Light weight Alder/Upcharge

[jackson1]

Last I checked copper, silver, polysol, enamel, rubber and plastic weren´t magnetic and thereby as a direct result not = microphonic for the purposes of the electrical system in question (a low voltage inductor circuit with a bandpass filter and a passive volume control). But in theory if we were working with a powered system with a significantly higher output it may make an audible difference, though.

Have you ever tried tapping on a low quality shielded microphone cable, running into a sensitive tube amp at high volumes? It's my observation that this will generate audible noise.

[LastInLine]

Yes, the one with swamp ash will sound brighter and have slightly less midrange than the one with alder, and mahogany will sound darker and warmer, with more low mids, than both swamp ash or alder. Any more questions about tonal properties of wood? Your so-called "theory" about wood having a negligible affect on sound is wrong.

These tonal properties, do they describe a finished or unfinished body? Are we talking one piece or multiple piece? I'm wondering how grain fillers, sanding sealers, primers, 12-15 coats of lacquer, polyester, clear coats etc...figure into these descriptions? What are the tonal properties of a glue joint? If the wood plays such an important role in the sound, then surely the finish must be part of the equation.
Here's a quote from a book I own entitled "Constructing a Solid-Body Guitar. A Complete Technical Guide" The author is Roger H. Siminoff, one time consultant to Gibson (among others) and original editor of Frets Magazine. " He's been building guitars for over 30 yrs and has authored many books on the subject. On the subject of choosing wood for a solidbody electric guitar, he says: "As long as the woods selected for the instruments are hardwoods, the specific species of wood will have little effect on the tonal quality of the instrument". I'm not saying that proves my point, but I share his opinion and he certainly has more credibility than I do.

[fett]

And from a JCF Admin no less. Nice!

?

:ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: "No strap for you!!!!!!!"

[LastInLine]

I honestly ask, why would we keep using expensive exotic woods and such if they had no impact other than the instrument´s visuals? Why would so many dozens of sites have descriptions of the tonal pproperties of different woods if these differences didn´t exist? If the difference isn´t real, why is there a general consensus on exactly how different woods sound? Why do we even build bodies that can mount more than the hardware?

And if the wood doesn´t make a difference, then why are we still using it at all considering the myriad of immensely superior synthetic alternatives that are available.

The manufacturers can charge more for the "exotic" hardwoods. The almighty buck has alot to do with it.

Wood is still the most practical option. Not to mention that we are creatures of habit. Musicians, more specifically guitar players, don't accept change very easily when it comes to our instuments. Wood is what were used to.

Why was the solidbody electric guitar invented in the first place? To eliminate/reduce feedback. I would say that speaks volumes regarding this topic.

[MEX3]

I know Neal Moser has said that the fretboard has more to do with the tone of a guitar than the body and neck. And 8lbs for an alder strat doesn't seem outrageous to me.

[fett]

This new guy is telling you what for. Plywood Rules because it doesn't make a damn bit of difference what a solid body guitar is made of. He is "My Hero".:ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF:

[Zerberus]

The manufacturers can charge more for the "exotic" hardwoods. The almighty buck has alot to do with it.

Yes and no.

Wood is still the most practical option. Not to mention that we are creatures of habit. Musicians, more specifically guitar players, don't accept change very easily when it comes to our instuments. Wood is what were used to.

This explains the buying practices, but not directly why there are so ultrafew luthiers making decent sounding instruments out of alternative materials (SKC, Status, and Slipwood come to mind) or even experimenting with them.

Why was the solidbody electric guitar invented in the first place? To eliminate/reduce feedback. I would say that speaks volumes regarding this topic.

No, it speaks volumes about the way externally generated sound waves at high volumes resonate inside a big air filled box as opposed to a slab when they´re already resonating at the same frequency. It says nothing tangible about the way the internally generated waves are affected so that they can later become said externally generated waves. It´s not the same wave as many falsely assume because it´s being converted from a vibration into a fluctuation within a magnetic field into an AC current into whatever your particular amp does internally back to a much larger vibration. If it were the same wave, it would travel (as a vibration) through the cable and not as an electrical signal.

If you want to read into luthierie in general in more depth with a bunch of people that have actual hands on experience (not that there´s no experience here, but I think the full blown luthiers on the board with 10+ years experience and formal training can be counted on one hand), I´d suggest taking a look at the Musical Instrument Manufacturer´s Forum or talking with some of the guys over at the MCS forum including Neal Moser

I know Neal Moser has said that the fretboard has more to do with the tone of a guitar than the body and neck. And 8lbs for an alder strat doesn't seem outrageous to me.

Hmm, I can´t recall noticing him ever saying this, but as odd as it strikes me I wouldn´t rule it out completely..... I´d be interested in teh context, though

[toejam]

Here's a quote from a book I own entitled "Constructing a Solid-Body Guitar. A Complete Technical Guide" The author is Roger H. Siminoff, one time consultant to Gibson (among others) and original editor of Frets Magazine. " He's been building guitars for over 30 yrs and has authored many books on the subject. On the subject of choosing wood for a solidbody electric guitar, he says: "As long as the woods selected for the instruments are hardwoods, the specific species of wood will have little effect on the tonal quality of the instrument". I'm not saying that proves my point, but I share his opinion and he certainly has more credibility than I do.

That guy is obviously a moron if he doesn't know the sound properties of different species of wood. Maybe he's why Gibson's quality control has gone down for the past few years??? LOL
Why would Gibson keep using mahogany as their main tone wood for all these years? It's got a certain midrangey/growling tone. They did try to mix it up with a couple of models through the years and use swamp ash. Go find an Explorer, Les Paul, SG, V or whatever they made with swamp ash and compare that to one made of mahogany.

[Zerberus]

That guy is obviously a moron if he doesn't know the sound properties of different species of wood. Maybe he's why Gibson's quality control has gone down for the past few years??? LOL....

No, he was a "One Time Consultant": It means they consulted him exactly one time and never again

J/K Last, but the joke was too good to pass up

[toejam]

:ROTF:

[LastInLine]

This new guy is telling you what for. Plywood Rules because it doesn't make a damn bit of difference what a solid body guitar is made of. He is "My Hero".:ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF: :ROTF:

Let's not forget masonite. Alot of people will praise the sound of the original Danelectro's.

[Budman68]

Let's not forget masonite. Alot of people will praise the sound of the original Danelectro's.

touche'!!!!

[busdriver]

I'm just back from a local music store and since this visit this whole lightweight alder thing seems like a joke to me...
I played a few of these new Fender American Deluxe Strats (alder body, Corona made) and each of these guitars was light as a feather! So why can Fender use lightweight alder in a Strat when it's impossible to use it for a Charvel?

[Zerberus]

I'm just back from a local music store and since this visit this whole lightweight alder thing seems like a joke to me...
I played a few of these new Fender American Deluxe Strats (alder body, Corona made) and each of these guitars was light as a feather! So why can Fender use lightweight alder in a Strat when it's impossible to use it for a Charvel?

It´s not impossible to use in a Charvel.

I guarantee you that if you call the Fender CS and ask for a strat that weighs exactly 8 pounds or whatever (as is the case here from what I understand, he specified an exact target weight, not "under or "over" but "right exactly smack dab HERE, no more, no less", the upcharge will be just as high if not more.

Why? Because some poor sod still has to go out and weigh blanks until he has the right one. and that takes time.

It´s easy to find a "light" blank, but it´s nearly impossible to think "I need one that weighs exactly 4 pounds", and to randomly grab one out of a stack and have it end up weighing exactly 4 pounds or whatever the target weight for the blank is. That´s not just wishful thinking, that´s completely euphoric.

And of course it disregards that specifying an exact weight makes it even MORE likely that the guitar may have to be built 2 or 3 times, because if the wood ends up being an ounce than you thought heavier you get to make a new body, exactly one ounce lighter.

[Genebaby]

Wasn't the target weight just 8 pounds or less? Not EXACTY 8 pounds, which would be a bugger of a job to make happen.

It seems that asking for 8 pounds or less they could build it with any of those nice and light USA Strat blanks.

A $950 upcharge for a CS guitar to weight a bit less than 8 pounds is excessive. How come the trees that Charvel get their wood from have gotten so fat? There must be a forest of fatties out there.