5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

[Endrik]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

I think your engineer wants to go with the safe way. I don't like this at all. The result is usually booring and thousands of other bands will sound the same.
Experimenting with different gear, amps, guitars, effects, mics, cool layering, wall of sounds etc. All the great records are done this way. Experimenting kicks ass, the band will have its own personality.

[hippietim]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

John - if you're in this for the long haul go with the flow. Make your mark but it's not worth getting too bent out of shape over. You are the new guy. Let them get used to what "your" sound is. In fact, you should sit back with a critical ear and see if you really doing the best thing for the songs. Since you're walking into an existing set of tracks, you need to blend.

[jgcable]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

[ QUOTE ]
John - if you're in this for the long haul go with the flow. Make your mark but it's not worth getting too bent out of shape over. You are the new guy. Let them get used to what "your" sound is. In fact, you should sit back with a critical ear and see if you really doing the best thing for the songs. Since you're walking into an existing set of tracks, you need to blend.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats what I intend to do Tim. These guys have been together since the mid 90's. I am certainly the new guy.
I'll eventually get my sound in there.

[Dreamland_Rebel]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

why don't you just play through what ever the hell you want but go through a direct box right off the pickup and record that track but keep it muted. then when you arn't there and the guy hates your sound, he can just run that track through and imedence matching box and into the guitar rig of his choice and re-amp your signal. that way he isn't waisting your time. or the bands time trying out different sounds.

when i take a session i make everyone run through the pod and a direct box. and tell them, we'll biuld your actual guitar sound later at or before mixdown. lets just get it recorded. ok?

[GodOfRhythm]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

You already have the perfect 80's metal tool at your disposal:


MARK III !!!

[img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/poke.gif[/img]

[jgcable]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

[ QUOTE ]
why don't you just play through what ever the hell you want but go through a direct box right off the pickup and record that track but keep it muted. then when you arn't there and the guy hates your sound, he can just run that track through and imedence matching box and into the guitar rig of his choice and re-amp your signal. that way he isn't waisting your time. or the bands time trying out different sounds.

when i take a session i make everyone run through the pod and a direct box. and tell them, we'll biuld your actual guitar sound later at or before mixdown. lets just get it recorded. ok?

[/ QUOTE ]

Thats pretty much what we wound up doing! He broke out an a/b box and I listened to my favorite GT-6 patch while I was playing while he was recording the straight up 5150II. We then did the same thing with the Marshall 3203. I thought the Marshall recorded better. He didn't. My contention was that the different guitar sounds made the overall tone interesting because I rarely play what the other guitarist is playing. I am all over the place in the songs. I also want a different solo tone. The songs call for a Richie Sambora/ Neal Schon type of tone. I am thinking the Soldano will get me close enough. These guys have a ton or recording gear and they REALLY know how to use it. Its amazing what a pro can do with Cakewalk 9. I was stunned. It was my first time recording in an environment where mistakes in timing and even notes during intricate solo's can be corrected.
Like I mentioned earlier.. these guys really know what they are doing. I felt like I had to sit back and take direction even though my ears weren't feeling it. It was a pretty eye opening experience considering I used to work at PowerPlay studios as a guitar tech in the mid to late 90's and had much success.

[Inearthed]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

The 5150 is a poor man's Soldano? Never heard that one before... Both amps sound considerably different.

John, it sounds to me like they want to use the 5150. I think that even if you came in with the Soldano rig they'd probably not be satisfied.

[Rupe]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

John, a couple of things:

1. What did they say about the 3203? That amp gets the tone you are looking for in spades.

2. For an 80's metal tone, you will not need to use a pedal in front of the SP77. It gets plenty of gain for that style...anything more will add more sustain but kill the "nuts" of your tone.

3. Its a fine line when dealing with producers. You have to listen to them to a degree but you can't let them dictate the fundamentals of your tone. Tweaking is ok, dictating what your tone will be is not unless you are a hired gun playing on someone else tracks. If you have a stake in this band you need to have a stake in your sound.

4. Another cost effective option is an original MP1 (the one with the switch on top). I still fall back on this unit used with a BBE 422A and a 2:90 power amp. Very few 80's metal tones I can't nail with this setup.

[jgcable]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

[ QUOTE ]
The 5150 is a poor man's Soldano? Never heard that one before... Both amps sound considerably different.

John, it sounds to me like they want to use the 5150. I think that even if you came in with the Soldano rig they'd probably not be satisfied.

[/ QUOTE ]

I actually have heard that comment before. Most if not all SLO and HR players claim that the 5150 is nothing like a Soldano. The only Soldano I ever owned or played was an Astroverb. It didn't sound like a 5150 at all. Not even close. It should be interesting when the SP77 arrives and I give it a go. If it doesn't work out I always have the 5150II as a fall back. I still want a different lead tone. I really don't care for playing solo's using a 5150 tone. They were excited to try out the Soldano so at least thats a step in the right direction. When I told them I sold my signature 5150 to get it I took a step in the opposite! I'll eventually sneak something in there. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[axeman81]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

sell all three and get a Herbert, that'll shut 'em up! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
hope it works out for the best dude [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img]

- Rune

[jgcable]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

[ QUOTE ]
John, a couple of things:

1. What did they say about the 3203? That amp gets the tone you are looking for in spades.

2. For an 80's metal tone, you will not need to use a pedal in front of the SP77. It gets plenty of gain for that style...anything more will add more sustain but kill the "nuts" of your tone.

3. Its a fine line when dealing with producers. You have to listen to them to a degree but you can't let them dictate the fundamentals of your tone. Tweaking is ok, dictating what your tone will be is not unless you are a hired gun playing on someone else tracks. If you have a stake in this band you need to have a stake in your sound.

4. Another cost effective option is an original MP1 (the one with the switch on top). I still fall back on this unit used with a BBE 422A and a 2:90 power amp. Very few 80's metal tones I can't nail with this setup.

[/ QUOTE ]

The 3203 really grew on them. We actually recorded several tracks using it. It does record VERY nicely. Not alot of tweaking with just a tone control though!!

[Fragle]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

mh...dude, don't try too hard. as others have already said, you're the new guy. sometimes you'll have to keep your mouth shut. instead of bitching about the whole amp thing, and how it's not you're tone you're putting on the record, better focus on your performance and totally blow them away.
also, as they've been around for around a decade, i'm sure this isn't their first album, isn't it? i don't know if there's a major label behind the whole thing, but if not i bet they invest/ed quite some money in this whole recording thing, and i'm not sure if you did, too. keep that in mind when arguing about the whole different tones for different players thing.

aside from that, i'm REALLY curious how the sp77 compares to your mkIII and the 5150.

[DSS3]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

I'd seriously suggest taking that 5150 and putting an overdrive pedal infront, with these settings:

Gain - 9:00
Tone - 10:30
Level - 12:00

Lower the gain on the 5150 a notch, and you'll be amazing at how much tighter the recorded sound will be. There's a reason Andy Sneap, Colin Richardson, and James Murphy run a tubescreamer infront of every amp they record with.

[jgcable]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

[ QUOTE ]
I'd seriously suggest taking that 5150 and putting an overdrive pedal infront, with these settings:

Gain - 9:00
Tone - 10:30
Level - 12:00

Lower the gain on the 5150 a notch, and you'll be amazing at how much tighter the recorded sound will be. There's a reason Andy Sneap, Colin Richardson, and James Murphy run a tubescreamer infront of every amp they record with.

[/ QUOTE ]

Their recorded 5150 tone is excellent. Trust me.. they know how to record and dial in a 5150. I just wanted my tone on the new songs to be a little more ME. They would prefer to use their tried an true 5150 tone. I want the tone to be more interesting.

[jgcable]

Re: 5150 versus Soldano SP77/Carvin T100

[ QUOTE ]
mh...dude, don't try too hard. as others have already said, you're the new guy. sometimes you'll have to keep your mouth shut. instead of bitching about the whole amp thing, and how it's not you're tone you're putting on the record, better focus on your performance and totally blow them away.
also, as they've been around for around a decade, i'm sure this isn't their first album, isn't it? i don't know if there's a major label behind the whole thing, but if not i bet they invest/ed quite some money in this whole recording thing, and i'm not sure if you did, too. keep that in mind when arguing about the whole different tones for different players thing.

aside from that, i'm REALLY curious how the sp77 compares to your mkIII and the 5150.

[/ QUOTE ]

I sold the Mark III and my 5150 signature head to pay for my house repairs caused by the flood. I am going to stay away from Mesa's for a while. If I like the SP77 I will eventually go for the HR50, the SLO or that motorized Soldano preamp which I believe is either the XR88 or XR99.