Uberschall the good bad and ugly

[toejam]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Cool. I've always kinda liked how the Orange amps looked for some reason. I like the colored Matamps, too. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]
me too; I'm currently lusting after a matamp actually. Gonna be a good long while till that happens though... :wistful:

[/ QUOTE ]
Sweet! [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

[horns666]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

By Etohk.."I owned an uberschall for about 8 months, but I just couldnt get it to cut through the mix in my (2 guitar) metal band without losing tone. When it was just me and my band, the sound was awesome. The other guitarist uses a dual rec and I just didnt care for how the uber sounded in the mix. They werent complementary and I play with a lot of mids already and him next to none. I tried an EQ in the loop and that did improve things, but I just couldnt justify a $3000 amp needing help to sound good."

ABSOLUTELY , you just nailed it. By myself I can dial up an amazing sound with my Uber. When I was in the band with John , we both had to CRANK the right amount of mids to work well together. The problem with that is idividualy both amps sounded like crap (too midrangy) , mine more than his ...but together they worked well..

The night before I brought the Uber to Johns ..I spent some time to get the coolest , heaviest sound I could get. When I got there and fired it up...we were both pretty amazed. Until John started playing...all of a sudden I couldn't hear my shit ...I was moving a lot of air and cranked , but the mids were too scooped..

so we both had to tweak our stuff to each other until it worked..it did sound great together.. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

But by myself I have one of the most "brutal" sound I've heard from any player to be honest..I'm quite please with it at recording or a fairly high moderate levels..

I don't like the coloration and compression of the EL34s when the amp is pushed..

I think the Uber would fit better in a single guitar situation...but it is the shit for metal IMO...its not a "pretty" sounding amp...perfect for not pretty music..

BTW...John was hangin' with Cris Caffery all night at rehearsal...I was going to go over there too...but I had a backache...so fuggit! [img]/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[PoisonGodmachine]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

Hey horns you say you dont like the Coloration and compression of the el34s. does this same type of coloration apply to the Framus cobra. i was looking around and i see that its got the same tubes. as the Uber.. anyone else..notice the framus's Sound getting shabbed up as you crank it? ive never played one. but i love how tight it sounds and the saturation is unbeleivable...this talk of shitty el34s makes me very sad though.

[Cleveland Metal]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

Wellll, EL34s certainly have their place in the world. with a cleaner amp, and some volume, they will produce a nice saturation that is classic, combined with the right pickup/guitar, you can hear some of the most renowned tones ever recorded. That said...

IMO, with the modern high gain amps, when EL34s are pushed hard, they compress too much for me, they color the sound with a midrangey honk somewhat, and somehow remove a lot of the character that you have so painfully dialed in with your nice preamp sections abilty in these amps, and make the sound more generic. Often it seems like an overblown AC/DC sound of some sort. Not necessarily a bad sound for people maybe, just not what I'm looking for. I need clear, concise, tight edgey distortion and that isn't what they do for me. I'll figure Bill will concur.

I'm a big KT88 guy, you'll be deaf and kill small animals nearby before they really start to saturate, haha... 6L6s are of that clean distortion sound too. They stay tight as well.

Just my opinion though, I know a lot of people are EL34 fans here. Whatever works for you, have at it.

[jgcable]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

I like EL34's and even better E34L's. In the right amp, they cut through a band mix (especially with 2 guitars) better than any other power tubes.

[Cleveland Metal]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

Probably because of the midrange the accenuate and your other choices of equipment.

I doubt your using a super high gain amp like the Uber etc. With a Marshall, which is sorta clean, the EL34 cut through, and sing leads like nothing else.

[jgcable]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

yep..

[siggy14]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

[ QUOTE ]
By Etohk.."I owned an uberschall for about 8 months, but I just couldnt get it to cut through the mix in my (2 guitar) metal band without losing tone. When it was just me and my band, the sound was awesome. The other guitarist uses a dual rec and I just didnt care for how the uber sounded in the mix. They werent complementary and I play with a lot of mids already and him next to none. I tried an EQ in the loop and that did improve things, but I just couldnt justify a $3000 amp needing help to sound good."

ABSOLUTELY , you just nailed it. By myself I can dial up an amazing sound with my Uber. When I was in the band with John , we both had to CRANK the right amount of mids to work well together. The problem with that is idividualy both amps sounded like crap (too midrangy) , mine more than his ...but together they worked well..

The night before I brought the Uber to Johns ..I spent some time to get the coolest , heaviest sound I could get. When I got there and fired it up...we were both pretty amazed. Until John started playing...all of a sudden I couldn't hear my shit ...I was moving a lot of air and cranked , but the mids were too scooped..

so we both had to tweak our stuff to each other until it worked..it did sound great together.. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

But by myself I have one of the most "brutal" sound I've heard from any player to be honest..I'm quite please with it at recording or a fairly high moderate levels..

I don't like the coloration and compression of the EL34s when the amp is pushed..

I think the Uber would fit better in a single guitar situation...but it is the shit for metal IMO...its not a "pretty" sounding amp...perfect for not pretty music..

BTW...John was hangin' with Cris Caffery all night at rehearsal...I was going to go over there too...but I had a backache...so fuggit! [img]/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I would agree, you spend time tweaking both amps can work great together. Last year on warped tour avenge sevenfold had that setup, the rythem guy played his mesa and the lead guy played the uber and they sounded great together.

You can also do like i have suggested before, if the uber has a line out buy yourself a 6l6 power amp and slave it off the head and then just mic the cab that is connected to the power amp. With this situation you no longer have to crank the amp so it does not get the EL34 coloration to the sound, plus you still get your 6l6 power section.

[Tetsuo]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

Or better yet Siggy a VHT 2150 Power Amp

[horns666]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

There is No line out on the Uber ...so that is not an option.

I wish it were...I would love to hear my preamp section into John's VHT 2150 w / KT88s...I KNOW that would sound good!!

BUT..check this shit out!!!!!

A friend of John and I ...is playing with "Ripper" Owens (Beyond Fear) ....he just landed a Engl endorement and is getting a new Powerball next week....So John and I are going to take the Uber to the store where he works after hours (Guitar Center) and do a really good A / B comparison...This way "we" could do a REAL hands on and ears on ...thing [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

FUCK SOUND CLIPS!!!!!!!! [img]/images/graemlins/eviltongue.gif[/img]

John and I will give a full detailed review of the Powerball VS Uberschall....

and lets see who the real puff daddy is.... [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]


Oh yeah....BTW I do "concure" what John said about the whole Uber / EL34 thing...we both discovered this was the case..

EL34s are for amps that NEED them....Not high gain Buzzsaws like the Uber...with a preamp such as that ...you should have a very "clean" power section with TONS of headroom to let the preamp do the work it was intended to do IMO.


I just played my Uber just a bit ago...and believe me...I can't see it getting much better (heavier) than this to be honest...but we'll see.. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Twisteramps]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

EL34s are capable of more wattage and headroom than a 6L6 family tube. Problem is, the amp has to be designed FOR the EL34s to begin with, and need more plate voltage. According to the spec sheets, an EL34 can take 800 volts and gives 100 watts from a pair. *!* However, I don't think there has been an EL34 tube built for decades that can take that much juice.

I think the metal guys tend to gravitate towards the 6L6 family of tubes because they already have some of the mids scooped and to my ear have more lows and highs too. EL34s have a nice crunchy midrange that sound great to me. When I've owned amps that offered swapping the power tubes easily as an option (early reverse chassis dual rectifier, VHT 50/CL, Univalve, many of my homebuilts) I tend to go for the EL34s.

A real nice trick for a two guitar band is to have one guy play 6L6s for power tubes and the other dude use EL34s. It really spreads the sound out then!

What I'd recommend to you guys that are crazy about your tone (this means you cleveland) is to grit your teeth and spend the bucks on some blackplate RCA 6L6s. Absolutely THE 6L6 power tubes from hell. Or Sylvanias like the early 5150s came with. Yeah, you'll pay out the ass, but they will last much much much longer than any new production tubes and kick the shit out of them tonewise.

I need to dig around here - I may still have a used set of RCA Blackplates. Cleveland, if you want to put em in your amp just to see if it makes a difference, let me know and if I can locate em you're more than welcome to borrow em and see how they fare against new tubes. I think you'll be ruined afterwards. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Pete

[siggy14]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

[ QUOTE ]
There is No line out on the Uber ...so that is not an option.

I wish it were...I would love to hear my preamp section into John's VHT 2150 w / KT88s...I KNOW that would sound good!!

BUT..check this shit out!!!!!

A friend of John and I ...is playing with "Ripper" Owens (Beyond Fear) ....he just landed a Engl endorement and is getting a new Powerball next week....So John and I are going to take the Uber to the store where he works after hours (Guitar Center) and do a really good A / B comparison...This way "we" could do a REAL hands on and ears on ...thing [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

FUCK SOUND CLIPS!!!!!!!! [img]/images/graemlins/eviltongue.gif[/img]

John and I will give a full detailed review of the Powerball VS Uberschall....

and lets see who the real puff daddy is.... [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]


Oh yeah....BTW I do "concure" what John said about the whole Uber / EL34 thing...we both discovered this was the case..

EL34s are for amps that NEED them....Not high gain Buzzsaws like the Uber...with a preamp such as that ...you should have a very "clean" power section with TONS of headroom to let the preamp do the work it was intended to do IMO.


I just played my Uber just a bit ago...and believe me...I can't see it getting much better (heavier) than this to be honest...but we'll see.. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Does the uber have an effects loop that you can tap off of?

[Cleveland Metal]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

The Uber has a cheesy weak effects loop, so yeah, it has one and you could pull it out of there.


Pete, I'm running Svetlana KT88s in my VHT 2150. You're not saying I should try the RCA Black plate 6L6s? I can do that?

Now Bill, would probably be a happy camper if HE could do that to the EL34 Uber. Either those or KT88s. Not sure that amp would put out the plate voltage a KT88 needs to smoke. Seems Marshall are what around 400 or so? I know my VHT 2150 is around 700 volts... Whatchya think?

[Twisteramps]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

Cleve - DOH! I forgot you're running a 2150 w/KT88s. Shit. The real deal on the KT88s are the Genelex I think... and those are worse than finding Mullard EL34s. Your VHT would smoke the blackplates [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

If Bill wants to drop em in the Uber and I can find em, he's more than welcome to see what blackplate RCA goodness can do to his bogner. Just make sure he has em biased right so they don't blow up [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Bill could also run KT88s or 6550s in there no problem too. I don't know if the KT88s would be LOUDER than the EL34s, but he should get some more headroom with those than the 6L6s. I noticed that with my Univalve - running a KT88 was a hell of a lot cleaner than any other power tube, and it was only mid 400ish plate volts.

Pete

[horns666]

Re: Uberschall the good bad and ugly

Pete thank for the great info dude...

man ...that sounds very promising. My ONLY complaint is when the Uber is pushed to a loud volume level. I love the preamp section...when I'm practicng at moderate levels...I love my tone so much ....well its SILLY! [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

John stick some KT88 , 6l6 or 6550 in my Uber...make it happen! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

but wait till we compare it with that Powerball...I must do this. I sure hope Engl dude is ready , because I'm out for blood... [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

well I don't want to get rid of the Bogner so easily ..I became quite attached to it. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]