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Tube vs. Non-tube - my assessment

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  • #16
    yeah 3-4 is about all I usually need on mine, but certain of my more distorted tones won't cut through unless I come up to about 5. that may be the open back on my combo though.

    different patches are at different sub-volumes also, which affects this, despite my intermittent attempts to get them to about the same level.

    one thing the Vetta does better than any other amp I've ever used - the cleans. fucking amazing cleans and chorus tones.
    the guitar players look damaged - they've been outcasts all their lives

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    • #17
      Originally posted by jgcable View Post
      My Vetta smokes any amp I have ever heard or played through.
      Live, rehearsal, studio, practice, recording... it gets rave reviews from every musician who has ever heard it.
      what kind of musicians? The kind who never heard a side by side comparison of the REAL things the computer chip is trying to emulate

      I agree they sound great by themselves and I bet you any amount of money you would not smoke my tube shit :ROTF:

      Also in another couple weeks you'll waiver again back to a tube amp that you'll claim is the nicest thing since sliced bread only to waiver back to your Vetta again
      shawnlutz.com

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      • #18
        every couple months, we get this modeler vs tube debate.
        yes, a high end tube amp feels and sounds a little bit better than the vetta.
        however, the vetta's sound is like 95% there, and most people can't hear the difference.
        add to the fact the vetta has almost zero maintainance costs, it's way more flexible with effects, etc., and it has tons of sounds.
        it's the equivualent of you lugging around like 5 amps to a gig.
        the vetta is perfect for a cover band situation, where you need tons of sounds and no tube amp is going to able to give you that.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Axewielder View Post
          I found that the Pod kind of strips away the individuality of my guitars. For example, when I record the same track multiple times using different guitars, I have a hard time telling them apart.
          Indeed!! All modelers do that. I can plug in a Tele in the neck position and then a Les Paul in the bridge position and they sound almost identical. For the most part it takes the quality of the guitar out of the equation. As long as the guitar stays in tune then you have it 'all' with the modeler ('all' meaning 'to the capabilities of the modeler'). A nice tube amp will emphasize the characteristics of a guitar.

          Put the Line 6 stuff in a room with a 6505 head and a Mesa halfback 4x12 cab and the Line 6 stuff seems very 'toy' like. For me, the Line 6 amps (and all modelers) are great for what they do but they don't do what tube amps do in my opinion.
          My Duncan Designed pickups are way better than Seymour Duncan regular pickups you fanboy.

          Yeah...too bad the forum doesn't have a minimum IQ.

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          • #20
            Tube amps are more organic to me. Modelers are great for there purpose but they do sound "fake" for lack of a better word.

            How can 1's and 0's and algorithims duplicate something natural like a tube. I dunno. Ive played line 6 stuff for years before getting a tube amp and there is a difference and I think a tube amp is more organic and natural sounding. Just my 2 cents.

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            • #21
              I've tried the Vetta and while it sounds pretty good, I can easily put together a long list of tube amps that crush it for tone and feel. I think where the Vetta really excels is in offering you an approximation of all those tube amps in one tidy package at a decent price. I could easily gig with one as the tones are good and the flexability is amazing, but the feel thing keeps me from doing it.

              I completely disagree about the above comment stating that the feel is "different" but not necessarily worse...there is really very little dynamic "feel" to the Vetta which makes it much worse IMO.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by data187 View Post
                every couple months, we get this modeler vs tube debate.
                yes, a high end tube amp feels and sounds a little bit better than the vetta.
                however, the vetta's sound is like 95% there, and most people can't hear the difference.
                add to the fact the vetta has almost zero maintainance costs, it's way more flexible with effects, etc., and it has tons of sounds.
                it's the equivualent of you lugging around like 5 amps to a gig.
                the vetta is perfect for a cover band situation, where you need tons of sounds and no tube amp is going to able to give you that.
                Randall MTS rack setup. All tube, I can select which 4 preamps I want, and ON THE FLY select between two totally different power amp sections - 6L6s, EL34s, KT88s, KT90s, KT66s, 6V6s, etc. For me, the feel and tone with the MTS setup and a Gmajor are superior to the Vetta, an amp that I had for quite awhile and even defended on here a lot. The Vetta is nice, but there are tube rigs that can beat it. I still haven't heard a modelling amp do what the Trainwrecks and clones can do either.

                Pete

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by yard dawg View Post
                  How can 1's and 0's and algorithims duplicate something natural like a tube.
                  Hmmm... so how is a sealed glass cylinder with a small metal plate heated by an electric current that passes invisible electrons through an inert gas in a vacuum... um... natural?
                  (flame suit ON)
                  My gear -> 2004 Jackson DK2 EDS, JT580LP trem, SD Custom Shop Crazy 8 trembucker (bridge), SSL-2 Vintage rw/rp (middle) and SSL-6 Custom (neck) single coils, CTS pots, 5-way super switch with custom wiring, GHS Boomers TNT 10-52, ENGL Powerball E645 V2 head, ENGL Custom Footswitch Z-5, Framus FR 212 CS cab

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                  • #24
                    For me the tube amp thing is mostly about feel/responsiveness, not so much about tone.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by cbope View Post
                      Hmmm... so how is a sealed glass cylinder with a small metal plate heated by an electric current that passes invisible electrons through an inert gas in a vacuum... um... natural?
                      (flame suit ON)
                      No, no flaming you here. I have both kinds, tube and SS. The simple answer, as far as I know, is the soft clipping of tubes. It originates in the power stage of the tube amp, and the dynamics of tube's response to signals as they go through the plates hasn't been duplicated quite perfectly by solid state components. So it has an pure analog signal,and a "natural" feel to it.
                      Trannies,on the other hand, can emulate well, depending on the design and construction of the components. But they don't clip the same way. They can mimic quite closely, but not exactly. IC's behave in a digital manner, 1 or zero, no in between. Tubes see all of it, and amplify across the range.
                      That is why tubes have survived. Check out sometime how audiophile stereo collectors are so passionate about their rigs. Because it works on both ends, making sounds and reproduction of sounds.
                      The whole thing can be boiled down to the analog/digital difference in music formats, like the difference between a good LP and the same CD.
                      The LP generally has more dynamic range. Same for guitar amps.

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                      • #26
                        I had a local GC worker rave about the Vetta to me, and then plugged in. Honestly, I was not at all impressed. Very sterile sounding, and I have owned my share of both tube and ss. The worst was watch Dave Navarro with his Vetta, TRYING to keep up with Raphael Moreira and his Bogner. Yikes.
                        I'm not Ron!

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                        • #27
                          Wow... I really didn't want this to become a flame fest. I love my Vetta and will continue to gig with it, but I just found that tubes are cool too.

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by lhrocker View Post
                            but I just found that tubes are cool too.
                            :ROTF::ROTF:
                            Sam

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by cbope View Post
                              Hmmm... so how is a sealed glass cylinder with a small metal plate heated by an electric current that passes invisible electrons through an inert gas in a vacuum... um... natural?
                              (flame suit ON)
                              Read this! ...and LEARN.
                              Vacuum Tubes and Radio Tubes Our specialty. We carry over 5,000 radio and vacuum tubes in stock every day and we ship world wide. Tubes for industry, music, ham radio, the audiophile.
                              Sam

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by emperor_black View Post
                                Great work, emperor. I don't know why I took the question seriously,
                                and fumbling through an answer was a mistake on my part.

                                It's like last weekend my 14 year old son was asking why I liked analog tuners on a stereo better than digital. I said, because I can make the stereo "learn" and eventually lock into FM stations 120 miles away, where the digital would just blank it or get static. The digital would see 99.2, then 99.3, and no in between. The analog would find an "infinite" divisible value in between, controlled by my touch. At least it would see 99.201,99.202,99.203, etc. until it hit 99.3.

                                I also know, sounds weird, that audio electronics "learn" sounds, even SS.
                                It's the same idea as the way engines and guitars are "broken in".

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