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**slayer** · 01-01-2005, 09:27 AM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

The weird thing about wattage on amps is, I have heard 50 watt amps sound so much better and louder than some 100 watt amps. Sometimes it all depends on the amp itself really. Personally, I would rather have the wattage there if you nead it, so I would choose the 100 watter and they also seam to have a little more depth and low end when neaded. Jack.

**Shawn Lutz** · 01-01-2005, 10:23 AM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

I prefer the 50 watt amps and 100 watts is overkill for most clubs anyways. One really isnt a whole hell of a lot louder than the other but a 50 watter will break up a little earlier than a 100w thereby giving you warmer power tube distortion at a little less volume levels. 100 watts isn't eneeded unless you are on a stadium tour. Some people want the 100watters for the added headroom and punch fon the clean channel.

I have 2 50 watt amps and 2 100 watt amps and in most cases all of them can do what the other does regardless of additional 50watts

If you are getting a 100 watt amp look for one that has a 1/2 power switch.

**Cleveland Metal** · 01-01-2005, 12:22 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

Hmm, weird, The logic of going 50 watt is certainly there.

But for me, I've played a lot of amps over the years and I'll admit that most stuff I've played has been 100 watts for the most part. The main ones that were directly comparable were the 50 and 100 Marshall 800 stuff and I really lean to the 100 watter as I never really had a 50 watt marshall I liked much personally. But, of course they are all unique amps in that it's sometimes hard to find one you like at all, as they can be very different.

Anyways, I'd say if you can get the ENGL for the same pricing, DEFINITELY get the ENGL.

**Tooling** · 01-01-2005, 02:07 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

On the subject...I've just been jamming w/ my VHT 50CL. It has the most brutal clear distortion but that's for another thread. I've got some pretty extreme volume and settings feeding into a Bogner cab w/2 G12H30's and 2 V30's. I've got a brutal Slayer type of vibe going w/ the low mids pumping strong (the depth @ 1:00) and the master & channel volume at about 2:30...those that know this amp know that that is LOUD. At these volumes I don't know if it's my speakers or the amp being at its limit but it just loses it. The bass doesn't really hold up it just kind of scatters if that makes sense. Does this sound like a headroom issue or a speaker issue? As far as 100 vs. 50 watts....I think I would lean toward 100 watts if it was strictly for gigging although a 50 watt would do fine if mic'd. Normally I would say that NOTHING punches and thumps like a 100 watter....but man...these VHT heads are flat out brutal...they sound OK at low volume but let that baby breath and it will just floor you...I would be interested in hearing where a 100 watter would shine compared to my 50 watter as far as volume sweet spot.

**Shawn Lutz** · 01-01-2005, 02:34 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

Everything I have sounds better through a Bogner cab [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I used the Bogner 4x12 with my VHT for a while before I got the 101B, nice cab match too.. The 50 CL and a 2204 are great examples of cool 50 watters [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

**Cleveland Metal** · 01-01-2005, 02:45 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

Main things with me is that, for purposes of control, I like the clean un-altered headroom of a larger amp.

Yes, I also love power amp distortion. I really only enjoy it from a KT88 or 6550, but to get that requires some major volume. And that is really unfeasable. You can get it easier from an EL34 but I dislike their sound when distorted.

I've come to use preamp distortion mostly for the reason of control. Even with a 50 watt amp, distorting the power tubes is unfeasable really in most clubs. And the slight volume changes needed in different clubs played havoc with the dependability of my sound and what sonic preferences I needed/required night after night to do my gig consistantly. Tube amps have a volume related power tube G-spot and you can't always nail it because of the restraints of the venue.

The way I do it now, my sound is good, maybe not as cool as good power tube distortion, but it is duplicatable always.

Of course, the truly ideal way would be to dial your power tube distortion in, use a Palmer box to contain it, and amplify that output to whatever level needed with a solid state amp.

I miss the plug in a head and thrash days, but nowdays, things are too refined in clubs as far as volume restraints and trying to dial in a good overall "band" sound, and you can't be "amp's on ten" to get your "groove on" properly anymore.

**Tooling** · 01-01-2005, 03:27 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

Shawn....Bogner cabs are the friggin' cats pajamas aren't they...what speakers are in yours?

**axeman81** · 01-01-2005, 04:20 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

thanks for the input guys! [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img]
however..the jury is still out. I'll have to find a way to try a number of ENGL amps before I decide...

**Shawn Lutz** · 01-01-2005, 04:59 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

[ QUOTE ]
Shawn....Bogner cabs are the friggin' cats pajamas aren't they...what speakers are in yours?

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Mine just has the 4 V30's.

the Soldano cab I have has 4 frontloaded V30's and it is a big difference in the cab... the Bogner is the best cab I have, every amp sounds good with it so far. [img]/images/graemlins/headbang.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/headbang.gif[/img]

**Lordofgain** · 01-01-2005, 07:16 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

I would definately say that it depends on the individual amp period! As to 2x12 or cabs etc., nothing sounds better to my ears on stage than a 4x12.

**axeman81** · 01-10-2005, 04:03 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

resurrection time!

I only have access to the Blackmore head, any of you try the Screamer 50W head? it seems like the Blackmore's little brother so to speak.
While doing a search I found someone who were raving about their Screamer 12" combo...
I was thinking maybe to have the ENGL distributor bring my dealer a couple of heads and do a deal where I will commit to buy one of them + cab, but since he's in Denmark I doubt that will work out...
Spending this kind of money on a new rig I want to get it right the first time if ya know what I mean!

I'm gonna try the Blackmore with 4x12 V30 again on thursday then I guess we'll see...

**charvelguy** · 01-10-2005, 04:32 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

I prefer old non master Marshall JMP's...so I have preference for the 50 watter over the 100watt just for practicality. As stated in many posts..The 100w will offer more headroom, but just for the fact that I'm not going to push the amp on a stage where a 100watt would be manageable lest I am running it into an attenuator or controlling it through master vol. I'll end up running an attenator but them I have other concerns like the load I am putting on the amp by restraining it, instead of allow it to open up. Ideally, a VH setup like Cleve outlines would be the best way to go with these amps.

On a good night.. my 100w super lead got alot of compliments, and it was cleaner..but the 50w was able to hit the sweet spot more consistantly.
I like to run smaller cabs for clubs too...either a 2x12 or a 4x10 or a combination. A 4x12 always sounds fuller but some clubs allow the band a stage the size of a glorified bathroom. It just depends on the gig. A small club, I get by with a rack, with a couple preamps and a stereo poweramp into a 2x12 or two and let the PA and the soundman do their jobs-especially if you are running a full monitor mix.

IMO the best option is to select a model with power switching option in the power amp section. The Special looks loaded and very flexible.

When it comes to amps that have a switchable output/power amp section, master vol etc.... then yes, I go the higher wattage...just my .02.

**axeman81** · 01-10-2005, 05:10 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

thanks for the input charvelguy! [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]
I don't know how much the Special is but judging by similar features to the Savage 120 which is like $3200 here for just the head...it certainly won't come cheap, or even close to a Blackmore which is half of that. And the Screamer is like $200 less than a Blackmore or something.

Maybe I should just go for the Screamer 50 Combo, and mic it on stage...but then I won't have as much stage volume if the venue gets a little bigger and....
dohhh this is turning into a real nightmare [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
I guess you can't have it all [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

- Rune.

**Shawn Lutz** · 01-10-2005, 05:14 PM

Re: buying a halfstack - 50W vs. 100W?

nah...get a head and 4x12 [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] they rule heheh

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