VHT vs Diezel at low volume

[emaxxx]

I`ve got a VHT GP-3 preamp that i like much but now i have to sell some amps and make the final solution (but it`s harder for me to say this) that would be either a VHT Two-Fifty-Two or a Diezel Vh-4 head. Obviously if i buy the Diezel i have to sell the Gp-3. Either solution are the same price. I have to say that i play much and record at home and i need the best sound at low volume. The Gp-3 is quite good in that but i don`t know anything about the Diezel. I have also an attenuator but i prefer not over using it. I also have considered the fact that the Vht poweramp is 50 watt each side and probably is better working set low, than a 100w power section. The VHT has also a class-A option. The Diezel is tempting but probably the Vht solution could be more versatile. If anyone has played both, suggestions are really welcome.

Thanks all.

[StuTDavis]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

I'm not sure if you've considered the Herbert and scratched it off your list already, but personally I liked the overall sound and low volume sound better on it than the VH-4. If you like the VHT sound, the Herbert is definitely closer to that sound, in my book, than the VH-4.

The GP-3 didn't have a very heavy, thrashin' sound at lower volumes, to my ears. I didn't really crank it up, but I could tell that, personally, I'd have to add a few pieces of rack gear and probably a pedal in there to get "my sound" out of it.

The Herbert thrashed and screamed all the way down to extremely low volumes. Not 100% "my sound", but about the closest I've ever heard out of a head by itself.

The VH-4 was more of a nu-metal grunter, to my ears...darker sound and all. It kept its sound pretty decent down at low volumes, but not quite as well as the Herbert, from my time with it.

Stu

[ColdVayne]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

well i own both a Herbert and a VHT UL , and the Herbert sounds better low.

[ColdVayne]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

Why yes i am [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img] , but it took months of saved up paychecks to buy both of those [img]images/icons/cool.gif[/img] .

[slayer]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

CV, which sounds better cranked? Jack.

[ColdVayne]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

I use to be the biggest VHT fan , but when i got my herbert i was blown away. The herbert is a little more mid ranged and has more of a growl , while the VHT is ultra tight. If i had to pick i would have to say the Herbert , but the VHT is a close second.

[horns666]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

I love my Uber ...that's for sure!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

I wanna another one [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[emaxxx]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

thanks for the reply, but the Herbert is 180w and i think is too much. With my amps now i can use an attenuator, with the Herbert i probably can`t (the loadbox i have is 100w max). Also i`m not sure the Herbert still sounds good with mid distortion sounds (think ac-dc) at low volume.
Hasn`t the Vh-4 more flexibility with its 4 channels?
Anyway i will probably keep the Gp-3 and pair it with a two-fifty-two, this will probably give me an even more flexible rig.

[StuTDavis]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

And ColdVayne is one damn lucky MF! HAHAHA! [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Stu

[ColdVayne]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

The herbert , has a mid cut dial ,that can almost make you custom your sound.

[StuTDavis]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

The Herbert and VH-4 when I tried them side-by-side just had a completely different basic overall sound, to my ears.

The VH-4 was just a lot darker and overall thicker sound. It was closer in sound to Bill's Uberschall up there, or an H&K TriAmp, not as dark or gobbing with muddy gain like Mesas can be sometimes.

The Herbert, on the other hand, had a much more open sound about it, closer in the VHT-ultra-high-rev-Marshall kinda sound ballpark. I didn't try to get AC/DC out of it, but my guess is it could do a great job on that, being it seemed to have a more Marshall style edge vibe. Overall, I think that the basic tone of the Herbert is more flexible than the VH-4. It's much easier to darken a more open sounding amp like the Herbert if you wanted, than it is to open up the dark sound of something like the VH-4, in my experience. Just think about all the people who complain about their amp being "muddy"...very hard to clean that up sometimes. But, if you want to add mud or thickness, it's usually a simple EQ trick. Don't worry so much about the watts it's capable of, you could probably dial in a good metal sound playing this amp through a cab in your car at low enough volume someone standing outside wouldn't even hear you. I'm sure ColdVayne could tell you with more experience. But I've got a whole stack of rack gear going, trying to get what the Herbert can do at low volumes...I was completely impressed with that head. And this amp is INCREDIBLY sensitive...at those low volumes, it will still scream a lead atcha hehehe. No one amp I've personally ever heard or played has come anywhere close to what this amp does at those volumes.

The GP-3 I played was going through a 2-50-2 I believe, at the time. Ayup, you could get AC/DC out of it at low volumes, no problem there. If you want to get into, say, Metallica territory, it didn't even get close to my ears, at those lower volumes, anyway. What that preamp does better than most preamps is its feel. That control..."Dynamics", isn't it?...something like that...really does a great job on adding sensitivity and...well...dynamics, into the feel. If you can't afford the other options, plan on getting the 2-50-2 and adding some other units into your rack as well. You will probably come out a good bit cheaper than either of the Diezel amps in the long run, but probably with more work tweaking and trying other units with it.

And don't fool yourself, that 2-50-2 can be a very loud power amp. I've got one myself. The point is not what the amp CAN do, but what it HAS to do to get to the point where you want the sound and feel of your setup. Just because the Diezels CAN pump out a lot of watts doesn't make them impractical. When I was trying them--the Herbert in particular--I had it turned up only so high I had to to be able to hear it sitting right in front of it...and it sounded and felt really cool. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

Stu

[StuTDavis]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

If the GP-3 gets Pantera to your ears, thank your ears...it was nowhere near that sound to mine hehehe.

I don't know if the Herbert or the VP-4 would be better for you, that's up to you. Judge by the general difference in sound I described in the posts above, and decide what's generally closer to the sound you want/need.

I played the Diezel amps, as well as others (Bogner Uber for instance) at NAMM last year. There wasn't any opportunity for throwing an attenuator or yellow jackets in there hehehe. Nor was there any need to crank either of the Diezel amps to get a good metal sound out of them, either. I seriously don't think there's any need to even consider an attenuator with either of those amps, for any situation, and the only reason I'd think anyone would consider using yellow jackets with them would be if you just happened to want the EL84 flavor in the sound.

On the yellow jackets thing, though, I have the VHT 2-50-2 that you're considering getting, as well as a Mesa 20/20. I had the Mesa first, then got the VHT later. Personally, I liked the sound and feel of the Mesa better than the VHT, but I really like the sound altering features/controls on the VHT, and wanted to use its VHT-flavor openness for some specific sounds. Soooo...I got some yellow jackets and put them into the VHT, to try to get its EL84 sound and feel into the VHT. From the reactions from both THD and VHT, it seemed I was the first person they'd heard about wanting to try that hehehe. Worked like a perfect charm, and did the job just as I'd hoped. Now the VHT has much better sensitivity/feel, and it gets a better cranked low-end-OOMF at lower volume levels, like the Mesa. If you wanted to get the 2-50-2 for your GP-3, that'd be a great situation for getting the yellow jackets, considering you probably want some of the characteristics I was looking for. [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

Stu

[emaxxx]

Re: VHT vs Diezel at low volume

It`s good that you have played both.
So you think it`d be bettrer going with the Herbert? I still think that the Gp-3 has lot of gain. It`s not a problem for me, i can play Pantera with it. Have you tried the Herbert with some attenuator, or something like the YellowJackets, Tads...