It is all in the marketing

[mudkicker]

Re: It is all in the marketing

I agree with newc on several points. ESP will have a problem on its hands in a couple of years. Already I see kids ask who is that, and its george lynch. Esp has a few models that can cross over into country and contemporary music.
Jackson does not. You will not see someone other than a metal head jamming on stage with a pointy guitar. They are well made but face it they like the ESP endorsees are a dying breed. Like the graphic charvels of the 80's. As much as it pains me country seems to be the big money market now. The only guitar I see as a cross over is the Charvel 25 aniv. guitar. Jackson has the the resources to make a push in other markets now. Keep the pointy guitars and the bad boy image for your rock division, but create a seperate up scale model that can cross over into other types of music.

[charvel750]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Originally posted by MirandaM:

Jackson makes some of the best mass produced guitars on the market and yet they are not too well known and people are spending more for guitars that are not as well made...

Thank you for letting me rant [img]graemlins/rant.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Jackson not too well known?! Why do you think Kramer, ESP, Ibanez, BC Rich, and countless others outright ripped them off? Jackson established the SuperStrat and every maker has, since then, copied this design to some extent. Jackson is very well known, and the endorsers are too: Carlos Cavazo and Randy Rhoads are pretty popular, no?!

[charvel750]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Mudkicker said, "Esp has a few models that can cross over into country and contemporary music.
Jackson does not. You will not see someone other than a metal head jamming on stage with a pointy guitar. They are well made but face it they like the ESP endorsees are a dying breed."

Wait! What about Jackson's Sweetone line?! What about players like Jeff Beck and Holdsworth? Big time users of Jackson guitars but not metalheads! For crying outloud, Outkast was using the new Charvel line as of last year! Any Soloist or Dinky can get country and contemporary music tones, maybe we need to back off the gain on our effects but really, they can do it if you can play it.

[guitar geek]

Re: It is all in the marketing

I bought my charvel for a smoother sound and better tone (model 6) to compensate for my more aggresive Ibanez. so, verstatile enough (the soloist and dinkys at least).

and I think newc has a point regarding the playing style of nowadays compared with that of a couple of years back. Shredding is not hot anymore: I know a lot of those yawning guitar players, I think 20/80 is even more in place than 30/70.
So, if jackson wants to get a better market position, they should indeed endorse those guys playing the newer stuff, how about ben gurdy, or whatever his name is, of evanescence: plays jacksons and to be honest: I had an import jackson a few years back, the ps4 and I messed the trem up, partly because of ignorance from my side and partly because of the crappy tremolo. so I backed off of Jackson, but I always regretted that, because I really liked the dinky and soloist shape combined with the head. It was the video of bring me to life that made me reconsider it and persuaded me to get a model 6 (after some research about the suiting guitar). so, it works nowadays with those videos, endorsing players.

but.... I think there is one thing: jackson has roughly 2 lines: import and USA made. I am getting the idea that the USA part is more a "boys with toys" kind of thing (if I regard it from a business science point of view, sorry, am a student [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img] ). something like the Morgan Motorcars: top of the line stuff, but also a hobby for the builders, or more a passion. And the import line is more something that keeps the company financially healthy, so they can continue building those guitars.

if it works, and it is actually the way it workes or worked with jackson, what is the point of going to do intensive marketing? The guitars will reach the target area: people loving those guitars for what they are. The only problem is, that it takes so fucking long to get your guitar.

Harrald

[Tekky]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Originally posted by mudkicker:
Esp has a few models that can cross over into country and contemporary music. Jackson does not. You will not see someone other than a metal head jamming on stage with a pointy guitar.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That's not necessarily true. I've seen Jacksons being played in blues, jazz, and country bands.

[mudkicker]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Thet last time i saw outcast they were using jacksons not charvels. The sweetone line? There is the point of this thread I do not know anything about them. My local dealer does not stock them. Maybe jackson needs to do more marketing of their other lines. How many more spreads can they do with the old RR line of guitars.
Guitar geek you say "if it works, and it is actually the way it workes or worked with jackson, what is the point of going to do intensive marketing? " Business 101 to continue to survive as a business your must grow your market by a certain % over the previous year. Alot of us feel that jackson is not doing that. They were simply getting by. If it was working then they wouldn't have been bought out by fender.

[Epica]

Re: It is all in the marketing

If you're going to advertise with hooters and pornstarts etc. do it right, like Dean Guitars [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

[Tekky]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Not to beat a dead horse, but these items are from the Artists/Endorsers list..

Chuck Goff Toby Keith Band
Joey Floyd Toby Keith Band
Johnie Helms Toby Keith Band
Kerry Marx Grand Ole Opry
Mark Akin Soundtrack Artist
Pat Bergeson Lyle Lovett Band
Paul Olivarri Emilio Y Grupo Rio
Dre Outkast

[charvel750]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Originally posted by mudkicker:
Thet last time i saw outcast they were using jacksons not charvels. The sweetone line? If it was working then they wouldn't have been bought out by fender.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">OK, so Outkast was using a C/J product, that's my point. And, the Sweetone line is another point, a non metal marketing strategy right there for you. It's not Jackson's fault you were unaware of that line. And the final statement in your post is out of line. The reason for the sale had nothing to do with success or lack of it, it was a business venture that encompassed far more than that.

[pro-fusion]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Jackson targeting country guitarists is about as likely to succeed as Rickenbacker marketing guitars to metal musicians...

[axeman81]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Miranda, all the endorsers are sluts in the way that they get paid for using their names/faces for promoting the product.
Like the other guys said, we might end up paying a lot more for these great guitars if Jackson becomes successful in other markets. Just look at where PRS is now vs. where they were a few years back. They are charging more for their products now than ever, $5000 for some of their guitars!
You could have a Double-neck Kelly with built-in coffee-machine for that price for f***'s sake!
And they don't necessarily make a better product than before either. History often goes to show that whatever the product is, when production volume goes up, quality tends to go down.

Jackson makes a great product at an unbeatable price. I didn't know a lot about different guitars when I was a kid starting out to play. I knew only what magazine ads told me. I didn't know about bolt-ons and neck-thru's, tone woods and electronics. The more I've learnt about guitars the past couple of years, the more I've come to realize that the most commercial brands also make a lot of quality guitars, but they seriously over-charge kids who are paralyzed by their clever marketing schemes and are happy to shell out the big $$$ for whatever their favorite star is playing.

As for the waiting time, I agree with most people who recently discussed this in a thread about GMW:

I will at ANY given time wait for ANY amount of time for a QUALITY product produced by people with LONGTIME EXPERIENCE and PRIDE in their work, such as Dan Lawrence, rather than have a bunch of half-wit schmucks hired to produce a bunch of HALF-ASSED guitars, just so there will be 2 week waiting times for the USA Select guitars.
(sorry for the doc dryer ranting there thanks [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] )

About Jackson being in a nichè market, selling mostly to rock and metal players: I don't mind! This is the whole point!! I play METAL and ROCK so I want a guitar made specifically to do this well!!! I don't want a jack-in-the-box guitar that can do a thousand different styles, because that would spell COMPROMISE one way or the other!

Thanks for reading this,

- Rune.

[The Eristic]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Originally posted by mudkicker:
You will not see someone other than a metal head jamming on stage with a pointy guitar.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Come to one of my shows.

[Venomboy]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Jackson has never had consistent marketing over the years. Look at all the catalogs and ads. Complete mishmash of messages and visuals. Sometimes it's just the guitar, sometimes it's with a person. It seems like Jackson didn't pay much attention to marketing consistently.

Remember the recent Charvel imports? "The original hot rod guitar"? What happened to that tagline? Now it seems like Charvels are USA made again.

Now with the FMIC buyout there seems to be a little more consistency and still a bit of a struggle as to how to market the company and guitars. Sure, there's a porn star in the catalogs. But nowhere else. Big pictures of the guitars are featured in recent ads.

I'm guessing that FMIC has finally put an ad agency/design firm to the task or has some in house people dedicated to the task. A buyout/merger is always a tricky thing and it takes time to reposition a company, if that's what Jackson is doing.

[Sean Phillips]

Re: It is all in the marketing

Actually a stock Jackson is great for almost any kind of music and as far as im concerned a jackson does work for jazz and country or anything else well built is after all well built.

[Boxcar Willie 84]

Re: It is all in the marketing

I love playing polka on my Jackson.