Judas Priest..What happened?

[Newc]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

I'm all over the double-bass drumming, but only where it fits, and it doesn't fit Judas Priest. Artistic Growth is one thing, but a leopard cannot change its spots, and adding double-bass to almost every Priest track changes the song drastically.
It sounds more like Judas Priest doing covers of someone else's work.

But maybe me and 442w30 are the only ones here who can listen to those albums as a fan of the BAND, not as a guitarist or musical technician? [img]/images/graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

Technical Achievements are worthless compared to the Art Of The Song.

[horns666]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

"I'm sorry now that I wasn't into JP earlier, 'cause most of the shit that I was really emotionally invested into in the 80's has disappeared into oblivion — Celtic Frost, Cirith Ungol, Omen, Hallow's Eve, Nuclear Assault,Annihilator, Rage, etc..

Necro those bands didn't go into oblivion most of them are live and well...YOU would SHIT if you saw my cd collection...I have all that stuff and then some...I have every single release by every band you just mentioned..Rage especially ..18 Rage albums and counting!!!

and as far as Van Williams of Nevermore is concerned ...that is your opinion and a lonely one at that...Van is a cool dude , friend and one hell of a drummer In my book...and I got the biggest book of metal than anyone you know!

For the record I know Tim Owens very well..he's a very talented singer but he'll be the first to admit he's no Halford..he wouldn't exist without Halford....he's in a band called Beyond Fear now with some dude that John and I know..

you guys have to understand ...I buy about 300 bucks worth of metal every month..I have it all...I keep on top of all of it man ...and If I don't have it yet...it'll be here soon..all of it...if it don't suck!

Metal is my life...

I tried to compile a list of all my metal here on the JCF...but it is impossible to keep up with...I just want to share the joy...I think I got thru most of the Power metal..if I remember right..it's alot of work...too much work!

[horns666]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

NEWC ...I'm getting a crash course in Drums for the last four years ...because of my son...believe me there is NOTHING unfitting about Travis's kick on Painkiller...not in the slightest...he is clean , articulate , has a great sound , great meter and never overplays...the overplaying part should go to KK and Glen ..there is a 15 minute guitar solo in each of those songs on Painkiller..half the song is solos...Scott is just runnin' and keepin' time!!

Travis kicked them in the ass...that is what they wanted and that is what they got...Scott Travis is THE perfect drummer for JP...obviously JP thinks so..and they could get anyone they want.

[Newc]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

That much is true, but I feel they lost sight of who Judas Priest was. It's their band, obviously, and they're free to do with it what they want, but as a Judas Priest Fan from the early 80's, I don't like anything done after Defenders.
Tim Owens did a great Halford impression on Live 98, but Living After Midnight (Live disc with almost the same set list) kicks its ass.

And I'm not saying he's sloppy or overplaying, I'm saying that what he's doing doesn't fit Judas Priest. High-speed riffs are nice to listen to and they're impressive when done right, and GT and KK and Scott can definitely do them right, but it comes at the expense of the Groove they're best known for. Now they sound like old Megadeth or Metallica or any other Thrash/Speed band, and it sounds like they're trying to play catchup to those groups.

ZZ Top is the only band I've seen that could get away with incorporating new/modern stuff into their songs with the synths and drum machines and poppish/rappish stuff on Eliminator and the ones after that.

[the_drip]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

ok...can we go one thread without mentioning nevermore? Let's make that our goal. No comparisons to nevermore for an entire week. Can we do it? I don't think so.


they don't even have nice tits.

[horns666]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

"Now they sound like old Megadeth or Metallica or any other Thrash/Speed band, and it sounds like they're trying to play catchup to those groups."

I don't see that at all...So..I guess we can agree to disaree..

actually if anthing..If JP wants to "catch up" with anyone...it probably what is coming out of Europe..such as Gamma Ray , Primal Fear , Helloween , Iron Savoir and ...I can see those comparisons...and all those bands are JP worshippers..

Drummers , Guitarists , well they just got better and better with time..double kicks were rare back in the day ...but now it's mandatory..it's metal evolution...

you can hardly find any Metal bands nowadays whether it be Power , Black , or Death metal that don't incoporate blast beats and hyper double kicks to 90% of their music..the benchmark for drummers has been raised to unbeliveable standards...as well as guitarist...and gear is getting better and more high tech so that these drummers can execute their skills ..

Just like "fast action" necks...well drum kit and accesories are built for speed....and these kids are flyin' on their kicks effortlessly now... at a rate that was unheard of just ten years ago ...

I think it's great...Metal is better than ever because of it!

[Newc]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

But then we get back into the "Speed for the sake of Speed" and "fast=good" arguments, which I will never agree with [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[horns666]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

Drip ..you are asking for the impossible..

for some reason Nevermore is one of those bands you love or hate..

how people can bash a talented bunch of guys like Nevermore is beyond me...I really think it's over there heads...they don't get it..it overwhelms their capabilty to absorb and comprehend.

the ones that bash them...well I need some "credibility" here...I want to hear them do better...until then ..they are just blowing worthless smoke up our asses..

Drip ...you know I know metal...all metal across the board. as you know drip there is good and suck in every genre...but some people would rather hear a crappy power metal band than a good black metal band...because they have no clue..what good and bad is in those genres...they are not exposed to it...or they refused to listen because the singer...screams...or growls..or whatever..

I think that is pretty closed minded.

[horns666]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

NEWC..as we all know...fast can be a good thing..if it is done very well with feel....

just like fuckin'! [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[horns666]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

I like all JP...old.. new...Ram it down kinda sucked..

that's my story..

bye.. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[Posepatrol]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

[ QUOTE ]


BTW Painkiller is one of my favorite albums for good reason...they finally got a REAL drummer...and that just kicked them in the fuckin' ass!

[/ QUOTE ]


+1

[~K~]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

Saw them sunday ..all I can say is for a bunch of old guys they still rip ..

[MBreinin]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

I just think it is funny that JP has records called "Point of Entry" and "Ram It Down". [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

I was never a big fan of Priest, they just didn't do it for me. However, I love that tune "Turbo Lover"....great chords and heaviness.

Mike

[Cryothrasher]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

umm...Painkiller kicks ass

[Endrik]

Re: Judas Priest..What happened?

uhh about the drumming,
simple 16th note double bass wanking is by far the easyest thing in drumming. You need just some physical training. There is nothing complex about it. Just a fast steady beat.

And it gets annoying when it is played a lot. It is just like when the guitar player tremolo picks on one note all the time. It starts to annoy.

Double bass technique is a good thing, it is necessary on some parts, but a lot of metal drummers make it sound awful. Most of them use triggers anyway, and the kick drum samples most of them use are really bad, really high sonding not bassy and the stupid sound engineer mixes the kick drums so loud. And there you have it, kick drum is in the same pitch and so loud like the snare drum. This is fucking awful.
Kick drum job is to make the whole mix massive, giving a good low end attack to the mix, but when it is done like I said above, then the mix sounds afwul, no mass, only fast wanking in high pitch frequenzies.
Dream Theater's Train Of Trought and Nevermore's EOR are one of the few new metal albums that has a good kick sound.

Back to the bouble bass technique, as I said, it starts to annoy, it is just like guitar tremolo picking on one note.
Drummer has to use his HANDS too. Combaining different beats together with all the toms, snare and cymbals is just like playing a cool guitar solo. Most of the metal drummers who has a fast dobule kick technique can't do jackshit with their hands. They hit with their full arms, no wrist job at all.

ALL the great players have a very good wrist technique, ALL of them. You can't play fast paradidels on hi-hat if you hit them with full arms. You need a good wrist technique.
Jazz, fusion, latin music (samba, bossa-nova), prog etc. are 1000 times more difficult then metal when it comes to drumming. I know. I have some really good freinds who are amazing drummers and can play almost EVERYTHING.
All that music is based on wrist technique on drums. And there are so many complex rhythms there. Some latin beats are when you play 4 TOTALY different rhythms together.

My point is that double bass is a good thing, but it is so "over-rated" and wrongly done by so many artists, they misunderstand what is the point of kick drum and how to use it and how to tune it and how to record it and...blah blah blah...