Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

[jgcable]

Riddle me this batman.. many of us guitar players love Dimebags tone, at least I do. Lets face it.. its compressed, shrill, scooped and sometimes borderline unpleasant to the ears but at the same time it KILLS.
Now.. take the infamous Randall Warhead. Randall amps have been regarded for years as a maker of the best SS amps ever. Especially for metal. IMHO, the Warhead nails 100% the Dimebag tone. Now here is the question. If many players love Dimebags tone and many players regard Randalls as great SS amps and the Warhead (and the X2) both nail Dimebags tone than why does everybody hate these amps?
What am I not getting here?
Let me add one more note to this. The Randall Cyclone is a very high rated SS amp. Almost everybody likes or loves it.
The only difference between the Warhead and the Cyclone is the Warhead has built in DSP effects (which can be switched off) yet most people hate the Warhead. WTF???

[Boxcar Willie 84]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

I think most people love Dimebag's tone because it fits in with what he played...HIS style. I love Dimebag just as much as anybody else, but I wouldn't wanna use his tone in the stuff that I play. Besides, his tone was always much more than his amp.

[DumpyWumpy]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

I think the Warhead sounds nothing like Dime's tone...Not the same type of saturation, just sounded cheap and shitty to me, and they don't cut through very well either.

[Tetsuo]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

All things have been stated

1 the SS Bias
2 Dimes tone is shrilly
3 Dimes Tone is his
4 Dimes playing made up more of his tone than his amp did

I think that is why the Randall warheads are dogged

[jgcable]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

[ QUOTE ]
All things have been stated

1 the SS Bias
2 Dimes tone is shrilly
3 Dimes Tone is his
4 Dimes playing made up more of his tone than his amp did

I think that is why the Randall warheads are dogged

[/ QUOTE ]

I wonder then why the 5150 isn't bashed too for not sounding like Eddy's tone. To me it sounds NOTHING like Eddy's tone. It sounds great but just not Eddy's tone.
It's weird; the Rhino YJM-50 Blackstar was bashed (I have no idea how it sounded at all but the concept surely would make you think it sounded pretty good), now the Krank amps are being bashed everywhere, the Crate Blue Voodoo's are usually ripped to shreds (actually, all Crate products are which is totally unwarranted), and the general feeling regarding the Fender MH is that its crap and should be avoided. Maybe its the mob mentality. You know.. one guy says it sucks and everybody jumps on the bandwagon.
For instance, how can the old Ampeg SS70C and 140C fade into obscurity yet the Fender RocPro 700 and 1000 still live on and thrive. They are both great SS amps. Here is my take. If Malmsteen didn't actually use the Fender Rocpro for guitar clinics and for recording the Concerto Suite it would have vanished from the earth.
How can the Fender Blues jr be highly acclaimed yet the Crate VC508 and VC30 not be. I have played and owned both. They are both great amps. Actually, the build quality is higher on the VC30 and its made right in St. Louis.
Why would a player spend around $500.00 for a Peavey XXL? They sound like crap live. My take is that its smart directed marketing. The XXX is the only reason the XXL is so popular. Similar styling and features and similar tone at low bedroom volumes. The old bait and switch. Little Johnny goes into GC to check both out. At the volume that most guys check out an amp at the music store both of these amps sound great but the XXL is maintenance free and much less expensive so that is what he chooses. Then he gets the XXL home and off to band practice or the gig. This is when the difference is obvious (to XXX owners) but little Johnny will never know the difference because he never got to crank an amp that actually sounds good loud. Eventually, he sells it (because he can't compete with the other guitar players 5150). How come the XXL doesn't get a bad rap?
I have played probably every amp combination imaginable live. Tubes, SS, hybrids, rack systems, Class A, A/B, Mesa, Marshall, Hiwatt, Line 6, GK.. heck.. everything, and with the proper tweaking and cabinets I could usually get just about everything to sound really good live. The one exception would be a Johnson Marquis 60 with an extension cabinet. That set up sounded aweful live.

[Tetsuo]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

Your spot on it is Mob mentality W/O a question... When I look at the guys from the gear page I mean it is all highend stuff and what one says they all follow. First it was the Klon but then the TIM became the stomp they all needed etc.... and really I bet in a blind test you are not going to hear much difference between that and a POD Model with a tube screamer in front of it

[Deneb]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

Jg when you get down to it, a shit load of people bash the Mesa stuff too.

[zeegler]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

...and Crate

[jgcable]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

I agree Deneb but it is a different type of bashing. The guys bashing Mesa are Marshall players and visa versa. Both sides appreciate and can identify great guitar amps. Its a personal tone preference thing.
Here is a little short story:
I bought one of the first 5150 combos ever released. I was one of (if not the 1st) local player to use one live. When that amp 1st came out everybody around here bashed it because it was a Peavey. They agreed it sounded great but no local players were using them. Of course you know why... Peavey amps are for kids and bedroom jammers. Then, it became universally known that Eddy actually played stock 5150's live. My next gig at the same club 3 months later was with 3 bands. Both guitar players in the 1st band that played used 5150's, the other guitar player in out band bought one too. I asked why the sudden change of heart regarding Peavey. They all mentioned that if the amp is good enough for Eddy then its good enough for them and it sounds great too. I guess they needed a fairly well known local guitar player (me) to break the ice regarding low end consumer grade Peavey amps. That is an example of the bias that some brands and styles of amps unjustly get.
C'mon, seriously, JCM900 or many of the later DSL's, TSL's don't actually suck. They just get a really bad rap from the vintage Marshall snobs. Do you really believe that a new Mesa Dual rectifier sounds like crap compared to an original 2 channel version? It doesn't.

[Tetsuo]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

Yeah a lot is preference though and in regard to the JCM2000 they were not built very well...

Peavy did the smart thing with Ed and getting it marketed..

The thing is I hate the idea that you simply have to spend more to sound better maybe it is true but not 100%. Honestly some of the best tones I heard recently live were from a JSX...

I have to disagree with the Crate BV the ones I have played sounded awful but then again I am biased against crate having had a bad experience early on

[Tetsuo]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

[ QUOTE ]
Jg when you get down to it, a shit load of people bash the Mesa stuff too.

[/ QUOTE ]

and with good reason [img]/images/graemlins/poke.gif[/img] With Mesa it really is though just because they are overhyped. I am dying to really crank a stiletto though I ahve played them but they are only supposed to sound good loud and my GC won't let me crank it

[Boxcar Willie 84]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

Good post JGCable. I think a lot of the negativity with the Crate Blue Voodoos is based on the reliability of the early ones. It seems that every time I went to a store to try one out, it wasn't working right. But working in a store now, I'm able to try out the newer ones, which haven't had any reliability issues so far, and they sound pretty good to boot. Probably my favorite high-gain sounding head under $1000 right now.

[thurston]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

[ QUOTE ]
Jg when you get down to it, a shit load of people bash the Mesa stuff too.

[/ QUOTE ]

The Mesa bashing comes from 2 things.
1) They're freakin everywhere, every poofy haired, eyeliner wearing, white belt, heroin chic kid on eMpTyVee has one.
2) In my experience, Mesa's Active EQ is a right beyotch to dial in. Most users don't take the time to learn how the 3 bands interact with each other, so everyone has the same lame tone which isn't very representative of the capabilities of Mesa's products.

[Endrik]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

I totally agree with thurston.
To get some really good tone you need to take time to find out the sweet EQ combination. And Mesa makes some of the most versatile amps ever, that's why I love them.

[Badseed]

Re: Pantera-- Warhead--WTF??

I know a dealer who stopped selling the warhead because he had 4 out of 5 he sold come back within weeeks needing repairs.One word, CHEAP.

I had a chance to see darryls rig upclose on the CFH tour.It was old randalls, tons of compressors, BBE's ect..It wasnt just his randall making that tone.Believe me , i had the same amp as his, i wrote down his settings and could not come close to his tone.