i know i have issues....need more amp advice

[Fragle]

i'm totally screwed up, really. the 5150 i purchased not too long ago sounds GREAT. it's definitely a step in the right direction, coming from my 2210 marshall. still, i'm short of pulling the trigger on *another* amp...

to me, the 5150 is what i wished my engl to sound like. it's very tight, has a nice low end "beef" (the resonance REALLY fattens up the sound), and has a great amount of mids, very brown in nature imho.
to give you a point of reference, i'm using it with a tube screamer for clean boost placed in front, and the EQ set to around (lead channel)
gain 4, bass 7, mid 4,5 , highs 4,5 , master to taste, resonance 8,5 , presence 5
(note: the TS is mandatory...it cleans up a lot of the lows, without it the sound has way too much loose bottom end; it also adds a nice high end coating)
to me, this sounds a lot like iced earth - live in athens, which TO ME is the van halen II sound on steroids

ok, to finally get to the point, what amp would you recommend if i wanted to take this even one step further? meaning even MORE tightness, basically VHII on SUPER steroids? as i said, schaffer's tone on alive in athens is pretty much stellar, but i *think* i like the something wicked this way comes tone a little better...seems to be thicker with an even smoother high end
maybe VHT? i KNOW engl doesn't do it for me...the basic voicing is there, but they get too damn harsh at high volumes. i don't want the highs to rip my ears off; i want them to rip me a new one if you know what i'm saying....

any ideas?
and yes, i'm an amp whore.... [img]/images/graemlins/help.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/help.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/help.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/help.gif[/img]

[Firebird V]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

Did you try the BBE in the loop? Or even an eq in the loop? I used to run a GE-7 and a NS-2 in the loop of mine. Maybe you have the right amp but just need something inbetween the preamp and the power section.

[jgcable]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

Soldano. My SP77 is everything a 5150 dreamed of being. Imagine what an SLO or an HR50+ or an Avenger is like.

[Fragle]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

no, i didn't try a BBE yet. the "good ones" (=422(A) etc) are REALLY rare over here, and apparently the 362 or whatever it is called is too extreme for guitar use.
i also haven't messed with the eq (yet).
to me it definitely semms like i'm really close....like 9.2/10

jg...soldano....mh, let me see. the sp77 is quite common over here. once in a while there's also a hr50. i know a store that has a bunch of soldano amps ready (at least the last time i went there)....maybe i can manage to head over there - i need new picks and strings anyways [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
how is the sp77 in terms of brutality? as you can see i only benefit from the overall voicing of the 5150, i do not use it to it's full potential regarding brutality (esp. regarding gain)
btw, out of all amp clips i've ever listened to, the avenger was the most impressing one.
WTF do soldanos look soooooo GAY [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[Firebird V]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice



That looks gay?

[DSS3]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

The Framus Cobra is like *the* 5150 sound on steriods, to me. It's the only amp I'd sell my 5150 for.

[Endrik]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

SLO or sp77 is too soft for Fragile's music. I think Uber is the right thing for you Fragile. It has the brown sound character and yet it is a very tight crushing metal amp.

[jgcable]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

I never tried a Framus Cobra but I heard the same comparison. Regarding the SP77, its a 5150 without the mush or the compression. Of course, you have to have the proper power amp too. I retubed my T100 with the same tubes the SLO uses. I did the same thing with the SP77. I play metal with the gain on 6. Its the same gain level as the 5150.
It took me a while to dial in the power amp and I am using Parametric EQ with it but the band agrees that its certainly a 5150 killer. The best thing about my SP77 is its lack of compression. I never played an SLO but I got to believe its a very open sounding amp and gets wider as it gets louder. I am only using a 2db solo boost and it cuts through a very loud mix with total clarity. The most common remark is:
Damn dude, turn down!! I can't hear my own amp and I am standing right in front of it!

Thats the clearest heaviest sound I have ever heard. I can hear every single note.
One thing to consider.. this is not a forgiving amp. If you fukk up... everybody will know it.

[aldog1330]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

Actually, I've heard the Cobra is a Recto on steriods, but I've never heard one so I can't confirm or deny that comment.

[Endrik]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

I've never played with Cobra but I've heard that it's totally different than the Recto. I've played with many amps and I got close to Recto's tone with only one of them, that was VH-4. Bogners, VHT, ENGL, 5150, Randalls, Soldanos etc. none of them sounded like Recto, they weren't even close. Most of them were tighter than the Recto, the others were more Marshally sounding, some even sounded like SS. But none of them were so IN YER FACE than the Recto.

[Endrik]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

I'm talkin' about the Recto's modern hi-gain "nu" metal tone of corse.

[slayer]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

Which VHT did you play? I use to have a VHT CLX 100 and it was very extremely in your face, the nastiest tightest in your face I have ever played thru, damn I miss that amp!! Jack.

[Fragle]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

well, first of all, yes, even this soldano looks gay [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
at least it doesn't have the purple tolex or whatever, but the faceplate with the butt ugly blue colored scales ruin it for me. *flame suit*

regarding the "In your face" thing. what exactly do you mean when saying in your face? if you're talking about immediate attack, a very clear and unforgiving sound so ever note punches you right "in the face", yes, that's what i'm looking for.
if you're talking about top end that bites your head off, lows that kick you out of the room, and in general a "punishing" sound, no, not really....
the 5150 as it sounds right now has a nice clarity (although the individual notes e.g. when playing triads with a distorted sound could ring through clearer) and a good bottom end tightness. my main gripe is that the highs do have a certain chainsaw character. it's so brutal, you think the amp is going to rip you apart. unfortunately, i *think* that this chainsaw character is part of the reason why the notes feel very "touchable" if you know what i mean. they really stand out in the room like a physical object.
this also what i noticed in VHT clips (i have yet to play or even hear one in real life). they have a very tight and quick response, but the tradeoff is a borderline harsh top end. screaming would be a good word to describe the highs.

and btw, what about a mesa mark XY ?

[jgcable]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

Rectifiers are great amps until you ask them to go toe to toe with a Marshall based amp. Usually, the Marshall will stomp the Rectifier into the ground. Why??? MIDRANGE.

You posted[img]/images/graemlins/baby.gif[/img] " you're talking about immediate attack, a very clear and unforgiving sound so ever note punches you right "in the face", yes, that's what i'm looking for.:

That sounds like a Soldano to me.

[Endrik]

Re: i know i have issues....need more amp advice

Fragile, I meant the punch in your face thing with the in your face comment.
I have played with many amps and Boogies are the most in your face amps I've ever played with. There are many other in your face amps too but the big difference is when you start to record. Record with Mesas and you still have that super in your face sound, the other amps need some serious tweaking in the mix to archive that. I don't why it is like that but the Mesas always have in your face punch.

My friend did a little test. He knows A LOT about amps and recording. He owns such equipment that I could only dream about. He recorded many different clips with many different amps. He used one Shure SM57--->Neve mic preamp--->API 40 board--->2" tape. This is the set-up wich has been used on a lot of billion dollar studios.
He recorded some classic rock riffs (Van Halen, Ratt, ACDC) and some modern metal riffs.
The amps he used were Mesa Boogie 3 channel Recto, Mark III Blue Stripe, Peavey 5150, ENGL Savage 120, Bogner Uberchall, Marshall JCM 800 with Tubescreamer, some kind of a Randall and a couple of other amps wich I don't remember. No he doesn't own them all, most of the amps are his friends'.

Ok the main difference between these amps was the tone character. Those sound clips sounded all great, no tone loss 'n shit. But the Boogies differed from the others not only by the tone character they just punched my fucking theeth out. It was soo brutally in my face that I couldn't belive it. I'm 100% that everyone would agree with me on that if they would have been there and listnening those sound clips even if they don't like Mesas tone at all. Heck the dude who recorded the clips isn't the biggest Boogie fan. I wish I could post them for you to listen but they are all on the 2" time somwhere in the Chech Rebublic.
Want to hear and see what I'm talkin' about, just do the same thing, record many takes with diffrent amps using high end pro recording gear and you'll see then what I'm talkin' about.
BUT, after hearing those clips I wouldn't use Boogies to record ACDC, RATT or VAN HALEN. My buddy nailed their tone but it was soo in your face that it didn't sound like a classic rock, more like a metal.

Fragile, you should also know that Boogies aren't the tightest amps around, I personally like a little looser tone but I don't know if that tone suits for your music. They are tight, but 5150 is way more IMO.
I suggest that you would try out the Bogner Uberchall, it is very tight and also has that VH brown tone there.

John, I can't agree with you about that bro, most of the EL34 tube amps are marshall based (Soldano isn't the only marshally amp). A lot of them (modern hi-gain amps specially) have a really scooped sound. Boogie's Mark amps have a very strong MIDS. I personally like Boogie's mids more than Marshalls because Boogie mids are more low-mids, marshall mids are high-mids. I like low-mids better, they sound more smoother to me.