top out around 5KHz LOL!

I think simple is better. I'm not one to try and discredit the latest digital innovations. They are amazing for sure, just not for me.

Fact: I won my dream job by answering correctly when asked whether I was an analog or digital guy.

[javert]

I think simple is better. I'm not one to try and discredit the latest digital innovations. They are amazing for sure, just not for me.

Fact: I won my dream job by answering correctly when asked whether I was an analog or digital guy.

Heh, I always thought it was stupid when recruiters based their assessment on the answer to questions like that (you know, some favorite trick question that they think is really clever). I'd rather hear the reasoning behind whatever answers I get. That tells me more about the person I'm considering hiring. For example, I wouldn't hire somebody who make gross generalizations without being able to back them up.

Just curious, what is your dream job? There aren't many jobs left in analog hardware, especially not anything to do with signal processing as we are discussing here. I imagine that in some parts of communication (e.g., antenna design, front-ends) electroacoustics (e.g., loudspeakers) and power electronics there are still some jobs.

As for simple, in many cases today, the simplest (and cheapest) solution is to use some standard digital platform and a standard algorithm. What is simple also depends on your point of view. A friend of mine just bought a Laney Ironheart. I was surprised to learn that it has a builtin digital reverb rather than a spring reverb.

[xenophobe]

I was surprised to learn that it has a builtin digital reverb rather than a spring reverb.

Most likely because the chip was far cheaper than sourcing the spring.

[javert]

Yes, that's what I'm thinking too. Plus, it's also comparably easy to make a good digital reverb.

[javert]

During the spring, a GE vacuum tube factory was up for sale for a pittance. They linked to the ad from the local engineering society's news page as a curiosity... not a lot of money in that stuff anymore.