What corners were cut on the production models

[85 San Dimas]

If both you and Bionic are correct then maybe a road worn Mexi Strat should be about 500 bucks because it sure can't cost the same to build it.........yet it lists virtually the same.

Look, I'm not arguing against the guitar as being a good instrument or worth the price. I'm saying that the price point of this guitar prohibits it from being what is being described UNLESS this guitar is the only FMIC guitar accurately priced. a plain white USA Strat lists higher......and they're CNC'd.

[RobRR]

I think its a simple case of "because they can". They CAN list price an American Standard at $1700 and people will still buy it. Just like Gibson does. Its MORE than obvious that they are WAY overpriced, so in reality the new Charvels are just right... its the strats that are inflated beyond belief. Seriously, how much money do you think it costs Fender to make basically the same guitar they have been for 60+ years? Not much.

[rjohnstone]

You're trying to compare Fenders to Charvels.
Lets face it, Fender has more name recognition than Charvel does.
The Fender name warrants its own pricing schema.
So trying to compare to product lines purely on specs and price points is not really a fair comparison at all.

[Rich#6]

I think its a simple case of "because they can".

+1. how else can they buy up the competition.

[jet66]

It does seem priced on the low side vs. an American series Fender, no doubt. Maybe it's just a way to kickstart more interest? Maybe the Fender brand is just big enough to command that price? I couldn't really say. At this particular time, this is what I could afford. However, even knowing the SoCal and loving it at this point, I'd still look at a custom in the future. There are a few I have seen in the $2000-$2500 range that, had I the funds, would have been bought instead of the SoCal. I even took pause to think I might hold out for an Adrian Smith sig, but it just wasn't reasonable for me right now.

Every time NAMM had come around for the past few years, I would look and see if Fender was bringing back the American Floyd Rose Strat. This was practically a long-awaited answer to a prayer for me, so I'm glad that for whatever reason they are doing it, they are doing it.

[Jacksonite]

the reason the custom shop stuff is SO much more, is more than just one thing

they use different grade of woods and the Custom stuff is all hand built, no CnC machines
they use table and Pin Routers and do it all by hand... the labor to do that just costs sooo much more.
If you compare it to other like priced guitars,
1100 dollars street price, its a much better guitar..
and they cant be anything other than a charvel, as its a differnt body shape than a fender strat (albeit a small difference)
So why isnt this a Charvel... to me thats silly
its just a new model thats similar to the guitar that they made years ago..

[85 San Dimas]

the reason the custom shop stuff is SO much more, is more than just one thing

they use different grade of woods and the Custom stuff is all hand built, no CnC machines
they use table and Pin Routers and do it all by hand... the labor to do that just costs sooo much more.
If you compare it to other like priced guitars,
1100 dollars street price, its a much better guitar..
and they cant be anything other than a charvel, as its a differnt body shape than a fender strat (albeit a small difference)
So why isnt this a Charvel... to me thats silly
its just a new model thats similar to the guitar that they made years ago..

yep, I agree 100%. it's more than one thing. cheaper labor, cheaper wood, cheaper everything. that would pretty much be the definition of "cost cutter" versus what I am referring to in this thread as "real" Charvels.

Again I stress. I do not have a problem with the guitar. Only the marketing of it under the Charvel brand name. I think that is a mistake IMHO for the brand. Time will tell. Your post bears out what I'm saying. And Jet66, I'm following your thread though I haven't posted. I think it's great you bought the guitar, and that grandturk loves his.
Just make a producer earn your money. TTM is doing the same thing as the So-Cal over in Palm Springs (Palm Desert) and while I'm no particular fan I will say you can walk in and get a comparable guitar for half list of the So-Cal. Cut-out and painted elsewhere but assembled and set-up in their shop. I've been in the shop within the last 3 months.

Of course it doesn't say "Charvel", "FMIC", or whatever but it plays out just as good for a lot less. Theirs cost them about the same amount to produce (it has to for what they sell them for), so the parts have to be of similar quality and the labor similar in time. it all boils down to what that decal is worth. Not trying to hurt FMIC with this, but its obvious what te So-Cal is and is not. I'd like a little more transparency about what FMIC is selling as a Charvel (and it has to be pretty close to what TTM is doing for GC and Sam Ash to sell So-Cals at that price.

Anyway, I'm done. Hope everyone gets what they like!

[goodwood]

The bridge is crap. The pots are crap. The fretwork seems to be random - some are ok and some are horrible. The fit and finish overall is mediocre. The knob is dorky. The setups are mediocre.

I agree with that except the pot part...I don't know that it is crappy or not.
As for the bridge...when you put it side by side with an '80s OFR it looks, feels, just IS way different. I'd pay $500 Canadian for one after holding and playing 6 of them. No more.

I pretty much agree with 85 San Dimas' posts as well re the Charvel name and such.

[Grandturk]

I agree with that except the pot part...I don't know that it is crappy or not.
As for the bridge...when you put it side by side with an '80s OFR it looks, feels, just IS way different. I'd pay $500 Canadian for one after holding and playing 6 of them. No more.

I pretty much agree with 85 San Dimas' posts as well re the Charvel name and such.

Edit: ah, nevermind.

[goodwood]

Edit: ah, nevermind.

I'm guessing that I would have neverminded it anyway...

[Eddie_van_trailerpark]

I don't know but I will say this;

Regarding the body and set up: There's a pretty significant difference in the feel between my custom shop charvels and my production series ones. I haven't taken them apart and made measurements and I probably won't. I feel much more comfortable with the CS bodies.

Regarding the necks: They're way too similar. Scary but I'm starting to think there's nothing special to the build methods or quality of CS one piece neck. The three piece necks are a different story; very solid, wide, flat feel.

Has anyone seen the line for a production guitar? My money says that the wood is lowest grade...why do you think they're all painted? Strip one, I bet you find more knots than a boy scout jamboroo. I'm sure they're using the same multi piece CNC cutters that they are using for the american Strats. "Hit program 2 instead on program 1 and press start"....BAM! 15 bodies in 5 minutes. Same story on the necks. Load the wood, press the button...no gluing...no setting. Drill a hole for a simple cheap trussrod and it's done. Warmoth makes the same neck (with a better trussrod and adjuster) for $150.

Personally, I don't think that pricing for the production guitars is very cheap at all, I think that CS pricing has gone a freakin' haywire. I mean let's face it $2500-$3500 for a CS San Dimas or Tele is just too much. The way I see it $750 is fair value for a production and $1400-$1900 is fair value for a CS guitar.

[orion451]

Ahhh the best Charvel in the world!

[Grandturk]

I'm guessing that I would have neverminded it anyway...

That's alright - I apply the same logic in return.

[Grandturk]

So, uh, Trailerpark - thanks for the pics...


Anyway - the real question to me is - how are these things REALLY selling?

I was just up and Manny's on 48th St and they're choking on these things - they had every color from every batch up on the wall - except the Slime Green - and they had two SoCals over in Sam Ash across the street. I swear they're the same ones I've been seeing for months. They just don't seem like they're moving.

On the same note, Sam Ash has had the same 3 Dimartini's since they come out and the same PC1... am I getting that New York is just not a Charvel/Jackson town???

[Flatpicker]

I don't know but I will say this;

Regarding the body and set up: There's a pretty significant difference in the feel between my custom shop charvels and my production series ones. I haven't taken them apart and made measurements and I probably won't. I feel much more comfortable with the CS bodies.

Regarding the necks: They're way too similar. Scary but I'm starting to think there's nothing special to the build methods or quality of CS one piece neck. The three piece necks are a different story; very solid, wide, flat feel.

Has anyone seen the line for a production guitar? My money says that the wood is lowest grade...why do you think they're all painted? Strip one, I bet you find more knots than a boy scout jamboroo. I'm sure they're using the same multi piece CNC cutters that they are using for the american Strats. "Hit program 2 instead on program 1 and press start"....BAM! 15 bodies in 5 minutes. Same story on the necks. Load the wood, press the button...no gluing...no setting. Drill a hole for a simple cheap trussrod and it's done. Warmoth makes the same neck (with a better trussrod and adjuster) for $150.

Personally, I don't think that pricing for the production guitars is very cheap at all, I think that CS pricing has gone a freakin' haywire. I mean let's face it $2500-$3500 for a CS San Dimas or Tele is just too much. The way I see it $750 is fair value for a production and $1400-$1900 is fair value for a CS guitar.

If this is just going to turn into a bitchfest of "the new stuff is too expensive." You may as well just end the thread now.

You don't like the prices, don't buy them.
You don't like the quality, don't buy them.
You want to claim that it's ruining the Charvel name? Sit down and take a valium.
Charvel, as a name or an "mystic mojo manufacturer" never existed. Wayne left many years ago. Claiming that a resurrection of the brand is a bad thing is fairly wrong headed.

Shaddup and play yer guitars. Seems like you have a nice collection.

You wanted the brand treated with respect. Respect costs a premium, just look at PRS.