What corners were cut on the production models

[Grandturk]

If Fender painted these in the typical Strat colors, put 'Fender' on the headstock and called it the 'Floyd Rose Big Apple Strat,' and sold them for $1100-$1200 on the street, I still would have bought one.

I wouldn't have. I like stuff that has Fender on the headstock to be traditional style - I don't like any appointments on my Fender Strat's that weren't there in 1954, dammit!

[jet66]

The SoCal neck feels very similar in contour to my '99 American Standard Strat. Flatter and compound-radiused board, yes, but still very close in feel. (I think the '99 is a 9.25" radius.)

If Fender painted these in the typical Strat colors, put 'Fender' on the headstock and called it the 'Floyd Rose Big Apple Strat,' and sold them for $1100-$1200 on the street, I still would have bought one.

[Rich#6]

I have played a few strats that I thought had amazing necks. I prefer the feel of the thin profile of the J/Cs but always thought that they could be a little more like the C back of the strat and a little less of that D shape. I just got a socal yesterday and This neck shape is perfect for me. It's as if they knew what I wanted. Needs some more fine sanding for my tastes though.

[Grandturk]

Feels a LOT like a strat - That's because essentially it IS a Strat. go figure.

Never played a Fender Strat with an oiled neck and a compound fretboard. My Strat's got a 7.5" radius, which plays a hell of a lot different than a 12-15" compound radius.

[ZippoTragedy]

Profit margin on these guitars is negligible.
My info (credible dealer, small shop, high volume) said something on order of less than $110 profit to the Dealer. And the price points are fixed by Charvel. No Dealer is allowed to sell them for less that MAP ($990) or some such. That's contractual. My Source just kept scratching his head - couldn;t figure out how they're making any money on it - the OFR and the electronics alone cost ~$300+. Profit margins are slim. Fender makes enough money to invest in rebuilding a key brand, and that's what they're doing. Pretty simple.

You get a gig bag b/c adding a case would have cost another $100-150; they wanted the price point under $1,000. personally I would have liked to be able to acquire a case as an option.

I was not aware that the Floyd was a Korean.
It's marketed as a OFR.

If you take the pickguard off of the SoCal, you'll see they're routed H/S/H internally.
Any guesses why? Probably because they're using overstock body blanks; they're a manufacturing company - maybe they didn't hit their production numbers and ended up with a couple million extra bodies and necks - who knows.
Is it a Custom - nope.
Is it an excellent USA-made value? absolutely.

I've got a Tangerine SoCal - and it's still in the lineup and one of my favorite guitars.


Basically a USA Fender Strat with different logos and HH instead of single coils; phatter "shred-quality" electronics and a rocking paint job. Feels a LOT like a strat - That's because essentially it IS a Strat. go figure.

Should they get knocked for leveraging their production line? Nope

The frets may not be Custom-shop quality, but for $2-4k in savings, you'll adapt and play just fine.

it's really easy to pick things apart. Lot's more difficult to find value and just say thank you.

zt

[85 San Dimas]

You are not taking into account for the intangible.
The Fender name commands more $$$ than the Charvel name.
It's a legitimate factor when comparing two similar products.

I'm not talking CS or limited edition LP's, just regular production crap.

Actually I'm defending the intangible in the case of Charvel. My point would be that the "intangible" becomes "tangible" when two different prices are used for a virtually identical product.

I agree with you that prices are set to the maximum the market will bear regardless of build price.

I would say this to the rest...I've made the point over and over (in response to the thread question) w/No malice, no insult, and admitting so-cals are real good guitars that;
IMHO they shouldn't wear the Charvel name based on what they ARE instead of what they are "perceived" to be based on the marketing. All the contours in the world don't matter. If a so-cal is a Charvel then its a cost cutter.

But if your point is that the brand name has value (and I agree that it does and that value is indeed the legacy of the original C/J quality) then why purposely lower the perceived value?

BTW I completely agree with you on Gibson. Anything they make under 2K on the regular lines are unworthy IMHO. I've picked up new 3K lps that were no better than the 1100 explorers not once but several times. Not that there aren't exceptions but the "3rd shift" must build a lot of the GC/Sam Ash models.

[85 San Dimas]

Charvel, as a name or an "mystic mojo manufacturer" never existed. Wayne left many years ago. Claiming that a resurrection of the brand is a bad thing is fairly wrong headed.

You wanted the brand treated with respect. Respect costs a premium, just look at PRS.

I don't think that's accurate. No one believes the saving of the brand was wrong-headed. There are just some of us that believe that the brand name "Charvel" refers to more than a contour on a body or a radius on a neck.

As for respect we already pay a premium for it. Put a 'Hondo" decal on that so-cal and it'll sell 80% less units at half the price. People won't buy them. Again, not that they aren't good, but don't doubt a premium is being paid. As for the CS.......well I don't like what they cost but am willing to be a little more understanding up to 3K if they're built right and to high enough quality. According to FMIC and Gibsons pricing structure it isn't a real guitar until you get over $2K anyway.

Boy, the thread sure went neg while I was gone

[rjohnstone]

Why not? I understand the value of what you are saying. I would only make the case that comparison of specs and price points is the only objective way.

You are not taking into account for the intangible.
The Fender name commands more $$$ than the Charvel name.
It's a legitimate factor when comparing two similar products.

I'm sure the "parts" used to build both lines have similar upfront costs involved, but a guitar is not just the sum of it's parts in the open market.

If that were the case, there are some kick ass no name Japanese and Korean LP copies that should be priced in the same range as a production model USA LP.
And some of these imports absolutely smoke most off the shelf Gibson LP's when it comes to build quality and attention to detail.
I'm not talking CS or limited edition LP's, just regular production crap.

[85 San Dimas]

You're trying to compare Fenders to Charvels......So trying to compare to product lines purely on specs and price points is not really a fair comparison at all.

Why not? I understand the value of what you are saying. I would only make the case that comparison of specs and price points is the only objective way.

[85 San Dimas]

The body's and Necks are made and crafted in the USA... ALL IN CORONA CA on the Charvel Production Line.
-Mike

Okay, so do I still get the factory tour and the Charvel swag?

[85 San Dimas]

I was just up and Manny's on 48th St and they're choking on these things

On the same note, Sam Ash has had the same 3 Dimartini's since they come out and the same PC1... am I getting that New York is just not a Charvel/Jackson town???

Nah, it's that there is only so much market for a floyd, then the problem with Custom graphics is that not everyone wants THAT graphic for THAT amount.

Besides, if you walk onstage with a Demartini or a Lynch Tiger (we all know as guitar players) you'd better be able to nail the gig. So, they're expensive for 'wall art", a boat anchor at a gig, and anything with a locking trem requires a "rock town" to use it.

[hippietim]

Our friend Eddie trailerpark here is Jeff Albertson. A banned Troll. hehe!

I don't think so - Jeff had the skills to pay the bills!

[Flatpicker]

Until yesterday I thought Charvel was an icecream store.

You mean they are not the ones that made cookiepuss and fudgie the whale?
All these years I've been posting in the wrong forum????

So I ain't never gonna get my free cookiepuss.

[Rich#6]

[quote][You have me confused with somebody else. /QUOTE]that's funny you act like him and you even posted the same picture of the 4 bullseye charvels.

[mudkicker]

WHoooaaa rubbernack....read the post. Besides, I haven't even started posting guitars yet. That's about 10% of my crap! I couldn't find the 'who's got the most gear thread and doesn't work at 7-11' thread. Maybe you should check the whole thread before you go all smashmouth there tough guy. Just relax and take a deep breath. There no need to get all upset. I'm sure the day will come when you could afford to have a few guitars....maybe or maybe not? That piss-ass attitude might be what's holding you back. Yah think?

Damn-man, why is it alway some guy with a Squire Strat and a busted headstock Les Paul Studio that goes all whacked trying to tell me how much of an expert he is..........?

Yep, you pegged me. I don't know anything about guitars, much less Charvels. Hell all I own is an Epiphone Les Paul with a busted neck. Until yesterday I thought Charvel was an icecream store.