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**Top Jimmy B** · 09-23-2003, 11:42 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

"math test"? [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]
Try a "skill testing question" that can usually be answered if you have the normal number of fingers and toes.
The giveaway is a great idea though. [img]graemlins/band.gif[/img]
[img]graemlins/toast.gif[/img]

**sully** · 09-23-2003, 11:50 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

wow!!!! joe, you okay? [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

sully

**lerxstcat** · 09-23-2003, 11:51 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Originally posted by Monk:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by lerxstcat:
Payment protection isn't available for the seller with Paypal or credit cards, and would you just do that on trust?
Some do, but it's not prudent.

This has nothing to do with this thread, but I have to ask since I have not yet understood how it works. Does that mean that you can actually pay someone with paypal, get the stuff and then take the money back? Or is the problem when you pay with a credit-card without covering or what?

And, dont you have anything like "wire-transfer" in the us? I mean, everytime I have made deals with american people the either want me to send them checks (which I think belongs in the 20th century) or by using paypal. Isnt it possibly to just do a tranfser from my bank account to his/hers? <hr /></blockquote>Yes, if you are paid via credit card thru Paypal, the buyer can then tell his credit card company he didn't authorize the sale and they'll reverse the charges.
Within the USA Paypal has some protections for that, but none at all internationally. Even IN the USA, many sellers insist on Paypal by bank transfer only. This is also not offered outside outside the USA for security and verification reasons.

If someone gives you their bank account #
from the USA to Sweden to transfer funds
into the account, a decent hacker can empty the account instead, and the European authorities are apt to say "foolish American" and take no further steps to recover your money, so a bank transfer is no good for the seller. Western Union cash wires will work for the seller, but then the buyer is upset about the transfer fee. It's just much more complicated, dangerous and rancorous to try to sell overseas, so most just don't do it more than once. It's a shame
it affects a mostly law-abiding group of consumers, but you would do the same thing in all honesty, were the roles reversed.

**monk** · 09-23-2003, 11:54 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Originally posted by charvel750:
Note to non USA Americans: quit your whining about it. The USA is the best country in the world, not an opinion, a fact. If you want the benefits of an American, like easy access to our guitars, then seek citizenship and join us. (Actually, don't do that right now) I'm tired of hearing how "all you other guys" can't get in on the American action. Uh, did it occur to you that you're not HERE?! Take it as you want, I'm just saying that the USA has its privileges, and after the recent world conflicts many of you who want our guitars don't want our lifestyle, so go $%@# yourselves. [img]graemlins/evilimages/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

Lol. Here:

This should help you to get out of your isolated glass box!

**charvel750** · 09-23-2003, 11:56 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Yeah, I'm cool. It's just that I know a lot of decent people (US soldiers) who fought for my freedoms, and I don't take it for granted, EVER! So when people complain that they want the luxories of the United States of America and then refuse to accept the rest of what we believe in, it irks me. My grandfather stormed the Beach at Normandy, my father fought in the jungles of Vietnam, my cousin was in Desert Storm, and two of my buds are in Iraq NOW. Be with us or against us. Now, where's my M-16 and combat boots? [img]images/icons/mad.gif[/img]

**charvel750** · 09-23-2003, 11:58 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Hey, Monk, I got news for ya: I ain't alone!

**monk** · 09-23-2003, 11:59 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Originally posted by lerxstcat:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Monk:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by lerxstcat:
Payment protection isn't available for the seller with Paypal or credit cards, and would you just do that on trust?
Some do, but it's not prudent.

This has nothing to do with this thread, but I have to ask since I have not yet understood how it works. Does that mean that you can actually pay someone with paypal, get the stuff and then take the money back? Or is the problem when you pay with a credit-card without covering or what?

And, dont you have anything like "wire-transfer" in the us? I mean, everytime I have made deals with american people the either want me to send them checks (which I think belongs in the 20th century) or by using paypal. Isnt it possibly to just do a tranfser from my bank account to his/hers? <hr /></blockquote>Yes, if you are paid via credit card thru Paypal, the buyer can then tell his credit card company he didn't authorize the sale and they'll reverse the charges.
Within the USA Paypal has some protections for that, but none at all internationally. Even IN the USA, many sellers insist on Paypal by bank transfer only. This is also not offered outside outside the USA for security and verification reasons.

If someone gives you their bank account #
from the USA to Sweden to transfer funds
into the account, a decent hacker can empty the account instead, and the European authorities are apt to say "foolish American" and take no further steps to recover your money, so a bank transfer is no good for the seller. Western Union cash wires will work for the seller, but then the buyer is upset about the transfer fee. It's just much more complicated, dangerous and rancorous to try to sell overseas, so most just don't do it more than once. It's a shame
it affects a mostly law-abiding group of consumers, but you would do the same thing in all honesty, were the roles reversed. <hr /></blockquote>Thank you, the first part makes sence to me now. I dont agree on the second part though. Sure, I would never give my creditcard number away, but I think that giving someone your bankaccount number is safe enough. If a hacker wants it he can get it without you telling him anyway [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Do you have something like iban/bic(swift) numbers in the U.S?

**nor** · 09-23-2003, 10:23 PM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Yo Euros!
Get yer government types to drop the trade barriers against the US.

THAT'S why you have to pay through the nose.

**2Loud2Old** · 09-23-2003, 11:38 PM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Originally posted by charvel750:
Note to non USA Americans: quit your whining about it. The USA is the best country in the world, not an opinion, a fact. If you want the benefits of an American, like easy access to our guitars, then seek citizenship and join us. (Actually, don't do that right now) I'm tired of hearing how "all you other guys" can't get in on the American action. Uh, did it occur to you that you're not HERE?! Take it as you want, I'm just saying that the USA has its privileges, and after the recent world conflicts many of you who want our guitars don't want our lifestyle, so go $%@# yourselves. [img]graemlins/evilimages/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

Wow....

Deluded much?!?

Tell me Joe, do you actually get out of the country?

What "recent world" conflict are you talking about, last one I heard of was over 50 years ago.

Daily life in the rest of the Western world is pretty much the same as the U.S..

They even have electricity, the automobile and everything.

Sh*t, they have crap in Europe and Asia that won't hit North America for another 3 years.

So what are these special "privledges" you speak of, the ones that Non-Americans are jealous of. [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

Oh, yea, the Jackson Guitars contest.

I know that's why I envy America. [img]graemlins/eyes.gif[/img]

Just to be clear, I spend alot of time in the States each year, love you guys to death, but arrogant comments like that really enforce the "ugly American" Stereotype.

**2Loud2Old** · 09-23-2003, 11:59 PM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

I just want to be clear about my post.

I am NOT an anti-American. As a Canadian I have very close ties with Americans. As a Canadian I share most of the same values, but when you're a mouse next to the elephant, you have a unique perspective that lets you see things from a different angle. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

I am anti-blowhard. Joe's comments go along way to show why sometimes Europeans tend to get annoyed.. It's one thing to believe you're the best, it's quite another to constantly tell others. Doesn't win to many friends, does it?

"Like it or lump it" attitude doesn't get very far.

America is a truely great nation that has contibituted a vast amount to the world.

A strong nation both militarily and economicly, just in her lofty ideals.

The world would not be the same without her.

That said, there is a world OUTSIDE the U.S. and what it wants, thinks or feels is JUST as important.

This is way off topic now, I appologise.

[ September 24, 2003, 12:00 AM: Message edited by: 2Loud2Old ]

**sully** · 09-24-2003, 12:01 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

maybe i'm stupid, but what was that pic of? looks like some kinda thermometer.

anyway, i hear ya joe, and i hope your friends make it home safe. i thought of what things might be like if you were in the oval office, and i think this might explain your foreign policy:

if nothing else, i hope that made you laugh.

sully

**Tekky** · 09-24-2003, 12:03 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

glass cutter

**monk** · 09-24-2003, 12:08 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Originally posted by charvel750:
Hey, Monk, I got news for ya: I ain't alone!

Well, you told me to go ()"#¤ myself and so on. I will not go on with this because I know where it will end.

Have a nice day! [img]graemlins/toast.gif[/img]

[ September 23, 2003, 12:09 PM: Message edited by: Monk ]

**lerxstcat** · 09-24-2003, 12:30 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Originally posted by Monk:
[/qb]

Thank you, the first part makes sence to me now. I dont agree on the second part though. Sure, I would never give my creditcard number away, but I think that giving someone your bankaccount number is safe enough. If a hacker wants it he can get it without you telling him anyway [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img] Do you have something like iban/bic(swift) numbers in the U.S? [/QB][/QUOTE]

No sense making it easy for him! I don't know what you mean by iban/bic though. I
guess we just have a much higher incidence of wire fraud here than you do.
Paypal arose so auction dealers wouldn't have to trust each other with their credit card and bank account #s as much as for any other reason. Also with that # a NON-hacker may also be able to access your account, or use that # to get other info about you. It's called identity theft and is a big problem here. Someone gets your info and gets several credit cards, maybe a car and personal loans, all based on your credit rating, then that rating is destroyed when they of course don't pay for any of it. It can take years to clean up the mess, so yes we are careful about giving out our personal info here. Remember this because it will probably be happening in Europe soon as well under a homogenized EU government; criminals will have freer access to the economy too, not just law abiding merchants.

**monk** · 09-24-2003, 12:51 AM

Re: New giveaway at JacksonGuitars.com

Okay, then I understand why its hard to do bank to bank transfers over the atlantic. Just to make sure, this was in no way ment as a Europe vs USA thing, I was just beeing curious because its totally different here in Europe. Hopefully someone will come up with a better system that works for both of us!

Bic ,or swift id is just a code that tells what bank you are using and it works internationally. To pay someone you will also need to know his account #. To make it easier and keep the amount of different numbers to a minimum they have come up with something called Iban, which is a longer number that is a combination of both bank id and account #. But, like you say, if it is easier to make payments etc it is probably easier to steal money too [img]images/icons/frown.gif[/img]

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