What's all the hype about Axe Fx?

[hippietim]

Thats nothing that Boss or Roland hasn't done before.

Actually, it is. There is nothing I know of from Roland that let's me plug in a normal guitar and sound like that. I can get close with a VG-99 with a GK divided pickup. And of course using a MIDI synth.

[jgcable]

Actually, it is. There is nothing I know of from Roland that let's me plug in a normal guitar and sound like that. I can get close with a VG-99 with a GK divided pickup. And of course using a MIDI synth.

My old Boss GT-8 had an outstanding strings patch. I used it all the time.

[jgcable]

I hope this Axe FX really takes off because I would like to get another Vetta 2 eventually and it will knock the price down a ton on one.

[hippietim]

My old Boss GT-8 had an outstanding strings patch. I used it all the time.

I'd have to hear the GT-8 again then. Because neither the GS-10 or GT-10 have anything that sound anywhere near as good as that patch. The synth sounds on the GT stuff sound like a cheap Casion going through an AM radio.

[nateb]

I hope this Axe FX really takes off because I would like to get another Vetta 2 eventually and it will knock the price down a ton on one.

Check out the Axe forums... Last time I checked there, there was a few of them being dumped off.

-Nate

[Flatpicker]

Here's a question for the group.
I realize that I have to use some kind of powered speaker for use out of the house, but, if I'm home I don't want all the extra speakers in the living room.

Can I patch into the home stereo and use the speakers I have at home?

I have the atomic for now, but I want to move that back into the basement/studio area.

[hippietim]

your home stereo should be fine.

[Flatpicker]

Cool,
I'm looking into 12ma's for travel, but I mostly wanted this for home recording and low volume tones. I don't play out besides the occasional get together/jam session anymore.

The basement/studio is still unfinished, but, i've been telling myself to have it completed for 3 years already. I have it worked on whenever I have some available funds.

[beachjammer]

Okay, this is far from normal guitar playing, but this is one of the most interesting AxeFx YouTube vids I've seen:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68y1gjEHiBM

Close your eyes and it sounds like a real violin/cello!

That was freaking cool!!! I'd like to hear Yngwie on one of these!

[Matt_B]

At home, I used a pair of Edirol (Roland) MA-15Ds for my "watching TV" rig. They work nicely because they have a digital input and (2) line inputs, one of which I plug my iPod into for accompaniment.

Upstairs, in the recording room/den, I used a pair of M-Audio AV-30s which are fed by the analog outs on my audio card (the Axe-FX feeds the SPDIF in on the sound card).

I wanted to used relatively flat powered speakers (e.g. recording monitors) so when I created my patches, I wouldn't have to worry about the speakers I was using coloring the sound that much, if at all.

[jgcable]

I hate to say it guys but this is the same hype and action that threads got when the Vetta first came out. Everybody wanted one, threads were active as all heck, there were forums everywhere regarding modeling and especially the Vetta. Then... the honeymoon was over and everybody went back to tube amps or whatever.
Same thing is gonna happen with this software amp.
I am the first one usually sucked into new technology. Luckily.. this software amp is just too expensive for my tastes.
Most players aren't going to play string patches through their guitars, most players don't need multiple amp sounds.
What most players want is this....
A good to great clean tone with tons of headroom. This clean tone usually has some reverb or delay and some chorus on it.
A good to great rhythm tone that is either based on a Mesa or a Marshall. It needs to be tight and articulate and react well to palm muting.
A nice saturated lead tone that is basically a boosted rhythm tone with more mids and some effects like delay,reverb or both.
The amp needs to be able to push air through a basic cabinet loaded with basic quality Celestion speakers. Most players use either V 30's or T75's.
The amp needs to react well to volume differences on the guitar.
So... thats 2 tones and a volume boost. For effects.. thats delay, reverb and chorus.
Why am I listing the above? Its because having a software driven modeling amp like a Axe FX or a Vetta or any other modeling rig turns a player from a player to a tweaker. You spend so much time tweaking you are barely playing. Once you get all your patches set at home you feel like you can conquer the world. Then.. something aweful usually happens. You take your kick ass rig with your kick ass patches to rehearsal or to a gig and you wind up having tweak all your patches all over again while your bandmates get pissed off. They say.... "John, you only use a few basic tones.. and your last amp sounded great. Just a few pedals on the floor and you were good to go. Why do you need a rig that can give you any tone on the planet when you only need a few". My response was because it sounded cool and tweaking is fun. After spending hours retweaking my rig during rehearsal only to find out that I would have to retweak it if I used different cabs pushed me away from software driven modeling amps.
There really is something to say about a good guitar amp, a good speaker cabinet and minimal effects in a live setting.
I do think that this Axe FX craze is just that.. a craze. Sounds like an incredible technology to have in the recording studio though.
Another point to ponder is this... if the Vetta and the Vetta 2 were that good.. how come most players that bought one ended up selling them.
Now.. if you respond " because they really weren't that good" I understand , but the Vetta was getting the same rave reviews that the Axe Fx is getting now.
All I am saying is don't be so quick to sell all your high end amps and effects for something that you can only hear clips online of. I want to hear one live in a club setting with a real band banging it out. Thats the true test.

[toxikdeth]

I hate to say it guys but this is the same hype and action that threads got when the Vetta first came out. Everybody wanted one, threads were active as all heck, there were forums everywhere regarding modeling and especially the Vetta. Then... the honeymoon was over and everybody went back to tube amps or whatever.
Same thing is gonna happen with this software amp.
I am the first one usually sucked into new technology. Luckily.. this software amp is just too expensive for my tastes.
Most players aren't going to play string patches through their guitars, most players don't need multiple amp sounds.
What most players want is this....
A good to great clean tone with tons of headroom. This clean tone usually has some reverb or delay and some chorus on it.
A good to great rhythm tone that is either based on a Mesa or a Marshall. It needs to be tight and articulate and react well to palm muting.
A nice saturated lead tone that is basically a boosted rhythm tone with more mids and some effects like delay,reverb or both.
The amp needs to be able to push air through a basic cabinet loaded with basic quality Celestion speakers. Most players use either V 30's or T75's.
The amp needs to react well to volume differences on the guitar.
So... thats 2 tones and a volume boost. For effects.. thats delay, reverb and chorus.
Why am I listing the above? Its because having a software driven modeling amp like a Axe FX or a Vetta or any other modeling rig turns a player from a player to a tweaker. You spend so much time tweaking you are barely playing. Once you get all your patches set at home you feel like you can conquer the world. Then.. something aweful usually happens. You take your kick ass rig with your kick ass patches to rehearsal or to a gig and you wind up having tweak all your patches all over again while your bandmates get pissed off. They say.... "John, you only use a few basic tones.. and your last amp sounded great. Just a few pedals on the floor and you were good to go. Why do you need a rig that can give you any tone on the planet when you only need a few". My response was because it sounded cool and tweaking is fun. After spending hours retweaking my rig during rehearsal only to find out that I would have to retweak it if I used different cabs pushed me away from software driven modeling amps.
There really is something to say about a good guitar amp, a good speaker cabinet and minimal effects in a live setting.
I do think that this Axe FX craze is just that.. a craze. Sounds like an incredible technology to have in the recording studio though.
Another point to ponder is this... if the Vetta and the Vetta 2 were that good.. how come most players that bought one ended up selling them.
Now.. if you respond " because they really weren't that good" I understand , but the Vetta was getting the same rave reviews that the Axe Fx is getting now.
All I am saying is don't be so quick to sell all your high end amps and effects for something that you can only hear clips online of. I want to hear one live in a club setting with a real band banging it out. Thats the true test.

Everything you said is true. I keep on getting sucked into the modeling stuff instead of buying a tube amp. At one point I has a carvin v3 and liked it, was the only tube amp I ever boght. I eventually sold it for more modeling stuff sure they soundeed good and I thought it was a smart decision at first but then relized that they dont react like a tube amp and are not as warm. I am in a position where I am redesigning my rig and started thinking about an axe fx instead of a good tube amp but you helped mee realize that for my needs wich is basically what you have listed clean channel with various effects, dry rythem, and lead with some delay a tube amp and g major would work better

[sevser]

I remember a LOT more skepticism with the Vetta stuff...Seems like there are more "Tube guys" into this unit.

[jgcable]

Keep in mind.. I am not saying that a Axe Fx doesn't sound great.. or warm.. or that it doesn't sound like a real amp. What I am saying is for most of us.. we really only need a good quality guitar amp, a speaker cabinet and a few basic stomp boxes or an effects processor.
Most of us are particular to one type of high gain tone and one type of clean tone.
No matter how many tones are crammed into a software amp.. you are only going to use the ones you are particular to and the ones that suit the music that you play.
I think a rig like the Axe Fx would be outstanding for a top 40 player or even better yet.. a wedding band player who needs a ton of different tones. I feel that way about any of the modelers out there. For the typical player in a metal band.. its not necessary to have a rig that can mimic a violin or a hundred different types of boutique amps. If you want a Marshall tone.. buy a Marshall or a hotrodded amp based on a Marshall. If you are in the Mesa club.. get a Boogie. Same thing with Engl, Bogner, Soldano etc... For the money it costs to build a live rig based on the Axe Fx you have a ton of live amp rigs to choose from. Based on what I read.. by the time you purchase an Ultra and a decent cab and a quality power amp you are probably in the $3000.00 range. You can get a heck of alot of real guitar amps for that kind of coin. Lets build a few.. shall we??
I'll start a new thread for it so we don't dilute this one any further...

[Matt_B]

I hate to say it guys but this is the same hype and action that threads got when the Vetta first came out.

Lots of new gear garners hype when it first comes out but the Axe-FX is about 3 yrs old now and it's gathering steam. Things like the Vetta are popular at first because of what people believe it can do vs. what it can do which is only discovered after folks have had time to really put the gear through it's paces.

Same thing is gonna happen with this software amp.

Not for me. I'm done with tubes and I've never said that before...ever.

I am the first one usually sucked into new technology. Luckily.. this software amp is just too expensive for my tastes.

You keep referring to as a "software amp" but it's not just that, it's also a top-of-the-line effects processor and some of the "magic" (in the Axe-FX) is not just software, it's also hardware.

Most players aren't going to play string patches through their guitars, most players don't need multiple amp sounds.

I won't disagree with that. Analog synth patches are fun to play with but that's about all I've done with them. As for dual amp patches, I haven't even bothered to mess with those yet because I haven't found a need for it.

What most players want is this....
A good to great clean tone with tons of headroom. This clean tone usually has some reverb or delay and some chorus on it.

Agreed and the Axe-FX can do that six ways to Sunday. For example, I don't always like chorus for clean sounds. Sometimes I like to used pitch detuning.

A good to great rhythm tone that is either based on a Mesa or a Marshall. It needs to be tight and articulate and react well to palm muting.

Agreed and of course the Axe-FX can do this. The question then becomes which Marshall or Mesa do you want? JCM800, JCM900, JTM45? Rectifier, MK II, Triaxis?

A nice saturated lead tone that is basically a boosted rhythm tone with more mids and some effects like delay,reverb or both.

Agreed and again the Axe-FX can do this.

The amp needs to be able to push air through a basic cabinet loaded with basic quality Celestion speakers. Most players use either V 30's or T75's.

While the Axe-FX can do these cabs, not everyone wants to or needs to push air through a guitar cab in a live situation. Be able to run through the main and monitors (be they wedges or IEMs) makes getting a well mixed sound so much easier. Not to mention

The amp needs to react well to volume differences on the guitar.

I've not found any of the other modelers (Boss, Line 6 or Vox) that respond to dynamics (be they volume control or pick driven) that respond like a tube amp does...or the Axe-FX. That's what sold me one it (after I tried it for myself).

So... thats 2 tones and a volume boost. For effects.. thats delay, reverb and chorus.

Why am I listing the above? Its because having a software driven modeling amp like a Axe FX or a Vetta or any other modeling rig turns a player from a player to a tweaker. You spend so much time tweaking you are barely playing.

I disagree. One can tweak as much or as little as they want. I still spend more time playing than tweaking because I know how to get what I want quickly.

Once you get all your patches set at home you feel like you can conquer the world. Then.. something aweful usually happens. You take your kick ass rig with your kick ass patches to rehearsal or to a gig and you wind up having tweak all your patches all over again while your bandmates get pissed off. They say.... "John, you only use a few basic tones.. and your last amp sounded great. Just a few pedals on the floor and you were good to go. Why do you need a rig that can give you any tone on the planet when you only need a few". My response was because it sounded cool and tweaking is fun. After spending hours retweaking my rig during rehearsal only to find out that I would have to retweak it if I used different cabs pushed me away from software driven modeling amps. [/QUOTE]See, that's the thing. If you go away from a guitar based amplification solution (no tube amp and no guitar speakers) then you really don't need to re-tweak your patches. Using an FRFR solution makes your getting "your sound" consistently infinitely easier.

There really is something to say about a good guitar amp, a good speaker cabinet and minimal effects in a live setting.

I agree. It does what it does but it's not infallible and it's invariably very limited.

I do think that this Axe FX craze is just that.. a craze. Sounds like an incredible technology to have in the recording studio though.

Only time will tell but again, it's been around for 3 yrs. and the product is getting better all the time.

Another point to ponder is this... if the Vetta and the Vetta 2 were that good.. how come most players that bought one ended up selling them.
Now.. if you respond " because they really weren't that good" I understand , but the Vetta was getting the same rave reviews that the Axe Fx is getting now.

Again, the Axe-FX is 3 yrs old and it's constantly improving. There has never been a modeler manufacturer that consistenly released upgrades to their product as much as Fractal Audio has. It's also a very small company akin to other boutique amp manufacturers like Mesa and the like.

All I am saying is don't be so quick to sell all your high end amps and effects for something that you can only hear clips online of. I want to hear one live in a club setting with a real band banging it out. Thats the true test.

I agree to a point because for me, the true test was playing it for myself. Hearing how it sounds it one thing but "feeling" how it responds is a whole other thing.

Based upon the experience you've shared, I can understand your prejudice against the Axe-FX. I too felt the same way (to a point) until I tried it for myself. Once I could replicate the sound and feel of my MP-1s I was sold.

And please understand that I don't think any modeler, including the Axe-FX, is for everyone just like any other piece of gear. That said, the fact is no other manufacturer has taken the approach that Fractal Audio has from an engineering standpoint, design philosophy or support.