The EVHII Holy Grail

[abalonevintage]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

4-82 Diver Down released.
4-82 Eddie First showed up with Kramer and Rockinger.
6-82 Kramer introduces Rockinger "Eddie Van Halen" trem.
7-82 Eddie live with Gold Floyd "style" bridge in Columbia, SC.
8-82 Eddie Finalized his Kramer endorsement.
1-83 Floyd Rose trems in Kramer catalogs.

How long would it take to get the NEW and improved Floyds made, shipped to the US, put on guitars and sold? 1982? Close call....

Hossman, June 15th 1987, 12:46PM.

-eric

[ December 23, 2002, 08:30 PM: Message edited by: abalonevintage ]

[Hossman]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Now I see the differences in the floyds we are talking about.
Wow How many were there?
1st Blue label non fine "Made In USA"
2nd Red Label non fine (USA/Japan?)
3rd Red Label non fine "Made In Japan"
4rd non fine German made
5th Harris VH
6th Crowe's Kramer
7th Mine Made in Germany final
(I think it was more like 3:25PM [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Monday, June 15, 1987) Thanks Eric

[abalonevintage]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Hossman, there were other changes that occurred between Greg's and yours.

Diecast plate without made in Germany.
Diecast with made in Germany.
Silver to black clamping blocks
Black to silver trem blocks.
markings on trem block.
different trem bar collar.

You can always tell the Floyds made after lunch. They're shinier in the middle.....

-eric

[ December 23, 2002, 09:43 PM: Message edited by: abalonevintage ]

[Genebaby]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Originally posted by BigDaddyD:
Genebaby,

Are you referring to my post?

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes I am BigDaddyD, there was a non-fine tuner Floyd on Aussie ebay a couple of months or so ago.

[Guest]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Eric,

I have a question about die-cast bases.

I was under the impression that on all these in question, the entire base is hardened steel. (I don't know the metalurogical term) but *not* die cast. If the base was die-cast, wouldn't the anchors just eat into the base and destroy it even with reserved use? The amount of pressure on the knife edges is farily significant and I can't see die-cast pivot points holding up. Are we sure the entire base isn't [insert correct term] hardened steel?

This was the biggest detriment of the later Jackson/Schaller model Floyds that the base was indeed die-cast but had the little hardened achor point inserts as opposed to the enitre base being solid.

Does this make sense? I just can't help thinking a 100% die-cast base would just not work at all.

Please help! [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

[bobbyvee]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Just one question, what the heck does all this floyd talk and rockinger talk really have to do with anything. Not to be party pooper but these floyds aren't like super desirable. Sorry but if it widdles and dive bombs, thats good enough for me.

[abalonevintage]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Die-cast does not necessarily imply cheap. I believe the "hardening" process involves taking the metal to a high temperature and then backing it off.

There are obviously different grades and compositions of cast metal.

I consider some Floyds very desirable!!!!

-eric

[Boxcar Willie 84]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Hey guys, I don't know if this will help you any, but I'd like to add it anyway. I read an interview with Brad Gillis once and he said that he got the third Floyd Rose tremolo ever made-Eddie got the first, and Neil Schon got the second.

And going along with the Holy Grail thing, I gave my skateboard a EVH Black with yellow stripes paintjob today. My first foray into graphics work!

[Guest]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

OK, I'll go out on a major limb here because I have zero experience with metalwork or casting.

I always associated Die-Cast metal with that cheap grey stuff that Hot Wheels cars are made of. This kind of metal is basically pot metal which molted and poured into a cast, pressed, and voila...you have your item. Can this kind of metal be hardened? I'd think the termperature required to harden a pivot point would just melt pot metal.

I had thought on all the "Original" style Floyds the base was one solid piece of hardened steel with the pivot points simply ground to knife edge. I definitely think this is one reason they sound better than the die-cast base JT-6 trems and the Schallers with the little hardened insert pivot points. Better transfer of tone. I think it is also why they are more expensive. The die-cast stuff has to be cheaper to manufacture than milling steel plates.

The JT-6/Schaller trems bases are made from this same pot metal and I believe the reason they used the little metal pivot pieces was because the die-cast base can't be hardened (or else they would have done so). Right?

Would love to get an answer on this as I just don't know.

Bobbyvee, I see a huge value in the steel over die-cast (seeing that the above theory is true). I think they sound better, look better, are better quality, more durable, and serviceable.

[Hossman]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Hey Max [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Pot metal cannot be hardened [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] I don't think [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] It is used for hood orniments on cars and toys I don't think it is used for trems?
Hardened steel is made by heating steel to a temp and then dipping it into oil (different oils and temps produce different grades of hardness)

I Think (I sould be carful with that thinking thing - gets me in trouble all the time [img]images/icons/shocked.gif[/img] )

[Hossman]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Bobby Vee - Super Desirable...
Put A First Series Floyd "Made in USA" Blue Label on the bay and watch it [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

MERRY CHRISTMAS ALL

[BigDaddyD]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Genebaby,

This one was recent. I don't think it was Aussie. It was on regular Ebay.

[abalonevintage]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

There is no doubt something is diecast if it has a mold seam. Look again at the bridge of Harris'. You can see the horizontal seam clearly.

The JT-6 bridges are have the same quality and feel of the 70's Fender bridges. They are molded one piece units and are hard enough to withstand the fulcrum issue. Look on the bottom of a 70's Fender bridge, you will clearly see mold injection evidence.

-eric

[~K~]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Rockatansky,

Welcome to the new JCF .. or should I say welcome back .. you appear to be a great wealth of knowlege and an assett to have here .. Ever thought about starting your own info board?? [img]graemlins/notworthy.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[bobbyvee]

Re: The EVHII Holy Grail

Thanks for the info Hossman, I appreciate your knowledge of these great guitars.