Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

[horns666]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

Uberschall...I'm playing it now...it don't get any MORE "metal:" than this.. [img]/images/graemlins/nono.gif[/img]

This is one HEAVY MO FO!!! [img]/images/graemlins/eek.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/notworthy.gif[/img]

Stay away from this amp is you prefer 80's styled gain and tone..if you like the sound of 2210s / ADA MP1 / Marshall JMP-1s/ Voodoovalves/ SLOs or whatever..this amp is NOT for you! [img]/images/graemlins/refuse.gif[/img]

Uberschalls are comparible to a 5150 w/422 in loop with BETTER tone, on major steriods..and what a recto wished it were if it grew up...having all three amps I can say this easily!!

Bill Z Bub

[charvelguy]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

I can like an ADA for what it is, and for that which it was made it does rather well I think. I don't expect the ADA to sound like a Bogner altho there have been mods done to claim it can get close to that. Same with Marshalls.

I listened to the Uber clips and I know I could likely live with the price tag for an amp like that, they actually have alot more going for them other than just gain. Quite a bit of flexibility there which would allow me to rid myself of other amps. In consideration of that price tag tho..I'd have to at least try others before settling on "this is my high buck ticket tone." I know I'd rent a Cornford out for a couple days and really put it through trial before plunking 2k down on anything.

JG's 80's setup sounds similar to mine was only I didn't run the tube amp clean. Hiwatts always struck me being alot cleaner and louder amp than a Marshall.

[Rupe]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

[ QUOTE ]
Super heavy, scooped and chunky.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is why you disappeared right there. I have yet to hear a truly "scooped" tone that cuts with any authority through a live mix (unless the volume is over the top compared to the other instruments, and sometimes not even then). When you take away your mids, you lose your sonic authority and start playing in the same frequencies as the bass and drums on the low end and the cymbals on the high end. What sounds good when playing solo (not "a" solo) or at a less than live volume rarely translates to a live scenario. The Metal Zone has an extremely interactive midrange EQ that will allow you to almost disappear or cut like a baby playing with razorblades. It is definitely not a plug and play pedal.
I'm not trying to say all "scooped tones" suck, but you have to cautious with your mids to make them work, especially live.

[jgcable]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Super heavy, scooped and chunky.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is why you disappeared right there. I have yet to hear a truly "scooped" tone that cuts with any authority through a live mix (unless the volume is over the top compared to the other instruments, and sometimes not even then). When you take away your mids, you lose your sonic authority and start playing in the same frequencies as the bass and drums on the low end and the cymbals on the high end. What sounds good when playing solo (not "a" solo) or at a less than live volume rarely translates to a live scenario. The Metal Zone has an extremely interactive midrange EQ that will allow you to almost disappear or cut like a baby playing with razorblades. It is definitely not a plug and play pedal.
I'm not trying to say all "scooped tones" suck, but you have to cautious with your mids to make them work, especially live.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hear you bro regarding being lost in the mix with a scooped tone. Even I didn't know what I was doing for a point in my musical life! [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] Dimebag got away with a totally scooped tone because of sheer volume and amount of speakers and the lack of sonic "competition" live. If he was competing with Bill and his Ubershall there would be no contest. Bill would win.

Regarding Charvelguys remark on the power of a Hiwatt. Hell yea. My Hiwatt was so much louder than any other 100w tube amp it wasn't funny. It also had more headroom than any human could ever need. I had 2 of them actually but one was a Sound City made by the same company. It looked and sounded exactly the same as the Hiwatt. I bought it for $100.00 at Sam Ash on one of their used gear clearance sales. I bought the 2 red Marshall 4 x 12 cabinets from one of Buddy Miles roadies in the parking garage behind Sam Ash in White Plains, NY as he was wheeling them in to trade in. I bought them both for $250.00. They had Buddy Miles Band stenciled on the sides of them. That was a super cool rig.

[charvelguy]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

the benefits of living in NY.
Not sure if Hiwatts had Partridge transformers for the latter years, I think in the 70's they did and they changed over in circuit or build in '75. The Sound City did for sure have Partridges. They are a very powerful and clean tranny which I think accounts for some of those amps clearity and tone. Course, Sound City used to get slammed "sound sh!tty" Audiophiles pulled them apart for parts in building amps. They were cheap and in abundance.
The 120 watters were very loud amps too. The old Sunn Model T was another insane volume amp.

[Rupe]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

[ QUOTE ]
Dimebag got away with a totally scooped tone because of sheer volume and amount of speakers and the lack of sonic "competition" live. If he was competing with Bill and his Ubershall there would be no contest. Bill would win.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree 100% [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img] Although Dime is a true legend, his tone frequently didn't do it for me due to the sucked mids.

Bill's Uber tone is a great example of how to make it work. When I listened to his demos a couple of days ago I really didn't expect to like them simply because I don't like alot of the newer music that he digs and frequently talks about(although we seem to have alot of common ground with some of the more "classic" players). I was pleasantly surprised when I actually listened to them...he had all the balls and thump that people strive to get with a scooped tone, yet he had enough mids in there to give his tone a "girth" that I find missing in alot of newer (not "nu") metal bands. Extremely aggressive yet punchy...a combination to tear some heads off. I've heard Ubers live and never cared for them...I don't know if Bill just knows how to dial his in (probably) or if its "in the hands" (or guitar), or a combo of all of these but people into that style should go check out that thread and take some notes.

[jgcable]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

[ QUOTE ]
the benefits of living in NY.
Not sure if Hiwatts had Partridge transformers for the latter years, I think in the 70's they did and they changed over in circuit or build in '75. The Sound City did for sure have Partridges. They are a very powerful and clean tranny which I think accounts for some of those amps clearity and tone. Course, Sound City used to get slammed "sound sh!tty" Audiophiles pulled them apart for parts in building amps. They were cheap and in abundance.
The 120 watters were very loud amps too. The old Sunn Model T was another insane volume amp.

[/ QUOTE ]

I had a Sunn Model T, a Sunn Coliseum and a huge Traynor head with a gigantic 6 x 10 speaker cabinet (I think it was 6 x 10's). It was the first live guitar amp my band BULLET had in 1976 (I was 14). Me and the other guitar player would both plug into it and rock out Kiss and Nugent tunes at the same time until it started to smoke and catch on fire. Then his father would come home and swear at us as he repaired it. This happened at least once a week. I ran through an Electro Harmonix LPB-1 and he had some other type of cheesy preamp/overdrive/distortion thingy.

[horns666]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

You guys are RIGHT..John and I used to play together. I had to compromise MY tone to make it work well with his CAE/VHT..he had to dial up differently as well to work with mine..

We both like a fairly scooped metal tone..so now it was battles of the mid knobs..finally together they sounded GREAT..but on their own...ehhhh just OK.

You can get by with a very scoopped sound when your by yourself..I'm fairly scooped now..and that's wear it sounds good me..

when I played with John I had to push the Uber alot more..and with the mids boosted passed my liking ..it gave me what I call "honk"...I didn't like that.

Both of us were pushing so much low end..His VHT/CAE was a powerhouse in the lows..esp the lower freqs ..my Uber seemed have alot of lows in the upper low mid freqs..

We never had a bass player...we didn't need one.. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[toejam]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

[ QUOTE ]
Dimebag got away with a totally scooped tone because of sheer volume and amount of speakers and the lack of sonic "competition" live.

[/ QUOTE ]
Also, Pantera were smart with having Rex turn up the mids in his bass, not to mention the fact that Darrell did boost the mids for solos.

[horns666]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

Rupe..yer right on all counts and thank you. John plays mine and doesn't work well for him. I play his and it doesn't work well for me. But we sound great when we are doing are thing. John and I have been on a mission of tone since we heard the name Eddie Van Halen. John has an amazing tone and always sounds like John no matter what he owned or played thru...just a "better" version of it is all.

Same as me , hands mean alot!!..

Nobody Dimes the gain of an Uber..whenever I tell other Uber owners they do THIS!!! [img]/images/graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/what.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/sick.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/eek.gif[/img]

I make it work..you are hearing a DIMED uber on that tape..Like I said before I have a tape of me and my DIMED Uber doing a level check (didn't know tape was rollin')..and I'm just jackin' off getting a "level" ..but it captured the essence of the Uber very nicely..

There is another two songs on that demo you did not hear. Rupe would prolly like best because it's straight forward powermetal with banshee screams an solos and shit..

Ask John to Post them..if he can find it..he will...but if he does , don't make fun out of my corrupted eruption..I didn't know it was being recorded..but we kept it anywhoo.. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

OH BTW John may have a version of the same song that we are playing together..and you can hear both of our sounds together..it's pretty cool!! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Rupe]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

[ QUOTE ]
There is another two songs on that demo you did not hear. Rupe would prolly like best because it's straight forward powermetal with banshee screams an solos and shit..

[/ QUOTE ]

You're getting to know me now... [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img]

[RickStar]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

[ QUOTE ]
i still like the vetta 2.
it might not have the feel of tube, but the 2 amps at once sounds awesome.

[/ QUOTE ] I have one also but it's going bye bye soon. It just doesn't have the feel to it. And trying the 2 amps sound live can be a pain because almost all the clubs here do not want to double mic amps. They don't have the extra mic or wanna run another line. They just don't wanna deal with it.

[RickStar]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

For metal live it's tough. Not everyone can afford a 2 or $3,000 plus amp. From my experience i would say H & K Triamp, bogner uber or a mesa triple three channel model. They are all very heavy sounding and can be a little versatile and are very road worthy.

[horns666]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

"You're getting to know me now..."

Yes I am.. [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img]

[Cleveland Metal]

Re: Best brand new overall amp for metal LIVE!!

Our band, Evilution, when I was still in it...

I'm the first solo,around 1:58 Bill is at 2:18

Pretty disjointed really, but ok for a demo attempt.

Father Felon:
http://www.clevelandmetalzone.com/evilution/mp3/ff.mp3