Cabinet to go with Kemper Profiler help?

[XSvmbraDensX]

So I've been using an unpowered Kemper rack for a while now and I absolutely love it. Took it on the road back during the fall and it handled every gig like a champ and never gave me any problems whatsoever. The one problem I have been dealing with is the actual amplification issue. Back home when I gig with my band, I use an EV ZLX12P on top of a rolling rack that a friend built for me. Only downside to this rig is that the case that the Kemper and the ZLX live in is extremely big and heavy. Too much weight for one person to carry, in fact. On the road, I condensed my rig and added a Crown poweramp and ran that into a 70's Kustom 4x12 and that seemed to do the job at every venue we played. However, if we played any places where we were not mic'd, I really couldn't hear myself over the bassist(6x10) and the other guitarist(4x12+1x15 ). I do prefer the ease of use with a cabinet, especially since it's lighter, but I do like being able to use the Cabinets that are built into my profiles. I was kicking around the idea of the Gemini II since it seemed like just the answer I was looking for. Would doing the powered 2x12 give me more stage volume than my ZLX, and possibly my 4x12, even though it's only rated at 220w? Thanks for your input, guys!

[mantis]

A kemper models so many different amps it's really hard to suggest a cabinet. I guess it really depends on what you use it for the most.

If I had to buy a general cabinet that would do lots of different tones, I might lean towards the Mesa Boogie V30 Loaded models. They have a 1x12 2 x 12 and a 4 x 12 you pick what you need they all sound amazing from Cleans to death metal. Probably the most versatile cabinets out there.
I personally like the Vertical and Horizontal 2 x 12 cab's myself. If I ever decided a Kemper was my move, I would buy a Mesa cab.

[pianoguyy]

And I just signed out of the L6 site because I was tired of discussing "tone", lol.


If you are using a modeler, why are you being mic'd?
Also, if you are using a modeler, why are you worrying about stage volume - let the sound guy worry about that. You should be coming out of the same monitors that the vocals and keyboards come out of.

[Tetsuo]

Agreed with Piano Guy. Personally I just ordered a Xitone powered monitor for my AX8. I would suggest the powered monitor route if you are using the kemper. You will get a lot more out of the kemper if you are using the FRFR capabilities of if. Kinda like having a sports care and not being able to shift past third gear... the first three are great but there is more in there

[XSvmbraDensX]

I have been using an FRFR speaker but as I said in my initial post, I'm sometimes in scenarios where we are playing spots where we aren't being mic'd. My single 12" FRFR speaker isn't enough to keep up with the rest of the band at normal stage volume. I was looking at the Gemini II from mission engineering since it's an FRFR that's 2x12. At 220w I'm not sure if that's enough power.

[pianoguyy]

I am still confused.
You shouldn't be mic'd at all. You should be plugging direct into the pa. Guitar to Kemper to PA.

As to what sort of power you need on stage --- FRFR, like a PA, are typically very high watts. That is because they leave a lot of headroom in order to keep clarity.
Even though I don't fully understand why you are concerned about stage volume, you should be looking at a minimum of 400. OR, if you want to run stereo, you can do 200 and 200.
But, again, that is a minimum. If you need stage volume, you may want to consider 800.

[j2379]

I have an old metal grille Mesa 2x12 loaded w EVM12s. It holds it own next to almost any 4x12 and the EVs are very clear and handle a ton of power.

[markD]

I am with Pianoguy. You should always run your Kemper direct. Is that what you did whilst on tour?

Personally, I gig regionally and use a Helix rack. I bring my rack, controller and EVZLX12P speaker with me to every gig. The house monitors have been MORE than sufficient but I still put the EV behind me, or a little to the side to increase the spread of sound. My bassist uses a Mark Bass rig with 4x10 and 1x15 cabs. He runs direct too. Our stage sound is VERY clean and clear because of the DIs.

I have done one gig with the Helix where I couldn't run DI. I brought two amp stands, one for my rack and one for the EV. it got it up off the ground so the sound would project forward. I mean, the EVZLX12P has 1000 watts of Class D power. I had NO problem being heard - and my tone was still the way I wanted it to be.

[Jackson8090s]

So I've been using an unpowered Kemper rack for a while now and I absolutely love it. Took it on the road back during the fall and it handled every gig like a champ and never gave me any problems whatsoever. The one problem I have been dealing with is the actual amplification issue. Back home when I gig with my band, I use an EV ZLX12P on top of a rolling rack that a friend built for me. Only downside to this rig is that the case that the Kemper and the ZLX live in is extremely big and heavy. Too much weight for one person to carry, in fact. On the road, I condensed my rig and added a Crown poweramp and ran that into a 70's Kustom 4x12 and that seemed to do the job at every venue we played. However, if we played any places where we were not mic'd, I really couldn't hear myself over the bassist(6x10) and the other guitarist(4x12+1x15 ). I do prefer the ease of use with a cabinet, especially since it's lighter, but I do like being able to use the Cabinets that are built into my profiles. I was kicking around the idea of the Gemini II since it seemed like just the answer I was looking for. Would doing the powered 2x12 give me more stage volume than my ZLX, and possibly my 4x12, even though it's only rated at 220w? Thanks for your input, guys!

I don't have a Kemper yet but this caught my attention because I have been looking at them the last few days, imo it sounds like you should have got the powered unit..which is what I am leaning toward... haven't pulled the trigger yet , its a lot of money and I have to sell a couple amps to get the remaining 1,200 I need or work overtime.

Those who have em ... any regrets? I keep seeing posts about how digitized it sounds vs actual amps ... some of it sound likes sour grapes some leave me questing this decision.

[javert]

The Kempers sound great, in my opinion. My only gripe with the Kemper concept is that the profiles are only really accurate for the specific settings you made the profile at, which means you'd have to make a new profile if you wanted to change something, like the gain, or pre-EQ, etc. So, changing the EQ, gain, settings does not behave like the amp. Anyways, like I said, they sound great for the high gain stuff I do.

For one of my band's songs, I made a profile of my Engl rig (which has a modded preamp) and recorded parts of my guitars with the Kemper and other parts with the real thing. The guy who mixed the songs (who is an excellent guitar player himself) couldn't tell the difference.

One thing that's a pain in the ass is that there was (and still isn't?) any good editor for PC for handling all the presets.

I actually sold my Kemper because I wanted to try the Two Notes stuff (loadbox with cab+mic modeling) instead, since I have some nice amps, and that's what I'm using now. It sounds great. Most of my guitars on my band's upcoming album is recorded this way.

Many people seem to favor buying a separate poweramp for the Kemper. Most people claim the builtin one isn't anything special. I never used my Kemper in a live setting, but, if I were, I think I would go with a nice wedge monitor.

[pianoguyy]

I use L6, and I hear the same complaints "it sounds digital", but I do not have those complaints.
LOL, oh, wait - PIANO guyy. I also get the same complaints about a lot of the keyboards. But they are buying the $500 things sold at Wal-Mart, not the $15,000 ones I sell.


There can be a lot of "user error" when it comes to programming. Sometimes, believe it or not, the "fake" sound has more to do with the FX more than the amp. Hard gates and delays - they can really make things sound "digital".

I think one of the biggest issues that isn't user error is the fact that people are hearing things that they aren't usually hearing. A Marshall, cranked to 10, getting a beautiful cranked to 10 tube sound - but at a volume of 1 or 2. Hearing the "mic'd" sound that comes out of a pa instead of the guitar amp sound that they normally hear.

[straycat]

A Kemper came up for sale locally and I went to try it out.
I'll admit I was lost trying to figure it out.
When gear gets overly complicated I don't want it no matter how good people say they sound or how much it costs.

[pianoguyy]

A Kemper came up for sale locally and I went to try it out.
I'll admit I was lost trying to figure it out.
When gear gets overly complicated I don't want it no matter how good people say they sound or how much it costs.

Over on L6 we say this often --

Think of all of the amps and pedals you have ever owned. Add in a bunch of amps and pedals that you have never owned. Every brand. Every model.
Now, add in duplicates of everything - because you aren't limited to having/using just one at a time.
In your mind, make sure you include a patch bay and fx loop so that you can put any thing in any order.

So, now that you have all of that...

You have 20 minutes to dial in your dream tone.
With all of those options to choose from - Can you do it?


These things are replacing entire rigs. When you were building your rig, you bought one piece at a time. You added it to your rig. You worked on it. You tweaked. You changed stuff around and tried different things. Yes, correct, they are not plug-and-play devices. And the more advanced options, where you can virtually change virtual tubes inside of virtual tube amps, or selecting which microphone at which angle and which distance your want to mic the amp at ---- will drive you bonkers.

But, ultimately, I have quit loading up the milk truck with gear and replaced it one little pedalboard going into the trunk of a sports car.

[roodyrocker]

As someone who gigs with big amps, little amps, modelers, etc... as well as being on the other side, that is helping running sound for other bands locally I have learned a lot about the practicality of running some of these rigs live at local venues. First, I have played my Marshall Randy Rhoads 100w half stack and my Soldano SLO 100 live. They sound fantastic but on the Marshall I had to use an attenuator. The Soldano had to be turned down ridiculously low so I can't get in it in the sweetest spot. Therefore running a "real" amp live is a compromise at best. I have also used my Marshall JMP1 rack live. For this, I use the Two Notes Torpedo and use the power amp and mic'd cab sims direct to PA. I get what I need in my monitor wedge or better yet, I use my In Ear Monitors. That way I get whatever mix I want to hear from the sound man. He controls how loud it is through the PA to the audience. In situations where we run regular amps, we have not mic'd them in about 2+ years now. We either use the Torpedo Live or Palmer DI boxes to go to the PA. This has the added benefit of not picking up extraneous noise from drums and what not on stage when you mic a cab.
I have also used an Axe Fx Ultra before. I went into a powered QSC monitor on a pole next to me. That worked fine as well. Just picked up a powered Kemper and will be trying that out next once I learn my way around it.
From helping run sound for other bands I can tell you most guitarists are using stage volumes that are at least twice what they think they need. The sound man is always trying to get them to turn down the stage volume and let him turn up the house volume up front. Unfortunately most guitarists have never heard what their volume or tone sounds like out front. In most cases its way different than what they hear on stage. That's why a good sound man is important. I say use that Kemper's advantages. Run it into the PA then use either a monitor for yourself on stage or get some good In Ear Monitors. With IEM's your ears won't fatigue. As the night goes on and ears fatigue, people start playing harder and reaching back there for their amp's volume knob. BTW, our bass also runs direct to PA.

[MountainDog]

I have a Kemper powered head and think it is awesome. I play on a cover band, so I've always needed to have multiple tones to mimic the sounds of the song; cleans, cleans with chorus, boosted cleans, distortion tones (vintage/80's/metal) with options of chorus, delay, boost, etc. Rather than go the pedal route, I gravitated to modeling amps and was using Line 6 vetta combo with additional 2x12 cab for years Over the past 5 years I've also tried 'real' amps that had midi control options (Marshall JVM410H, Engl Powerball II) but needed external help with effects, noise gate etc. so that was a headache. Then I decided to go for the Kemper,but wanted the powered one so I could play through my Marshall 4x12 slant with G12H(55) 30W greenbacks.

The Kemper looks complicated, but I was up and running with great tones in an hour (it comes loaded with tons of presets). They have a rig manager where you can access 'rigs' (their term for presets) that people have put up on the web. You can click thru them and if you find one you like, it the store button. I found a few great tones that way. Then I profiled my Marshall and Engl and have those tones. Since I use my cabinet, I turn off the Kempers cabinet profile.

With the powered version thru the 4x12, I get the same experience as playing through my other amps, i.e., it feels real and correct.

I play Rhythm guitar in a band that has an awesome lead player, who shreds and plays through either Marshall or H&K tube heads (and to me he has a great guitar tone too), and everywhere we go, people comment to me how great our lead guitarist is, but then they tell me that my guitar tones are much better than his. I've also been approached at gigs by recording engineers that notice the Kemper and comment that they've recorded people using them and again, they would always complement me on my great and wide range of tones.

the cool thing is you can back up your sounds/settings on a thumb drive, so you'll neverlose anything. I went to a Gary Holt guitar clinic and there was a Marshall head and cabinet on stage, but I noticed a Kemper off to the side. I spoke to the store owner and he said Gary told him to have a Kemper available (and ESP guitar)..all Gary brought was his thumb drive to load his 'rigs'. The kemper line out went into the effects return of the Marshall, so the marshall was really just a power amp. There was. A camera guy with a long lens and I asked him to show me what the Kemper LCD said, and although I forget exactly now, the rig name was referencing Exodus and a desription of the tone.

I got mine through Sweetwater and deal with Randy Akins there (1-800-222-4700 x1299) and he worked with me and got a few hundred of their price so that helped.

Here's a good comparison between real and Kemper with Chappers and the Captian:

https://youtu.be/INJ_H5PiuTE

Here's Gary Holt clinic. About 40 minutes in he comments about the Kemper and later mentions it again:

https://youtu.be/14ZiBRFVe2I