JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

[Boxcar Willie 84]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

The guitar player in Aria used a Metal Zone in front of a Carvin MTS3200 half stack with a Jackson DXMG, and while his sound was a little thin while he was playing by himself, when the bass player was playing with them you couldn't really tell.

[jgcable]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

The Metal Zone in front of my MTS3200 sounds just as good as the Marshall. Especially in the clean channel.

[charvettelover]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

i used to use a metal zone in front of my JCM 800 vertical input heads....for me, it worked well if the amp was very clean and very loud, and i believe i used the low gain input on the marshall.

metal zone is no overdrive or boost pedal. it will sound VERY thin...it needs a loud, clean, ballsy amp to sound good.

hey kids!!! roll of some of those highs....

[jgcable]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

Highs are for cymbals.

[charvettelover]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

this is an interesting post...because it brings up some important questions about live sound...

there are really three ways to do it:

1. loud clean ballsy amp with pedals
2. loud dirty amp, relying upon the amps natural distortion characteristics
3. a rack system

ok...if you don't want to lug a rack, learn to program the bradshaw switcher, and keep from getting hernias, or don't have a tech that sets up your stuff....you are probably using option 1 or 2

i used to use 2 mesa mark III 100 watt amps with a rack and 2 4x12s....sounded amazing.

but since those days, i tend to use my pedalboard a lot more, and try to use loud clean tube amps. i'll tell you why :-)

if you start with a big ballsy loud clean tone...and then add a few pedals here and there....you get a loud ballsy dirty tone!

if you are relying on your amp for all your distortion/overdrive...that's all you get.

i like having a lot of headroom. which is why i switched later on to older basic JCM800 heads (a tip from Zakk).

i did a show with zakk when he was doing pride and glory, or something similar. he sounded AMAZING...with a few boss pedals, a guitar, and a loud clean tube amp.

believe me, i love the sound of an all tube amp when it is dimed and running hot. but there's nowwhere else to go, tonewise....

try it as an experiment, if you dare...

i also like using this method, as i sometimes am on a show where the backline is provided...i always try to request Fender Twins for backline (a pair of them)...believe it or not, with the right pedals i can make those puppies sound like a marshall :-)

[jgcable]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

I agree with what you are saying basically. Keep in mind that every one of your scenarios includes one VERY important word... LOUD.
Loud is something that most of us can't enjoy. I have been gigging since the late 70's, toured with Twisted Sister, Zebra, played 5000 seat shows blah blah blah but the reality is that the last 15 years I have been relegated to playing a local clubs and bars which 99% of the time do not afford me the opportunity to crank my JCM800 or any of my amps for that matter. I would think that the majority of us here are in the same boat. Sure cranking a Marshall with a pedal or without sounds fantastic but most of us don't get past 3 on the volume dial (maybe 5 by the end of the night!).
When I played with TS and Zebra I used a Hiwatt head and a full stack of Red Marshall cabs loaded with JBL's I had only 2 pedals. A MXR Distortion + and a Phase 90. It sounded unbelievable but I would usually have the Hiwatt on around 8. It was ear bleeding damage loud.
Everything you mentioned I agree with but lets just make sure that the JCF bro's realize that these set ups need to be LOUD. The Metal Zone with a good 100w tube amp on the clean channel turned way the frig up sounds killer. If it isn't loud enough live it tends to be a little thin. The tone still remains crushing though whether bedroom volume level or stadium level. My MTS3200 kills bugs dead with this combination.

[Endrik]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

[ QUOTE ]
i used to use 2 mesa mark III 100 watt amps with a rack and 2 4x12s....sounded amazing.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn good setup, I think mark III is the best sounding amp I've ever heard.

I have played with Metal Zone and many different Marshalls, Plexis, JCMs etc. I got a bretty good tone with MZ and Marhsall combination but it sucks ass compared to MARK III tone IMO.

[jgcable]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

A twin Mark III set up probably sounds decent I guess. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/headbang.gif[/img]

[Endrik]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

Yeah, John Sykes used 2 Mark III's at the second half of 80's, I still can't belive how good he sounded.

[charvettelover]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

yeah, ZEBRA...there's a band i always loved. they were local to new orleans (well, they split their time between NOLA and Long Island). great band...i met randy jackson when i was about 16, and he used to sneak me into Old Man Rivers in NOLA to see Zebra play. All ZEP, RUSH, and originals. they were SCARY....and all those BC Riches, Randy had them all, baby!

and you are right...you gotta be loud.

if you can't be loud, it's a bit more difficult, and you have to find that "happy zone" between stage volume that gets you fired and stage volume that doesn't destroy your mental health.

i like those new 18 watt marshall clones that everyone is making. a pair of those and a pair of good cabs makes a great smaller rig.

the metal zone is a unique pedal. i bought them when they came out, and felt the same way about that pedal as i did the ts808 tube screamer when it come out (got it for $35 at werleins music in NOLA)...i think the metal zone is a classic.
straight into JCM800 turned up loud with a nice 4x12...it sounds amazing...

straight into some transistor combo with 1x12...not so nice.

and this doesn't mean that your amp is bad...there are plenty of other pedals that are designed to make a small solid state amp sound good too...i've done gigs with amps from $150 to $5000.

it's your EARS...experiment, find out what sounds good for you, ask questions from other players you respect, read the mags (but don't believe all of it. eddie was telling us all for about 10 years he was using a 50 watt marshall....) [img]/images/graemlins/headbang.gif[/img]

[jgcable]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

We opened for them and TS for 1 year. Your right, Randy is a nice down to earth guy. Great player and a great singer.
At the time we were with them he was playing mainly a 10 string bich and a doubleneck. I didn't know they spent time in New Orleans. I always assumed they were a Long Island born and raised band. Twisted Sister was from around our area too. So was Bonjovi and Anthrax. We used to rehearse right next to Anthrax at Trilogy Studios in New Rochelle, NY and we were the house band at The Crazy Horse which was owned by Vinny Pastore (aka Big Pussy from the Soprano's). We were the last band ever to be booked there. When we arrived for the gig the doors were padlocked with a police notice on the door. It had been raided and closed down the day before. He did a heck of a "business" in the basement!

[charvettelover]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

[ QUOTE ]
We opened for them and TS for 1 year. Your right, Randy is a nice down to earth guy. Great player and a great singer.
At the time we were with them he was playing mainly a 10 string bich and a doubleneck. I didn't know they spent time in New Orleans. I always assumed they were a Long Island born and raised band. Twisted Sister was from around our area too. So was Bonjovi and Anthrax. We used to rehearse right next to Anthrax at Trilogy Studios in New Rochelle, NY and we were the house band at The Crazy Horse which was owned by Vinny Pastore (aka Big Pussy from the Soprano's). We were the last band ever to be booked there. When we arrived for the gig the doors were padlocked with a police notice on the door. It had been raided and closed down the day before. He did a heck of a "business" in the basement!

[/ QUOTE ]

nice! my family is from long branch, monmouth county baby! so yeah, i know that area...Zebra split their time between NOLA and Long Island. Randy was amazing...so was Felix the bass player/keyboardist and guy the drummer. never heard anyone do Led Zep and Rush like Zebra did...even the multitude of "tribute" acts didn't sound as good as Zebra doing it.
jon from bon jovi does a lot of charity work with my uncles, supports a special olympics thing they do and a basketball team. it's pretty close knit up there. but my branch of the family drifted around the country...boston, carolina, NOLA, OK, FLA....you name it!

[jgcable]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

Did you ever play L'amours in Brooklyn?

[charvettelover]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

[ QUOTE ]
Did you ever play L'amours in Brooklyn?

[/ QUOTE ]

no...most of my 80s touring was done in the southeast....NC to Arkansas to TX to FLA...that whole block of the country. lots of time in athens ga, back when that scene was just getting going. it was crazy! i was one of the only guys playing a charvel, they thought i was METAL :-)

just played a few places in NYC so far, showcasing for labels and conventions and that sort of thing. never got to do the tri-state club cicuit up there...maybe soon!

[jgcable]

Re: JCM800 + Metal Zone =???

I auditioned for Ozzy for the Speak of the Devil tour when Randy died. I got a call back but that was all I got. I also auditioned to tour with Foreigner for their Juke Box Hero world tour. The Juke Box was actually in the lobby of Bud Kreager's office in Times Square. Very cool. My band was too heavy at the time. We were similar to an early Queensryche/Iron Maiden at the time. Your pics are cool. I can tell by your posts that we have alot in common. Lots of years on the road is obvious to me when I read your posts.