Cabinets

[Spivonious]

Are the valvestate cabs any good?

[joshulator]

While I do own and prefer a 1960BV, and while I've never played a large outdoor festival (although I did once perform on a trailer in a parking lot), I'm not sure I understand why one's speaker cabinet would matter that much. Wouldn't a festival of that size be mic'ing your cabinet anyway and giving you whatever you need in your monitors??

[horns666]

Are the valvestate cabs any good?

Ummm they're OK with a 8100, but nothing like a 1960. I don't like Vintage 30 with Marshall..Marshalls are ALL mids..it's nice to be able to get more of a scooped sound with the 75.s IMO!..They have much better bass response, which Marshall is not known for and a nice "bite" for squeals, pings, harnonics and such..but there's still plenty of mids that cut thru any mix..which Marshall is known for.

Vin 30's sounded best in a Recto cab, that's the only time I thought they sounded pretty good.

[markD]

While I do own and prefer a 1960BV, and while I've never played a large outdoor festival (although I did once perform on a trailer in a parking lot), I'm not sure I understand why one's speaker cabinet would matter that much. Wouldn't a festival of that size be mic'ing your cabinet anyway and giving you whatever you need in your monitors??

the biggest thing to remember about outdoor festivals is that the sound is NOT contained very well. you won't get bounce-back like you do in a club...the sound leaves and rarely comes back...

having played a couple, one of the big issues with outdoor festivals, unless they are huge annual festivals (and even those can have issues), is that often weather conditions will effect the movement of sound. if you get a cross breeze and the sound company has the side of the stage open a huge amount of sound, monitors included will sweep in the direction of the wind.

many times, the FOH system will be very powerful, but the monitor system will be adequate at best. promoters aren't AS worried if the performer can hear. multiple cabs can help eliminate that issue in regards to your OWN sound. as far as monitoring what others are doing, it's a crap shoot. sometimes it's fine, sometimes it's a nightmare.

i have found that if i can get a couple of cabinets (on speaker stands since i use 1x12s) around the stage (my area as well as around the drummer) i can hear myself better. a lot of the time the bassist will use multiple cabs also so i can hear him. the concept we often discuss, "oh it goes through the PA anyway" doesn't always fly...especially when it comes to hearing yourself or your band mates.

example...we played one of the local "taste of pinellas" shows a few years back. we were early on the bill, second if i remember correctly, and the sound company didn't have the side of the stage covered. the "taste of pinellas" is a huge food event that is set-up along the waterfront. we get really strong winds of the bay, and those winds were blowing across the stage. it FELT good, but the sound was like having somebody turning the volume up and down constantly during our set. out front, it wasn't so bad i was told, but onstage, EVREYTHING, including drums would come and go. it was hellish.

another time we played a "livestock" show out in zephrihills, fl. again, the FOH was awesomely loud, but the monitors...ugh. we each got ONE, and it had a single 12 and a horn. couldn't hear SHIT except drums....or guitar...or bass, and that was dependant upon WHERE you stood on the stage. the vocalist couldn't hear himself at all. i couldn't hear the bass for leads. that was when i WAS using a marshall 4x12....it was a rough set.

anyway, you can get by with one cab, but depending on the situation, your sound will vanish...it's hard to explain, but i hope that helps a little....

[markD]

Ummm they're OK with a 8100, but nothing like a 1960. I don't like Vintage 30 with Marshall..Marshalls are ALL mids..it's nice to be able to get more of a scooped sound with the 75.s IMO!..They have much better bass response, which Marshall is not known for and a nice "bite" for squeals, pings, harnonics and such..but there's still plenty of mids that cut thru any mix..which Marshall is known for.

Vin 30's sounded best in a Recto cab, that's the only time I thought they sounded pretty good.

i like the valvestate cab. it's more compact that a 1960, and to my ears the sound is more focused. it comes with 35 watt celestions that i really like. i think it is great as an EXTENSION cab, not a main cab....

[joshulator]

the biggest thing to remember about outdoor festivals is that the sound is NOT contained very well. you won't get bounce-back like you do in a club...the sound leaves and rarely comes back...

having played a couple, one of the big issues with outdoor festivals, unless they are huge annual festivals (and even those can have issues), is that often weather conditions will effect the movement of sound. if you get a cross breeze and the sound company has the side of the stage open a huge amount of sound, monitors included will sweep in the direction of the wind.

many times, the FOH system will be very powerful, but the monitor system will be adequate at best. promoters aren't AS worried if the performer can hear. multiple cabs can help eliminate that issue in regards to your OWN sound. as far as monitoring what others are doing, it's a crap shoot. sometimes it's fine, sometimes it's a nightmare.

i have found that if i can get a couple of cabinets (on speaker stands since i use 1x12s) around the stage (my area as well as around the drummer) i can hear myself better. a lot of the time the bassist will use multiple cabs also so i can hear him. the concept we often discuss, "oh it goes through the PA anyway" doesn't always fly...especially when it comes to hearing yourself or your band mates.

example...we played one of the local "taste of pinellas" shows a few years back. we were early on the bill, second if i remember correctly, and the sound company didn't have the side of the stage covered. the "taste of pinellas" is a huge food event that is set-up along the waterfront. we get really strong winds of the bay, and those winds were blowing across the stage. it FELT good, but the sound was like having somebody turning the volume up and down constantly during our set. out front, it wasn't so bad i was told, but onstage, EVREYTHING, including drums would come and go. it was hellish.

another time we played a "livestock" show out in zephrihills, fl. again, the FOH was awesomely loud, but the monitors...ugh. we each got ONE, and it had a single 12 and a horn. couldn't hear SHIT except drums....or guitar...or bass, and that was dependant upon WHERE you stood on the stage. the vocalist couldn't hear himself at all. i couldn't hear the bass for leads. that was when i WAS using a marshall 4x12....it was a rough set.

anyway, you can get by with one cab, but depending on the situation, your sound will vanish...it's hard to explain, but i hope that helps a little....

Thanks! Maybe now I have justification for purchasing a second 4x12!! I've always wanted 4, but deep down I knew I was only motivated by looks. How shallow!!

[Shawn Lutz]

Bogner 4x12's rule
VHT 4x12's rule
Old Marshall 4x12's rule
Splawn 4x12's rule

Soldano 4x12's cabs don't rule

btw.. I have all 5 of those cabs. Personal preference aside, speaker and amp choice will determine which one will suite you needs.

[Endrik]

for stage definitely get a wall of full stack Marshalls.... 32 in total would get the job tone... but for the actual tone which is mean to be miced... use any type of cab you like the best

[Spivonious]

I may have a lead on some VS412s that have Celestion "Goldbacks" in them. From my research these appear to be a cheaper version of the greenback, whose tone I do like. I would either use both 4x12s at once or one 4x12 as an extension cab to my combo amp, which has a G-Flex speaker in it.

[markD]

for stage definitely get a wall of full stack Marshalls.... 32 in total would get the job tone... but for the actual tone which is mean to be miced... use any type of cab you like the best

if you went crazy, 8 would get the jobe done, 4 on each side of the stage. i played a festival once that had a supplied backline - 8 marshall cabs, 4 on each side, 4 ampeg 8x10 cabs - 2 on each side. they had a slaving system setup. it was pretty cool.

your head plugged into 1 cab. from there they took the signal from your line-out (or a direct box if you had no line-out) and sent it to separate power amps. this particular show was using VHT 2:150 amps to drive the guitar cabs and crown macrotech 1200's to run the bass cabs. that was pretty slick.

the mic'd cab was the one your amp was plugged directly into. it was neat. i just showed up with my head, effects and guitars. THAT show was outside too, but they REALLY had their shit together. NO sound issues for that one....

[DonP]

good one!!

I guess I should have qualified that markD is a much better guitarist than I and knows a lot more shit about outdoor playing than I do. I'd listen to what he has to say about playing outdoors.