Robbin Crosby....RIP

[thetruthguy]

I don't think it was that obvious. The air around this board seems to be one of pity for RC. If if was that obvious, I wouldn't think there'd be so much discussion about how tragic his life was. Class has nothing to do with it. I'm not going to walk on eggshells about something like this. People do drugs for many reasons, one of which is because they idolize rock stars and sports figures who do drugs. Giving credence to drug use by glorifying it in shows like BTM makes me a bit nervous. They don't just show the downfall and the destruction that drugs cause; they make it look cool and like the reason RC died in the end was because his friends abandoned him. In truth, it was his actions ... actions which may have stemmed from drug use. Drug use will never go away, partly because of it constantly being glorified in the media and elsewhere. It's obvious VH1 was playing the pity card to make the BTM interesting. And on the Pantera one, they most definitely made it look like drinking was mandatory for a rock star. Now, Dime's death was a tragedy. He didn't deserve that. But that doesn't take away the fact that boozing and shooting up are shown in a flattering light on these shows. In almost every scene, people are smoking, drinking, or using drugs. And people wonder why teens start doing the same.

[sambencuda]

Addiction is a disease plain and simple. Yes, he went into using whatever he used knowing the risks, but much like alcoholism, addiction to any substance is a disease. My family has it's share of alcoholics and if one of them should die as a result of that, I'll be destroyed. Should I not feel bad because they chose to drink?

[~K~]

Truthguy .. how about taking into account that some of Robbins friends are actually members of this board, step back and understand how your comments are a bit heartless and cold. Whether Robbin lived like a king or died like a pauper does not sentence him to the demise he was handed. No one ever deserves that outcome no matter what the circumstance.

[Hellraiser6502]

Heh

Robbin never wanted or asked for pity and I don't think anyone is handing him any. HE took responsibility for his actions and so should you.

The bottom line is...just because you CAN say something...doesn't mean you SHOULD.

In other words, NEVER miss a good chance to shut the fuck up.

You asked for flames, you got 'em. Now Burn.

[thetruthguy]

Karma.

Addiction is a disease as defined by psychiatrists in the DSMV manuals and similar, but there is ample debate as to whether or not true biological addiction is occurring. Most likely, what's happening is psychological and a form of conditioning, spurred by addictive personalities and lives of excess. In other words, learned behavior. Addiction places the blame outside of the affected person and allows the person to feel sorry for himself/herself. To me, this is a very powerful and dangerous way of thinking, because when people drink too much, eat too much, or whatever, it's not their fault; however, people should take the blame for their actions. At the end of the BTM, Robbin did say some powerful things about how he does take responsibility. I've not got anything against him. It's just there's an air around here that what happened to him was tragic and it wasn't. Tragedy befalls victims. Robbin was no victim. As was said, he did take responsibility; he knew what he was getting into and accepted the consequences. So, too, should we accept this. As the law stands now, drug use is a crime. Should we also feel sorry for all the drug-users who committ countless crimes to get their fixes? I don't think so. I don't know Robbin Crosby. I'm not trying to make judgments. But he was a drug user ... no different from any other drug user. Why do we change what drug use is when someone has celebrity status? It's the same thing, and I don't have much respect for people who make this choice (yes, choice), because there are ultimately better and more positive ways to deal with problems.

[sully]

i second curt's statements in that he never asked for anyone's sorrow. if you saw the part of the BTM episode where he says "don't feel sorry for me", etc, he was being genuine. he knew what he was doing, he knew that his actions had consequences that he was living. it doesn't change the fact that he was a person. a friend. a son. a brother. his addiction and his end is tragic; it's sad because he couldn't find a way to overcome the pain that he had any other way. it's not one dimensional; his existence in life wasn't "junkie loser scumbag." he was a talented, sweet, and loving person who sadly isolated himself as a way of dealing with pain that he had for a long time. he wasn't all fine and dandy until he became some rock star one day and started doing drugs that he couldn't handle.

i sincerely hope that you don't have friends that have addictions, and that you don't have to see friends waste their gifts in life. i hope that no one close to you throws their life away because they don't see their own potential in life. or if you do someday, i hope you don't turn your back on them and write them off.

i understand what you're saying in that shows like this may show others that it's okay to not care about your general well being and it's okay to go ahead and shoot up heroin, etc. i'd think that robbin's story in the episode does the exact opposite; before they show footage of him in his last tv interview, you see him as young and on top of the world. then you get to see how far he'd fallen. there was no rising from the ashes; he fucking died. yeah, no one killed him but himself. i get that. it's okay to have some empathy for that person on a human level for the reasons i've already posted. i don't expect everyone to feel bad for him, but i do think that the "he did it to himself, fuck him" attitude is an unfortunate one. i don't expect to change your mind, and that's okay. but i tell ya, the fact that a friend of mine is no longer living because he couldn't find a way out of whatever he was dealing with inside eats at me sometimes. and in a sense, many people lose because of that.

sully

[VitaminG]

beautifully stated, sully.

Where's a "tipping my hat" graemlin when you need one?

[~K~]

+1

[jgcable]

Hey guys, I didn't post this thread to start a war between members or to discuss addictions or liability for ones actions.
The Ratt BTM moved me. Robbin seemed like a nice guy and I feel bad for him. I have the 100% right to feel bad for him regardless of whether or not you people think. Drugs and alcohol suck. He got caught up in a life style that caught up with him. Thankfully, we have his music to remember him by and solely because of the JCF.... BIG RED.
And another thing... RATT kicked big major ass back when they were together whether on video, onstage or in the studio. Regardless of how you took BTM... their music does the talking.

[Drsracing]

I like how he said don't feel sorry when I die, Celeabrate my life, and Throw a Party. Who cares about the Bad things. Robbin Was a Talanted Guitar Player and From everything I've ever Heard was a class Act. RIP Robbin

[sully]

you posted while i was typing this, and i can say from things i've seen, read, and experienced myself, addiction isn't a learned thing. there's reasons that people gravitiate toward certain drugs; it's partially because those drugs trigger parts of the brain in certain ways (flipping thw switch on the rewards system). it's not just drugs that do that, either; things like extreme sports and the rush you can get from them perform in similar ways. i'm not a doctor, nor do i play one on tv, but i can tell you from my own experience that during a very dark time in my life, i was medicating myself pretty heavily with opiates; demerol, vicodin, etc. and when i was taking those things, it wasn't to get high. it was to deal with life in general and knock the edge off of things. after 3 demerols, i'd feel like i could just function at a human level. the best description i can think of is like using a dimmer switch and turning a very bright light down a little bit.

anyway, again, i'm not trying to change your mind or anything, but i'm simply speaking from experience. drugs work; otherwise people wouldn't take them. sadly, addiction can pull you under. during my late teens and early twenties, i was very self destructive and tried to kill myself a few times (succeeded once, but that's another story for another day). i wanted to be off the planet, but there would be a few glimmers of hope in my life. i knew that what kept me from heroin was the fact that i knew that once i opened that door, i'd never be able to shut it. i didn't want to become a junkie because nikki sixx or sid vicious or johnny thunders were, but i knew that smack would put an end to the pain that i was dealing with in my life.

anyway, yeah.

[sully]

Why do we change what drug use is when someone has celebrity status?

simple. ever see Men In Black? remember when tommy lee jones said to will smith "individuals are smart, but people are stupid?" it's kinda like that. if you sit in an AA meeting with a roomful of addicts and listen to each of their stories, you will empathize with them because you see them as human beings. that said, if you see a bunch of junkies in a shooting gallery, being active in their addiction, you can't help but be repulsed and perhaps a little angry. when we have celebrities, it's turned up a notch. you see them on tv, in magazines, and you identify with what you see, not necesarily who they are, etc. celebrities are viewed as above the general public; it's not right, but that's how it is. us regular folks aspire to the "greatness" that they have. so when you find out that mister movie hero has a drug problem just like you do, or like your brother does, it humanizes them a little bit and we feel a little closer to that person because we may not have the kickass house or hot chicks that mister movie star has, but we have a similar dark secret. granted, if i hear any more about teri hatcher's ordeal, i'll open a vein, but it doesn't mean that her coming out with her story won't help thousands of people who may be living with that hell right this moment, and maybe it'll help them help themselves. why? well, because "if teri hatcher can get through this and have a life like she seems to, then maybe i can too, and maybe things will turn out okay for me."

whatever gets you to the light, right?

sully
(i promise i'm done!)

[VitaminG]

I was just thinking about the whole drugs thing - if my general knowledge of world history serves me, they were around and being used before VH1, right? Correct me if I'm wrong, but they may have even been around before this rock'n'roll music all the kids are listening to, before jazz, before technology allowed us to record ourselves and thereby influence others with stories of our hard-partying Rock Star indulgences.

So is it really that great a concern for the supposed glorification of drugs by VH1? I haven't seen the Ratt BTM yet, but the BTMs I've seen so far all make it look like a pretty shitty time in a band's existence, and the members' lives, as the band implodes due to the self-destructive nature of one of the group. Not particularly glamourous at all.

I guess That 70s Show should be held accountable too. The guys are always sitting around in Eric's basement, getting stoned.

[jgcable]

I was just thinking about the whole drugs thing - if my general knowledge of world history serves me, they were around and being used before VH1, right? Correct me if I'm wrong, but they may have even been around before this rock'n'roll music all the kids are listening to, before jazz, before technology allowed us to record ourselves and thereby influence others with stories of our hard-partying Rock Star indulgences.

So is it really that great a concern for the supposed glorification of drugs by VH1? I haven't seen the Ratt BTM yet, but the BTMs I've seen so far all make it look like a pretty shitty time in a band's existence, and the members' lives, as the band implodes due to the self-destructive nature of one of the group. Not particularly glamourous at all.

I guess That 70s Show should be held accountable too. The guys are always sitting around in Eric's basement, getting stoned.

I guess That 70s Show should be held accountable too. The guys are always sitting around in Eric's basement, getting stoned.
__________________
EXACTLY

[jcm800x]

Those of us who have spent time with heroin addicts can understand why he was alone with another addict when he died. You feel sorry and try to help for a few months, weeks maybe, but it gets very hard watching your friend drooling and nodding off all day. I spent some time with a good friend who was heavily using and drinking but I burned out quick. He had to OD and lucky for him he was revived and has cleaned up. In the past 5 years he has relapsed only once when he was given pain killers, he soon quit again. Robin got a check, apartment, a user room-mate and was dead in no time. I get the feeling that he had enough of the fight and was ready to go.