Is Jackson next?

[Flatpicker]

Fender off-loaded Guild yesterday.

Just sayin'...

Gives me hope that they will off load Hamer soon.
I miss them.

[pianoguyy]

Gives me hope that they will off load Hamer soon.
I miss them.

If it was solely a money issue, I think they could probably get a boat load for Jackson. There would be someone, or a consortium, that would feel they could bring the name back to fruition.
I can see Jackson, Kramer, and BCR being worth something to a buyer simply by brand recognition. I don't see Guild or Hamer having the same name power.

[spencer4hire]

F Fender. They bought and killed off Tacoma,Guild,Hamer and USA made Ovations. Buy your competition and then kill them off. Great business model. Let the consumer have less choices.

[cullenszoo]

I know I'm coming into the conversation a bit late but all one needs to do is look at what Gibson has done with Kramer to see the future of Jackson. Unless there is a huge wave of metal/rock that sweeps the music scene like it did in the 80s, the shredder guitar is not really sought after.
Gibson bought Kramer in the early 90s, most likely hoping to cash in on it's recent glory days. They made a line in the US and other models were made overseas. Except for some special limited runs, they are made overseas with a limited selection now. Their list of high profile endorsements is pretty thin but they are appealing to more and more young players. With all that, Gibson is hoping to worm their way into the same market that Jackson, Ibanez, and ESP are fighting over.
Political or not, the economy plays a large role in what will happen. Teens and twenty-somethings looking to be future rock stars can't always afford $500+ for their first guitar. Therefore, the cheaper imports will usually out sell US made, high dollar guitars. The profit per unit is the bottom line and Fender is a business. They aren't around to provide quality musical instruments. they are around to make money and sooner or later any US production will narrow down to endorsement and custom shop guitars.

[NextInLine]

Ok let's make an estimate here. What do you think the gross profit margin on USA Jacksons's are?

They are producing approximately 750 selects a year, let's add 75 (one tenth) customs. Let's assume the gross profit margin on Usa selects is %50 and on customs it is 60% (which are not too big imo) Let's assume a Usa select sells for an average of $2250 and a custom sells for $3500, basic math yields:


$825,000 for USA Selects $157,500 for Customs. Which is close to a million and I don't think Jackson has huge expenses in the USA factory.
It might seem to be more profitable to produce Select series elsewhere but it will definitely affect the sales of selects as well as current high-end imports.

So I don't think Jackson is on the line yet.

[veemagic]

Ok let's make an estimate here. What do you think the gross profit margin on USA Jacksons's are?

They are producing approximately 750 selects a year, let's add 75 (one tenth) customs. Let's assume the gross profit margin on Usa selects is %50 and on customs it is 60% (which are not too big imo) Let's assume a Usa select sells for an average of $2250 and a custom sells for $3500, basic math yields:


$825,000 for USA Selects $157,500 for Customs. Which is close to a million and I don't think Jackson has huge expenses in the USA factory.
It might seem to be more profitable to produce Select series elsewhere but it will definitely affect the sales of selects as well as current high-end imports.

So I don't think Jackson is on the line yet.

First I am surprised this is still going on, however you are missing a couple of points. The biggest is, it was never about whether or not Jackson was making money or not, it was when Fender was going to decide to make more money by suspending production in the USA and INCREASING their profit margins by moving ALL productions elsewhere. Next, your math is way off. You are using retail pricing and forgetting that Jackson doesn't sell directly to the consumer. There is a dealer you must consider in your million dollar sales figure. They aren't doing their job for free. Once you start doing that deduction, you might start to see what Fender sees, an opportunity like Ovation, to cut costs, and INCREASE margins. Again, we have been reassured from someone we can trust that, at least right now, Jackson is good.

[stevoc]

I never put in an order for a Jackson custom shop, but I recently inquired about a fender custom shop. The cost was going to be $4k+ for a strat with a floyd, ebony board and two EMGS. No special paint or anything else.

[RR2772]

I did put a order in back in 1996. It came back as RR2772 6-7 months later from the custom shop.

I did some months ago send a inquiry through a dealer for a special build Fender Stratocaster and the price quote was the same as the price for my Jackson back then $ 5100. Keep in mind I am located in Denmark so extra taxes and shipping goes into custom instrument prices.

If Jackson stops making money then they will not be in business it is that simple.

[vector]

F Fender. They bought and killed off Tacoma,Guild,Hamer and USA made Ovations. Buy your competition and then kill them off. Great business model. Let the consumer have less choices.

Not exactly. Hamer was already gasping for air by the time FMIC got 'em. Doesn't seem likely FMIC did it to eliminate competition. More likely, it was to get Kaman's distribution network and Hamer came along with the Kaman network. Sadly, while Hamer made excellent guitars, the combination of downturn in nation's economy, a long standing identity crisis at Hamer and a dwindling market place for boutique guitars (that weren't inexpensive to begin with) all took a toll.

The good news is Jackson has their identity firmly defined (since the late 70's really) and I think they have weathered the recession reasonably well. What gives me pause is how the role of guitar and the changes in modern music in general will affect J/C in the future. That pie piece that Jackson, ESP and Ibanez share is growing smaller in regards to it's contribution to the whole pie that represent music in general.

[lepard]

I tend to find it really interesting to watch the activity on various guitar manufacturer forums. Yeah, I know, this isn't an "official" Fender run Forum but you get the idea. This Forum doesn't do anywhere near the activity it did a number of years ago. You would think as time goes on and your buyers become more and more internet savvy, forum activity would increase. This Forum has lost a lot of activity but not as much as some other Forums. The Kramer Forum and Dean Forum are basically dead, getting less than 10 posts a day. Jemsite(Ibanez Forum) still has quite a bit of activity. I think the economy has taken it's toll on guitar sales quite a bit. In turn, Forum participation is down.

I also like to drop by Guitar Center every couple months and just see what they are selling. In my honest opinion, we've reach a serious low point in quality. A few years ago, Guitar Center was full of quality guitars made in Korea by World Guitars and UnSung(ESP, Schecter, Dean, BC Rich, PRS, etc.). Now, almost everything is total crap made in China, Indonesia, India and Vietnam. The only quality Korean guitars I see anymore are the BC Rich's, PRS SE's and a few high dollar special edition Deans.

I would hate to be the CFO of one of these companies in this economy. They are forced to build the cheapest crap they can because people just don't have the disposable income they once did. I didn't think the day would come that I would actually miss Japanese Charvel/Jacksons but damn, we're there.

[MetalDaze]

I'm personally ok with where things are. USA Selects were getting too expensive to not have the ability to change specs. Custom Selects solved that problem and have resulted in some fresh looking guitars. I'd be fine with killing the Selects as we knew them all together in favor for the small Custom Select runs they've been doing.

Seems to me the import line has grown a lot and has lots of options for people in those price points.

[DesolationBlvd]

The JS and X series - excellent imports. They should play a soulless LTD into the ground.

The Pro series - get rid of those awful inlays.

The Custom Select seems to be almost everything I want. What I would add:

- Charvel bolt-ons (Strat and Star shape, available with Strat or Pointy headstock) priced maybe a little less than the DK1 for the base model. There's still a gulf between Pro and USA.
- Stock stencils, like Bullseye and Rising Sun, as well as bevels and maybe pinstripes available at a high upcharge, but less than Masterbuilt. Full graphics would remain Masterbuilt territory.
- Online configurator like Fender has with the American Design Experience. However, it would just spit out the custom order form already filled out for you that you then take to the dealer.