The official don't buy this amp if you play at home list...

[slo100]

You can easily tell by the input jacks oriented vertically (JMP/early JCM800) or horizontally (PC board construction). Even on those amps while a broken pot would necessitate removing the board...it is only a single board. That 6100 I was looking at had multiple PC boards that had to be removed which meant a lot of extra labor. I had a Soldano SP77 Preamp a while back and broke a pot. That was board mounted construction and it was not too bad to switch in a new one.

Check the differences:

Old JMP/Early JCM 800 style


Newer design board mounted JCM800 style


6100

[jgcable]

Marshall 2203/4 amps changed in the early 80's from flying lead to board mounted pots and jacks. These have been proven to be work horses for professionals, amateurs, and basement warriors for decades now. I definitely agree that the board mounted stuff is much harder to fix. I almost bought a Marshall 6100 a few weeks ago from CL on the cheap. It was a 6L6 version and I wanted EL34. To convert that sucker was going to be a $200 bill + tubes due to a multitude of changes and the complexity of getting around the many boards in that amp. The good deal would have turned into a not so great deal after all that.

Similar to the 'is it a live or bedroom amp' I believe it comes to the individual's user requirements. Marshall (and many others) counts on people shelling out money for emotional reasons vs. practical use reasons...so does Ferrari. People who have the means and the will to buy a 100W full stack to put in the basement have and always will do so because it is what they want and need to fulfill whatever is driving that need. Many boutique amp makers tout their military spec designs and build quality eschewing board mounted components. Many people who buy these amps will never see a tour much less a stage across town. Again...practical requirements are not always buying criteria.

I didn't know that . I thought that all the 2203/4's were flying lead mount design. Interesting.

[slo100]

Marshall 2203/4 amps changed in the early 80's from flying lead to board mounted pots and jacks. These have been proven to be work horses for professionals, amateurs, and basement warriors for decades now. I definitely agree that the board mounted stuff is much harder to fix. I almost bought a Marshall 6100 a few weeks ago from CL on the cheap. It was a 6L6 version and I wanted EL34. To convert that sucker was going to be a $200 bill + tubes due to a multitude of changes and the complexity of getting around the many boards in that amp. The good deal would have turned into a not so great deal after all that.

Similar to the 'is it a live or bedroom amp' I believe it comes to the individual's user requirements. Marshall (and many others) counts on people shelling out money for emotional reasons vs. practical use reasons...so does Ferrari. People who have the means and the will to buy a 100W full stack to put in the basement have and always will do so because it is what they want and need to fulfill whatever is driving that need. Many boutique amp makers tout their military spec designs and build quality eschewing board mounted components. Many people who buy these amps will never see a tour much less a stage across town. Again...practical requirements are not always buying criteria.

[PowerTube]

This thread was giving me JVM G.A.S., then I read about the build quality (or lack thereof) and visited the JVM forum and see how nearly everybody is modifying their amps. My G.A.S. has subdued a bit. But I'd still like to try one sometime.

I finally got to plug into one, a JVM205H, the 50-watt head. I'm hooked. Although, I'll probably go with the JVM410H because it's not that much more expensive used. We'll see.

[Chad]

This thread was giving me JVM G.A.S., then I read about the build quality (or lack thereof) and visited the JVM forum and see how nearly everybody is modifying their amps. My G.A.S. has subdued a bit. But I'd still like to try one sometime.

[jgcable]

Agreed. One shot to a pot not only busts the control but also potentially the board behind it and it's not as easy to fix. However, you're going to pay for that vs ease of manufacture.

Which is a damn shame. Its just my opinion but players who buy 50 and 100w tube amps that were obviously designed for live use would have no problem spending more money for an amp that was built better. As soon as I see black plastic jacks or PC mount pots I stay away unless its an amp that's just going to sit home with the volume on 2. The sad thing is I bet 90% of all the JCM2000's and the JVM's do just that. I guess Marshall is smart to cut every quality corner they can.

[Grandturk]

Agreed. One shot to a pot not only busts the control but also potentially the board behind it and it's not as easy to fix. However, you're going to pay for that vs ease of manufacture.

[jgcable]

Try to youtube a "marshall factory tour" - there's a homemade vid that a visitor to the Marshall factory made and you get some real detailed shots of them making the JVM boards through the solder machine and showing it up pretty close. It looks like a typical modern amp board with lots of surface mount and pots right on the board.

My opinion is that PC board mounted pots and those plastic PC board mounted 1/4" jacks are a giant point of failure when subjecting an amp to the rigors of gigging or touring. If your careful.. they are fine. If you happen to hit one while loading or unloading or if you happen to yank hard sideways on a cord that is plugged into one of those plastic jacks you could be in trouble. I think its mandatory that a touring/gigging amp should have flying leads on high quality pots and flying leads on high quality Switchcraft or Neutrik 1/4" jacks.

[Grandturk]

They do make several very high quality amps though. I would like to see a gut shot of the JVM because I agree.. it really sounds good.

Try to youtube a "marshall factory tour" - there's a homemade vid that a visitor to the Marshall factory made and you get some real detailed shots of them making the JVM boards through the solder machine and showing it up pretty close. It looks like a typical modern amp board with lots of surface mount and pots right on the board.

[jgcable]

I have heard several of the JVM Marshall's and I was actually impressed with what I heard, online clips and guys using them live...granted I have not played through them but I could see them being very useable, event at lower volume levels. What I'm not too sure on theses days is build qualities and reliability of the newer Marshalls.

I would think if its primarily used at home they are fine. Hard gigging... I wouldn't be confident unless I had a road case for the heads. PC mount pots and jacks always scare me... along with thin PC boards and low quality tube sockets. Most of the new production Marshalls seem to be built this way.
They do make several very high quality amps though. I would like to see a gut shot of the JVM because I agree.. it really sounds good.

[Shawn Lutz]

I have heard several of the JVM Marshall's and I was actually impressed with what I heard, online clips and guys using them live...granted I have not played through them but I could see them being very useable, event at lower volume levels. What I'm not too sure on theses days is build qualities and reliability of the newer Marshalls.

[P I K A]

I agree with John (JG) .Seems he isn't saying don't buy a tube amp for home but don't buy these particular amps for home. Especially if you are never going to use them like they were meant to be used. Its a wste of money. I gig with an EVH 5153 but at home I have a small blackstar and a bogner pedal. I know a professional guitarist that earns his living solely on touring and he plays Splawns and Marshalls live yet has a flextone at his house. Everybody has different ideas of good tone thats why there are Marshall guys and Mesa guys. I had an engl fireball that sounded good low but not as good as loud. If it were me and I had to have tubes for only playing at home I'd get an el84 amp and push that with an overdrive

[PowerTube]

First, I'm glad to hear that the JVM appears that its going to do it for you PowerTube. Now back to our other arguments while some of these high powered tube amps may not be the best option for a novice intending to play them at bedroom levels, its very inaccurate to say you shouldn't use them for anything but full out, cranked volume live gigs. Obviously many of us here have done it including myself. If I listened to what was typed here I would never have owned a SLO, Quick Rod, various Marshalls, etc. Others have done it as well such as Shawn Lutz. Also, the car analogies don't really work here either. A 200 mph Ferrari is still capable of idling around town if that's what you want to do with it. Or at least most are anyway. Ive rode in a very steerable 900 hp Mustang before. And no, it was not like pulling a couple spark plugs out and neutering it into a rough running 6 cylinder. Bottom line is still if it sounds good to you then its good regardless of how expensive or cheap it is or whether you run pedals or go direct into the amp. The right attenuator is ok to use as is a 100w amp if you know what you're doing with it. Just let your ears be the judge

Thanks. I must say that I was quite impressed with the JVM205H,and this was at a volume level without a single bleeding ear in sight. Very pleasant and peaceful. From what I understand, this amp is a "compact" version of the JVM410H in the sense that the overdrive is voiced like only one of those on the 410 (OD1 or OD2, I forget). That's why I want the 410; it'll have it all. There's also no abrupt, obnoxious volume spike. It goes smoothly from whisper quiet to more (ahem) "substantial" volumes.

Good points about the car. My truck, a Nissan Titan, came stock from the factory with 317 horsepower, but since I added headers and UpRev tuning, it's in the vicinity of about 380-ish now. I can gently roll down the road with zero problems, but I can also rip the pavement if I feel the need.

That lower-volume tube preamp sound really does it for me.

[roodyrocker]

First, I'm glad to hear that the JVM appears that its going to do it for you PowerTube. Now back to our other arguments while some of these high powered tube amps may not be the best option for a novice intending to play them at bedroom levels, its very inaccurate to say you shouldn't use them for anything but full out, cranked volume live gigs. Obviously many of us here have done it including myself. If I listened to what was typed here I would never have owned a SLO, Quick Rod, various Marshalls, etc. Others have done it as well such as Shawn Lutz. Also, the car analogies don't really work here either. A 200 mph Ferrari is still capable of idling around town if that's what you want to do with it. Or at least most are anyway. Ive rode in a very steerable 900 hp Mustang before. And no, it was not like pulling a couple spark plugs out and neutering it into a rough running 6 cylinder. Bottom line is still if it sounds good to you then its good regardless of how expensive or cheap it is or whether you run pedals or go direct into the amp. The right attenuator is ok to use as is a 100w amp if you know what you're doing with it. Just let your ears be the judge

[PowerTube]

Another possibility: yours ears warmed up to the sound that the speaker was producing all along.

That's the first thing I thought but I was too polite to say it.

Seriously, that gets my vote.