Anybody use in ear wired monitors/ headphone amps?

[tomanyjacksons]

My band is wanting to go to in ear monitors for gigs. To keep cost down we want to go with a wired system/ headphone amp. This is new to me. I've been looking at a few headphone amps and I have no knowledge of them other than what Iv'e read on gear selling sites like MF. I was wondering how well they work. As far as what I've found so far is the Rolls RA62c 6 channel, a Nady HPA-8 8 channel and a Pre Sonus HP60 6 channel. They'res only 4 of us but we want room to expand if we get a keyboard player or another guitar, so more than 4 channels is a must. Are they're any that I should look at? Thanks for the help in advance.

[tomanyjacksons]

Bump?

[Mr Sandman]

Aussie band `Cold Chisel` uses them so they must be pretty good...
Don`t know exactly what it is but it`s an `in the ear ` job.

That`s all I can tell ya, check the vid out if you want.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdVRNDnTKTU

[RockCity]

My band is wanting to go to in ear monitors for gigs. To keep cost down we want to go with a wired system/ headphone amp. This is new to me. I've been looking at a few headphone amps and I have no knowledge of them other than what Iv'e read on gear selling sites like MF. I was wondering how well they work. As far as what I've found so far is the Rolls RA62c 6 channel, a Nady HPA-8 8 channel and a Pre Sonus HP60 6 channel. They'res only 4 of us but we want room to expand if we get a keyboard player or another guitar, so more than 4 channels is a must. Are they're any that I should look at? Thanks for the help in advance.

We went to them last year and they work great- I can hear "EVERYTHING" in the mix now....Really helps on stage. We use the four channel Shure set up but its a straight up metal/rock band so not too worried about keys etc. I would tell you to use wireless if at all possible, it will be difficult to manage the wires accross a stage but either way, you'd be happy with the mix you hear through the in-ears.

[tomanyjacksons]

Everybody else other than the bass player has stated they only want wireless. I want wireless too, but looking at price tags of the systems I know about, I'm blown away $$$$$. Any ideas on wireless systems that are good that won't break the bank.

[xenophobe]

Everybody else other than the bass player has stated they only want wireless. I want wireless too, but looking at price tags of the systems I know about, I'm blown away $$$$$. Any ideas on wireless systems that are good that won't break the bank.

For in-ear monitors? Those are multichannel deals, they generally aren't cheap. I've tried using them, I had a hard time adjusting and never did get used to them. I didn't have enough time with them though. They're expensive. A good wireless system for your guitar or bass isn't cheap either. I'm sure Behringer or some other brand makes cheap ones. Try looking around.

[tomanyjacksons]

We had a show last night and we have 1 in ear Carvin set of a transmitter and a receiver that the drummer used. Our stage volume was so ridiculously loud. My head is still pounding and my ears are still ringing. Our drummer is heavy handed anyways and the addition of him not being able to hear how loud he was just worsened the situation. At the show on breaks the rest of the guys tossed around the idea of a drum surround, which in my opinion is not really a fix. I called our sound guy this morning with a plan I came up with after the show when I was trying to get to sleep and my ears were still ringing so loud that it kept me awake. Tell me what you guys think of it. I told him to push his drums in his monitor mix a bit more than normal and when he says he can't hear everything else just tell him that he needs to lighten up on the drums. Our stage volume was so loud last night just to overcome the drums, that our sound guy turned the mains all the way down when a lady came over to ask if he could turn it down a little bit and he said you could hardly here a difference. Please help......

[xenophobe]

We had a show last night and we have 1 in ear Carvin set of a transmitter and a receiver that the drummer used. Our stage volume was so ridiculously loud. My head is still pounding and my ears are still ringing. Our drummer is heavy handed anyways and the addition of him not being able to hear how loud he was just worsened the situation. At the show on breaks the rest of the guys tossed around the idea of a drum surround, which in my opinion is not really a fix. I called our sound guy this morning with a plan I came up with after the show when I was trying to get to sleep and my ears were still ringing so loud that it kept me awake. Tell me what you guys think of it. I told him to push his drums in his monitor mix a bit more than normal and when he says he can't hear everything else just tell him that he needs to lighten up on the drums. Our stage volume was so loud last night just to overcome the drums, that our sound guy turned the mains all the way down when a lady came over to ask if he could turn it down a little bit and he said you could hardly here a difference. Please help......

In-ear monitors won't help that. Your drummer needs to lighten up. Pillows in the bass drums.... no skins on the bottom of his toms? I dunno, I'm not a drummer but a good drummer knows how to do that crap.

[tomanyjacksons]

Hey xeno, yeah. I"ve been trying to get him to switch to electric drums for small bar gigs. But "they have no dynamics and I won"t use them". Evidently electric drums equals all hell breaks loose in a bar where all of the talent scouts are looking for the next big drummer. Sorry guys for the straggling rant. I'm just frustrated about not knowing what to do.

[roodyrocker]

I have no experience with wired monitor in ears. However I do have a wireless in ear monitor setup that I use occassionally. The reason I don't use it all the time is that sometimes we run our own PA system and without a dedicated sound man its tough to use them. But on the occassions I did use the in ears it was fantastic! I could have him give me any mix I wanted at a manageable volume. The wireless system I use is a Sennheiser. These systems come with generic foam type ear pieces but to truly use this type of system I had a set of custom molded ear buds made with dual drivers in them. The foam ones that come with the system don't seal as well as custom molded ones of course, plus the dual drivers help the sound tremendously. These systems aren't cheap but they work great! I would suggest everyone in your band buy their own wireless in ears rather than using a wired system for everyone. BTW, I could still "feel" the thump of the drums and bass on stage using the in ears and I think if your drummer had custom molded in ears with a good mix, he'd probably lighten up without thinking about it. They would sound loud to him and he would feel the drums too. If he was using those generic foam ones then he probably heard a muffled sound and thats why he was pounding the drums harder.

[AdRock]

Hey xeno, yeah. I"ve been trying to get him to switch to electric drums for small bar gigs. But "they have no dynamics and I won"t use them". Evidently electric drums equals all hell breaks loose in a bar where all of the talent scouts are looking for the next big drummer. Sorry guys for the straggling rant. I'm just frustrated about not knowing what to do.

So you basically have a drummer that doesn't give a shit about anybody but himself. Personally I'd tell him to up his talent to include playing to the venue, or just find someone else. When stage volume cripples a sound man like that you're fucked no matter where you play. Getting in ears is not going to help anything really. Its a band aid on a gunshot wound. Ive been a sound guy for about 15 years now and I've run into a ton of guys that have your drummers attitude and are unwilling to change when needed. They just hurt the band as a whole and it will cost you gigs.

How many members are there and how do you setup your amps on the stage? There might be a way to move things around a little and have a big benefit from it.

[jgcable]

Hard to mix live, wireless is pretty much mandatory if you play live and stand up. Wired is for orchestral musicians who sit for an entire gig.
My experience with them is they take a while to get used to and you need a really good monitor mix.
I also felt that they "disconnect" you from your live sound and from the audience.
They are great if you are lip syncing to a track or singing over a backing track or backing vocal.

[Endrik]

tomany, electric drums or muffing acoustic drums is not a good solution, the sound, the dynamics and overall feel do suffer.

Let your drummer play with the headphones but so that he only hears overheads, then he will realize how much noise he is making. And make him record his practicing with only one microphone.

You see the problem is very common, today's drummers including A class pros, play the cymbals too loudly. The way drums are recorded in the studio and mixed live since the late 60's has made drummers crappier dynamic wise. Since then, drum mix has become more dependent on close micing which allows drummers to bash the shit out of cymbals. Earlier times, when they used 1 mic on the drumset, that kind of playing was impossible because it would have ruined to whole mix. We all know how heavily Bonham played but he went relatively easy on the cymbals, he didn't use closed mics in the studio, he mixed the drumset by himself by playing with the correct volume.

I love heavy handed drumming but bashing the cymbals is stupid, just unnecessary washy noise. The power comes from the drums not bashing trebly metal sheets. The worst case is when some metal drummers buy the brightest sounding cymbals and beat the living shit out of them including the china (which should be played at ease) but are complete pussies when it comes to hitting the drums.

Drums themselves can be played relatively loud... depends of the venue and situation... It's elementary that a decent drummer can play with the same energy at different volume levels. The loudness comes how fast you throw the stick with the wrist, any kind of Rambo-eque muscle maneuvering is simply wrong playing technique. Just look how those Rambo drummers who move their arms too much are constantly in the hospital for yet another surgery while great drummers play until they are in the grave with any kind of speed and volume level with total looseness in the arms.

Just let him hear how much noise he is making, he should understand what the others feel. Using darker and not too heavy/thick cymbals is good for the ears too (not too dark unless you play old school swing).

I think drummers should start playing like classical musicians, with sheet music which includes dynamic markings. For example when it's heavy rock then the kick and snare are marked with ff (fortissimo) but the hi-hat/ride/other cymbals mp (mezzo-piano) or something like that.

I'm becoming more and more demanding when it comes to dynamic control for drummers, when I play live I don't care about monitors or headphones, I want to hear all instruments on the stage, only the vocals come from the monitors. So the last thing I want to hear is some loud, annoying washy shit when I'm playing live.

[markD]

So you basically have a drummer that doesn't give a shit about anybody but himself. Personally I'd tell him to up his talent to include playing to the venue, or just find someone else. When stage volume cripples a sound man like that you're fucked no matter where you play. Getting in ears is not going to help anything really. Its a band aid on a gunshot wound. Ive been a sound guy for about 15 years now and I've run into a ton of guys that have your drummers attitude and are unwilling to change when needed. They just hurt the band as a whole and it will cost you gigs.

How many members are there and how do you setup your amps on the stage? There might be a way to move things around a little and have a big benefit from it.

+1

one of the things that helped my band become as successful as we were was because we weren't too loud. the soundman had control of our sound. HE made us loud. we sounded good too. in-ears won't help. they are most effective in rooms with bad acoustics and poor monitor systems.

[tomanyjacksons]

So you basically have a drummer that doesn't give a shit about anybody but himself. Personally I'd tell him to up his talent to include playing to the venue, or just find someone else. When stage volume cripples a sound man like that you're fucked no matter where you play. Getting in ears is not going to help anything really. Its a band aid on a gunshot wound. Ive been a sound guy for about 15 years now and I've run into a ton of guys that have your drummers attitude and are unwilling to change when needed. They just hurt the band as a whole and it will cost you gigs.

How many members are there and how do you setup your amps on the stage? There might be a way to move things around a little and have a big benefit from it.

No, he gives a shit yes. He's not been playing all of his adult life like the rest of us. He's a good drummer he's just very aggressive and I believe the that once we all have in ear monitors it can be mixxed so that he will bring down his acoustic volume. I know electric drums do take some of the magic off of their sound but I think it's going to help him out alot. As far as getting another drummer, not a chance we have been in bands together off and on for several years. He's one of those guys that will always without a doubt have your back when shit hits the fan and he's one of my bro's. He's always saying that he's still learning to which I reply, same here I always learn something. We went to watch a couple local bands that we are good friends with and we got a chance to talk about the noise levels on stage and he felt really bad and decided we can try an electric set of drums. I had explained to him how bad my head hurt after the second set and couldn't even here a monitor that was 3 feet in front of me that our sound guy tried his damndest to keep it where I could hear it. Needless to say he's actually willing to give the effort once his feelings being hurt feeling subsided.


Now to how we setup. In bars we are crammed pretty close together. drums in the back with bass on one side guitar on the other and our singer up in front. When we play outside we spread out like we can't stand the smell of one another, but with the same basic setup. The bass player and I have our amps directly behind us, indoor gigs I turn mine down far enough it can't be heard by me and the bass player runs a line straight to the board with a cab and he turns down also. We want a quite stage, I'd like to have it so quiet up there that we only one in ear monitor and still hear perfectly. Which I know is ridiculous but just saying.

Yeah we've had complaints about the volume levels and although it hasn't cost us any gigs as of yet, I'm sure it won't take long for that too happen.


Carvin in ear monitors any good?

Thanks to everyone so far as you've been a great help in so many ways.