Bendability affected by fret size and string-thru body?

[eveningninja]

I like my Jackson RR5, and may want to purchase more Jacksons in the future, but the one thing is that Jacksons have Jumbo frets, and I have some ESP's that have Extra Jumbo frets, and it seems like with Extra Jumbo my bending is a bit easier to do.

I love Jacksons, but I sort of just wish the frets were taller. Do any of you experience this as well?

But another thing is that my only Jackson is also a string-thru body, so I'm wondering if that is maybe what is causing it to be harder to bend. Because I also have a string-thru Agile with what I believe are Extra Jumbo frets, but it still seems hard to bend.

Thanks.

[Learn Guitars]

With the taller frets, you get the added ability to apply l pressure perpendicular to the strings when doing vibrato. With the longer string length, you get the stress of the tightened string carried through a longer distance, thus making the bends a bit easier as well.

[Trem]

The difference would more likely be if you are comparing a floyd rose type guitar to a string thru if you are talking about the tension and feel of the string to bend.

* Ah Mike got in first..

[eveningninja]

String thru are harder to bend than Floyd Rose bridge guitars?

[Devotee]

String thru are harder to bend than Floyd Rose bridge guitars?

Yes because with Floyded guitars the bridge flexes with the increase in string tension caused by bending.

EDIT: 'Flex' isn't really the best term to use but i'm drunk and you get my point.

[MakeAJazzNoiseHere]

To raise to the same pitch, I find hard tail, stop tail/TOM and string-through easier. Now, pushing the string further across the neck, Floyd wins.

This is especially evident closer to the nut. Pick up any Floyd'ed guitar and do a bend at the 2nd fret, then do the same thing on a fixed bridge, it's pretty obvious.

[MarkTheMuscleShark]

You don't need bigger frets, you need more practice. Personally, I can bend farther than I ever need to on my frets (what does Charvel use, 6100s?) but I can bend just fine on small vintage frets, as found on the Teles I'm so fond of. Besides, both Eddie Van Halen and Randy Rhoads were fans of smaller frets, at least judging by their signature guitars. Like I said before, big frets are not a necessity. As for the bridge, I think it's harder to bend on a Floyd because you have to bend, then compensate for the movement of the bridge. You'll notice that if you bend a note while another note is ringing, that note will go flat. With a fixed bridge or flush-mounted Floyd that won't happen.

[Nightbat]

Yes because with Floyded guitars the bridge flexes with the increase in string tension caused by bending.

Yeah, you need more movement and the added 'flex' makes it tougher to reach the correct pitch

But this is 'harder' by technique only, because when it comes to 'strength' you need as much force on a floyded as a non floyded guitarstring to reach the same pitch

[Trem]

yes "easier" is subjective. However in this case what it seems like he's describing i think he means string tension. The difference between esp xtra jumbo vs jackson jumbo could very well only be a naming discrepancy. Ibanez generally use the biggest fret size used on production guitars, and they just call them Jumbo frets. I don't notice any difference between Jackson jumbo frets compared to an Ibanez jumbo. I would venture to say that all 3 of them are using a 6100 type wire as their biggest size.

[Cliff]

I've been comparing my PRS with my Soloist, and it seems to me that bending is easier on the PRS. Both have floating bridges, both have the same gauge strings, and the PRS has smaller frets. But it also has a shorter scale length, which I think is the main factor: shorter scale length means less tension in the strings to be at the same pitch, therefore easier to bend. Could this be a factor for the ESPs vs the RR5?

[mr426]

Also look at string pitch over the headstock. jacksons have a deeper pitch than a PRS I belive. Also inline heastocks have a different feal than 3 on 3. I just read an article today by Ken Parker about this very subject. He says that you can distribute tention by reversing the headstock too. String gauge makes a massive difference as does what you tune too.My band plays in dropped C, so CDGFAD but I play 012 gauge strings and the tention is still a bit stiff eventhough we play that low.

[eveningninja]

You don't need bigger frets, you need more practice. Personally, I can bend farther than I ever need to on my frets (what does Charvel use, 6100s?)

I like to bend two full steps on the high E string, and often three full steps on my B string. This works marvelously with my LTD FX-400, tuned to Eflat standard with 10's. It is also a 24.75" scale length.

How far is "farther than you'll ever need" for you?

I'm not meaning to sound prideful, but how can you naturally assume I need more practice if you've never heard me play? Do you have any clips/recordings of you doing extreme bending? I can link you to me doing some bends but I don't want to seem arrogant or shamefully promote myself or something.

Just curious what gauge, tuning, scale length you use, and how far you can generally bend.

Thanks.

I've been comparing my PRS with my Soloist, and it seems to me that bending is easier on the PRS. Both have floating bridges, both have the same gauge strings, and the PRS has smaller frets. But it also has a shorter scale length, which I think is the main factor: shorter scale length means less tension in the strings to be at the same pitch, therefore easier to bend. Could this be a factor for the ESPs vs the RR5?

Well, I definitely take into account scale length. But right now the guitars I'm comparing are both 25.5" scale. My LTD Alexi-600 and my Jackson RR5 are both in Eflat standard with 9-46 gauge, and the strings feel easier to bend on my Alexi, which is FR. The RR5 is string-thru.

Thanks!

[Trem]

Then if you notice when you do a bend on the esp watch the floyd it will pull forward a little and give some relief to the feel and tension of the string, and in return should also have to bend the string a little father on the esp to get to the correct pitch.

[Nightbat]

Non-trem guitars have imo, a more 'solid feel' when bending because of the missing 'elasticity' of a trem

When I bend on my Epi, I always get the idea I'm trying to cut the strings through my fingers, but that only is because I am more used to trems
and therefore try to apply the same amount of travel while it is not neccessary

[ginsambo]

Notes go out of tune with tall frets, especially around the 1st to 5th frets, unless you play like a kitten.

Some of them you can almost get a half tone in difference. Whatever it is, usually a day's playing and you get used to it. Although it is hard to get back in the saddle with a 25.5" scale length Jackson when you have been used to playing Gibsons etc. for a while as your technique is suddenly all sloppy and fatigued with the higher string tension. But then they make up for it as fast runs are really easy!

I love and hate floyds, when they are set up just right to trill, they always detune severely making unison or wild 2 tone bends difficult if not impossible to acheive. Hardtails are nicer IMO overall and sustain longer too as the springs don't seem to deaden and absorb the waves so much.

Ideally any Jackson hardtail is my favorite, as you get the clarity of the notes associated with a longer scale length, but the sustain of a TOM bridge. No doubt someone will say that floyds do sustain....

In short, there just isn't enough fretboard width with a floyd guitar, to acheive the short of bends you can get with a hardtail, but then the floyd will take you beyond that and more, so its horses for courses really and different technique.

Not to worry though, in my experience with life you have to watch out for extreme benders anyway.