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So our PA with this new band that I've been jamming with seems to crap out every couple of months. Their current rig just blew out pretty much over the last week. One set of speakers blew out on last Wednesday, the other set today. If there isn't any clipping, everything is matched up properly (wattage, Ohmage, etc) and it still seems to be blowing speakers, could this potentially be a problem with the power amp? Any thoughts? Oddly enough it blows the two 15" speakers, but not the horn or whatever in the speaker cabs.
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
Wellll, you may double check wattage at whatever Ohms you are using and make sure the speakers are at or above the spec.
BUT, you can certainly blow a speaker with an amp rated at less than the speakers rating by:
Applying excessive EQ boosts within the operational range of the speaker can kill the speaker.
Allowing electronic clipping anywhere in the electronic chain including the mixing console, signal processing equipment, or the power amplifiers. Square waves push the speaker out and hold it, heating to the point the coils melts.
Allowing speakers to be “pushed” to a point of obvious distortion. See above...
On the other hand, you may be getting cheap speakers that just aren't so good, and die when "used" like a real band uses them.
What all are you using exactly? -
Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
Probably the poweramp, I'd honestly say it was an impedance issue if you didnt say it was matched. Strange...try it out with the poweramp of an SS head and see if it does that as well.Comment
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
I'm not 100% sure what all we're using but its a reasonably nice mixer (can't remember the brand), some NADY power amp, and they've gone through two sets of speakers, the first ones were no-name 'custom built' ones, whereas the most recently blown set was "X-Audio" or something like that.
The speakers are set up to the proper ohms to match with the power amp, and the allowed watts of the speakers is well over the power amp's wattage.
We're only running vocals through the PA. We did a sound check with the two vocal microphones, made sure nothing was clipping on the mixer or power amp, and backed off a bit on the power amp's volume. The rig lasted through the first verse of the song (about 45 seconds) then when the second verse came up we were only having audio come through the horn of the remaining speaker cab.
I'm convinced it is the power amp. So we're talking about getting a whole new rig. Does anyone have any suggestions for a rig that would basically be good for running vocals through, as well as maybe a bit of kick drum micing? We practice fairly loud (other guitarist has a JCM800 2203 half stack that sits at around 2.5, bassist is running through a 2x18/2x10 cab, I'm still figuring out my rig but for now I'm running a 5150 halfstack)Comment
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
Well, not sure what the customs were about, but X-Audio aren't exactly high end. Even when they show a rating, doesn't mean they are a capable speaker. Considering how you are running it, I guess they should still last for that type of usage though.
I have had great luck with Yorkville PA speakers. Cheap, and have a great 5yr warranty. My basement setup (and we play loud) has a pair of Yorkvilles with two 15s and a horn in each, with an old 400 watt stereo Cerwin Vega power amp, and it kills.Comment
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
If you are doing any Metarcore type screams into the microphones, they can litterally make the cones jump right out of the metal speaker housing. Rolloff some bass on the mics, use the "low Cut" switch (if you have one, frequencies below this roll off point are not useable on voice anyway),and use a limiter before the poweramp.If used properly,you will never do amp or speaker damage.I use 13 channels of compression /limiting in my live rig
Screamin'Comment
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
Thanks for the further responses.
As far as the vocal types. Its thrash metal vocals, so that somewhat sang / somewhat shouted style, with periodic more death-y low vocals, straight up screams, and even the sort of Falsetto (?) type scream that Ayara did at the beginning of Angel Of Death, and for line testing, we'd have the main vocalist (as well as the backing one) basically hit the mic as hard as they can with the gain down fairly low, then ease it up to a reasonable area so it isn't clipping at all.
Still the whole thing seems pretty odd, blow one speaker one practice then the next one another one.Comment
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
OK i am into electronics and have been my whole life, basically if your amp is rated at say 400 watts per side then you want to at least get a speaker that is double that, this way you have plenty of headroom. It is always also best to seperate highs and lows, get a seperate sub box and just have regular speakers doing the mids and highs, this is how professionals do it and it always sounds best.Comment
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
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Probably the poweramp, I'd honestly say it was an impedance issue if you didnt say it was matched. Strange...try it out with the poweramp of an SS head and see if it does that as well.
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If you screw over impedence, it's usually the amp that's going to be grabbing its ankles. Wattage however...
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get a seperate sub box and just have regular speakers doing the mids and highs, this is how professionals do it and it always sounds best.
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Good way of going about it, but subs are expensive, especially to get a nice, powerful one.
Is any sound coming out of the woofers at all? If it's flubbing around or buzzing really badly, then it's probably fucked up. But if nothing is coming out at all, is it possible that a wire broke off on the inside?Comment
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
The horns in both of the speakers still produce sounds, but the two 15" speakers in each speaker cabinet don't produce anything. They are 100% silent.Comment
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
From what I have read a clipped signal can actually come from an amplifier at 2 to 3 times the rated output of the amp (100 watt amp clipped could = 300 watts). Underpowering speakers can damage them easier then overpowering them. This is probably the reason you use a 300 watt cab with a 100 watt head for distorted guitar sounds.
Headroom from my research means having x number of watts above the rating of your cabs. This allows you to not push your amp into clipping or distortion which leaves you plenty of "clean" power. The rule of thumb that I have read and been told via other avenues, is that the amp RMS rating should be 1.5 to 2 times the continuous power rating of the cabinets.
I have been researching this recently looking for a power amp for our PA, and these "rules" seem to be the most consistent I have found. The JBL site has a good explaination from what I have heard. Good luck [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img]"told you guys that spandex, hairspray and makeup on guys was a bad idea, and now look what happened - you all turned into women." - Newc
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Re: Mixer -> Poweramp -> Speakers...
You know, it is possible that you blew the passive crossover in the speakers. Try opening up the speakers and connecting a cable directly to the speakes and see if that works.
Screamin'Comment
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