Announcement

**xenophobe** · 10-15-2003, 05:02 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Originally posted by KMaynard:
The admins are watching this carefully for 2 reasons .. one that it doesn't get out of hand and 2 this may launch a test of a new idea we have. We are considering a folder similar to Charvel Cetral where you can air your bad deals without worrying about banning (Provided it's done intelligently and respecfully)

I think that's a good idea.

**xenophobe** · 10-15-2003, 05:16 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Originally posted by nor:
An inspection period can't work.

I always offer a 3 day inspection and 100% money back guarantee.

I've also sold a number of guitars to members here, and as far as I know, they all love and secretly praise me. [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]

Anyways, I offer it, especially to members here as a courtesy, no matter how much I might need the money, if they're not happy, neither am I.

**xenophobe** · 10-15-2003, 05:21 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

First (and finally) let me say, the route does look abit unsightly, but it also does look professional. Nice clean edge, and the corners on either side look good as well. Of course you can't compare it to a Factory Floyd route, because it is a conversion.

I would like to see a picture of the route done with the Floyd removed to see evidence of hacking or a "hack job". From that one picture, I just don't see it.

Originally posted by nor:
Suggestion
===========
If anyone has pics of vintage trem to Floyd conversion routs - post 'em. Floyd on AND off.

These can be compared to the rout in question.

That would be in good order.

**~K~** · 10-15-2003, 05:40 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Originally posted by mm2002:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KMaynard:
The admins are watching this carefully for 2 reasons ..... We are considering a folder similar to Charvel Cetral where you can air your bad deals without worrying about banning (Provided it's done intelligently and respecfully)

Why would you ban anybody here for airing a bad deal? Yeah, a special section would be nice but until then where do we put them? If the argument gets out of hand just do what you've always done and tell them to take it to email and kill the thread. If they persist maybe ban 'em.......but where do you draw the line? I can see you watching this thread closely but what's the point? Then again, it's probably because I don't see the big picture, but what I do see is some forum administrators who seem to think they need to carefully watch a board like this one and make sure nobody gets in a little scuffle or says bad words like SH!T or F*CK. (damned swear filters!) C'mon guys, this is the JCF, not sunday school! Let's hash it out if we need to! It's all verbal isn't it?
OK, got that off my chest, you guys have a great evening! [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] <hr /></blockquote>There's always one member who tries to take things out of context and make it a negative thing. Normally we don't allow airing a bad deal simply because it turns the board into a firepit. I'm not sure why you feel that you have the right to do anything you please on the board without having rules (at least thats the way you post comes across) and being responsibile for your actions. It also seems to ruffle your feathers that we have swear filters in place. My assumption is you are an intelligent adult, can you not convey what you need to say without swearing? Is it that big of a deal to you? You also state that if your gonna get banned for airing bad deals you don't wanna be here.. Well no one stated anything about banning for airing this irregardless of forum policy, all I asked of you was that this thread remain civil. Do you honestly beleive that it's an unreasonable request? It isn't it is the rules and everyone here abides by them ..

**charvelguy** · 10-15-2003, 07:09 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Hey?! what happened to the rating system? I must've missed that one as I was away for a bit.

I do say this with care...but it does seem when the "banned ass" avatar came about, there was alot of "I've already banned two accounts today, anyone else want to try?" type of posts coming out. So if people perceive something negative may come out of it..could it be possible it may be because of some other reason?

Rules are there for a reason, and following them as well. Maybe I need to go back a re-read the agreement.

[ October 15, 2003, 07:12 AM: Message edited by: charvelguy ]

**jgcable** · 10-15-2003, 08:23 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

After all this talk how come we still haven't seen any good pics of the hack job route. The only pic that I have seen didn't look too bad. I think that his original description of the parts guitar was very truthful and honest. He actually scared me away with his honesty. With that said though, if it was me I would return his money and take the parts guitar back. On any dealings that I make on this board I always state prior to the transaction that if the fellow BROTHER!!! Jcf'r isn't completely satisfied that I will instantly return either their money or the item with no hassle at all. It is a responsibility that I feel we all should share being members of this board especially since we are granted the ability to buy/sell and barter between ourselves.

**~K~** · 10-15-2003, 08:24 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Originally posted by charvelguy:

I do say this with care...but it does seem when the "banned ass" avatar came about, there was alot of "I've already banned two accounts today, anyone else want to try?" type of posts coming out. So if people perceive something negative may come out of it..could it be possible it may be because of some other reason?

Your semi correct here. The problem we run into, is when there are numerous problems on the board at once we sometimes get caught in the "this looks bad so everything is bad mentality". Simply put we can become hypersensitive to issues when major issues happen. It has caused us at times to be a little less patient with certain lesser posts. We are all human and we sometimes get dictated by the days events.. hey it happens .. The admin moniker doesn't mean we aren't allowed to make mistakes.. we do as much as anyone.

We also get hypersensitive at times due to what we are doing on the board and the feedback we receive. One case in point was I was in process of trying to update the gallery and got slammed by a member for not getting his stuff in there right away. It caused me to have the who cares attitude and walk away from the updates. We ran into this with the guitar giveaway.. some guys felt it was fun while others had the .. it's only an indian made pos ... this kinda leaves us scrtching our heads as to why we do it. but it's pretty rewarding when we do a decent job and you guys are happy ..so there's a flip side to everything ..

This is not an excuse but an explanation as to why we react at times ..

**shreddermon** · 10-15-2003, 08:43 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

This whole thread will be nothing but he said / she said. Note to both buyer and seller: different people will take different views. Right now, with this thread and depending on their opinion, other members are thinking to themselves "Hmmm, don't want to do business with buyer and/or seller". In the whole, no real good can come out of this thread for either of you. More likely, it is in your best interests to keep it off the Board.

I'll go back to my original post: take the guitar back, send the buyer his money. Resell the guitar to someone else here or Ebay, and risk taking a loss. Your reputation is more important, no matter who is "right".

As to mediation: not a great idea, IMHO. That will potentially lead to more inflamed emotions and/or groups of members taking sides against each other. It might work well, but I doubt it.

As to a "flame area": I'm of two minds on this one. I've seen it work well and poorly over at Charvel Central. Positive: airs reputations and good/bad dealings publically. Negative: well, just look at the amount of bruised egos and backstabbing in SD-land. Then again, much of that would probably still happen with or without public airings.

**Shawn Lutz** · 10-15-2003, 08:43 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Originally posted by KMaynard:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by charvelguy:

I do say this with care...but it does seem when the "banned ass" avatar came about, there was alot of "I've already banned two accounts today, anyone else want to try?" type of posts coming out. So if people perceive something negative may come out of it..could it be possible it may be because of some other reason?

Your semi correct here. The problem we run into, is when there are numerous problems on the board at once we sometimes get caught in the "this looks bad so everything is bad mentality". Simply put we can become hypersensitive to issues when major issues happen. It has caused us at times to be a little less patient with certain lesser posts. We are all human and we sometimes get dictated by the days events.. hey it happens .. The admin moniker doesn't mean we aren't allowed to make mistakes.. we do as much as anyone.

We also get hypersensitive at times due to what we are doing on the board and the feedback we receive. One case in point was I was in process of trying to update the gallery and got slammed by a member for not getting his stuff in there right away. It caused me to have the who cares attitude and walk away from the updates. We ran into this with the guitar giveaway.. some guys felt it was fun while others had the .. it's only an indian made pos ... this kinda leaves us scrtching our heads as to why we do it. but it's pretty rewarding when we do a decent job and you guys are happy ..so there's a flip side to everything ..

This is not an excuse but an explanation as to why we react at times .. <hr /></blockquote>Well Kev with 1900 users there is always going to be a a$$hole or 2,3,4 (myself included at times) etc so don't let it affect what you set out to do...you guys do a great job administrating this board.
[img]graemlins/headbang.gif[/img]

**charvel pointy head** · 10-15-2003, 08:46 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Chuck, I believe your refering to the granite graphic Jackson soloist? A very cool guitar. If you recall what happened ( I do) Yes, at the last minute I did call the deal off, but the guitar was in transit as you had already shipped. At the time you told me to hold on to it for a couple days to see if I liked it. I was considering if there was a way to buy it outright, as, if you recall, I'd taken said Charvel off the table and wanted to keep it. Fair enough. I then, with your permission if you recall, attempted to sell this guitar, as I had it in my possession, for you. I didn't have it a month, more like a week (8 days to be exact) If you recall, that transaction went over rather quite smoothly. You got the guitar back and sold it w/in a week I remember. You also wrote some possitive emails as I recall on the subject. Now it bites me in the ass? Not fair dude. I'm not sure what other deal your talking about, though.

**sully** · 10-15-2003, 08:52 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Originally posted by mm2002:
Well, I don't know nor do I care why word was suspended but if I can no longer come here and state how I feel in an adult manner then I don't care if I get banned or suspended or whatever. Trouble makers should get banned, but not people just being honest.

i'm jumping ahead of the thread, so if this has been already replied and resolved, please ignore.

if we have an accusational section of the board, no one would be banned for airing a bad deal. personally, i think this whole thing should have been done off the board, and if impartial input was asked, one of us (admins) should have been contacted. that being said, let's go back to the thread! [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

sully

**ranalli** · 10-15-2003, 09:05 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

Originally posted by mm2002:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KMaynard:
The admins are watching this carefully for 2 reasons ..... We are considering a folder similar to Charvel Cetral where you can air your bad deals without worrying about banning (Provided it's done intelligently and respecfully)

Why would you ban anybody here for airing a bad deal? Yeah, a special section would be nice but until then where do we put them? If the argument gets out of hand just do what you've always done and tell them to take it to email and kill the thread. If they persist maybe ban 'em.......but where do you draw the line? I can see you watching this thread closely but what's the point? Then again, it's probably because I don't see the big picture, but what I do see is some forum administrators who seem to think they need to carefully watch a board like this one and make sure nobody gets in a little scuffle or says bad words like SH!T or F*CK. (damned swear filters!) C'mon guys, this is the JCF, not sunday school! Let's hash it out if we need to! It's all verbal isn't it?
OK, got that off my chest, you guys have a great evening! [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] <hr /></blockquote>I agree wholeheartedly...I love visiting this board but it's like friggin sunday school censorship every time a few words or said or a dispute of some kind is discussed. How lame. If wanted everything to be censored like on Sesame St. I'll head over on to the Les Paul forum or PRS.

**Deneb** · 10-15-2003, 09:26 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

The point is, my route was bad from the factory in 89, I bought it used, the guitar functions, it only looks a bit gay, but no one notices it.

I believe there is another thread that *cosmetic* flaws are not very *important* it dont affect playability, it looks fine.

It already appears as people have had bad dealings with the one who has the guitar, make him keep it, and thats the end of it.

**sully** · 10-15-2003, 09:30 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

no, i can't see any bad past deals involving mulder in this thread.

i also encourage you to find better adjectives to describe how your floyd routs look.

sully

**Deneb** · 10-15-2003, 09:31 AM

Re: With much trepidation. . .

K, I honestly do not know what is wrong with the boards here, the only thing I can see is when a thread gets to someones disliking, banning is mentioned by other users.

It should not seem like, eh strong arming or whatever.

However, you guys are not paid, you do this for free, and this is a damn good job.

If they don't like it, they can hit the road, after all, their membership ain't costing them any money, it's free, and they keep coming back.

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