Palm Muting

[Iced In Flames]

Sorry if this has been asked but I didnt a search and came up empty.

How good really are Jacksons for palm muting? Most of the music I hear with Jackson endorsers are not quite the sound I like but I know Jacksons sound better than that. I like a smooth tight crunch as well. Stuff like Scott Ian is too gritty and Dave Mustaine had a bit weaker sound. Can a Jackson hold its own up to a Gibson Explorer per se? I know how those play as I own one and I love the palm muting on it. Nice and warm.

The axe I guess to compare would be the Rhaods I'm getting. All Korina, 25.5, Neck Thru with Ebony fingerboard and Barto ZBS-80 pups. Think that could give me a nice warm palm mute? I have a old King V and its alder I think with a Maple board and its too twangy.
I'm mainly a rythem guitarist. I prefer a tight, heavy low end and keep that goin rather than doin the soloings.
I use Di'Addario Medium Jazz strings(13 to 56 I think)

I know just about any guitar can sound good but I'd just like to hear your oinions on this matter. Or are maybe Jacksons best for shredding?

[Number Of The Priest]

Re: Palm Muting

[img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img] Huh? Great palm muted tone is attributed to technique and tone rather than a particular guitar manufacturer. I can get great palm muted tone from any of my guitars, even my acoustics, surprisingly.

Perhaps a different guitar pick is in order for you. Switch to a different gauge pick to see if you like the tone coming from it.

[Iced In Flames]

Re: Palm Muting

Nah. If you pick up a PRS Custom 22 and a BC Rich Beast, they dont play alike. The tone from my V and the tone from my Gibson are very different as well. Picks arent an issue. I use 2.0 Gator picks and I love em.

[Number Of The Priest]

Re: Palm Muting

True, but that's why we buy different guitars, right? Because they sound different and we want a whole spectrum of possible tones that we can work with?

I used to love those Gators as well but found out that I was wearing them out too quickly. What's your secret? I almost have to change to a new pick after a day of playing. I guess I should lighten up my picking hand, but that's where half of my good palm muted tone comes from. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[Miffy rules]

Re: Palm Muting

I heard that string-thru guitar sounds more rock-steady and better for rhythm playing than a guitar with trem. Don't know if it's true.

[nonamemx]

Re: Palm Muting

eherm. . .Jim Dunlop USA Gels extra heavy. (yellow)

[Thoraby]

Re: Palm Muting

I asked a similar question at the Kramer board and someone there informed me that low impedance pickups such as EMG's will give a much tighter and crunchier palm muted sound than a high impedance pickup.

My Jackson Strat with a EMG81 sounds hella crunchier palm muted than my Nightswan does, but thena again, those two guitars are quite different, wood- and construction-wise...

yup [img]graemlins/baby.gif[/img]

[xenophobe]

Re: Palm Muting

I find it's easier to palm mute with much more variance with either tune-o-matic or non-recessed floyd guitars.

I don't think body style has much to do with it as technique and the proper pickup and amp.

[eaeolian]

Re: Palm Muting

Originally posted by Number Of The Priest:
I used to love those Gators as well but found out that I was wearing them out too quickly. What's your secret? I almost have to change to a new pick after a day of playing. I guess I should lighten up my picking hand, but that's where half of my good palm muted tone comes from. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I have the same problem - I used the 1.0 Tortex forever, but I would wear the tip off of them in one rehearsal. I'm using the new Ultex in 1.14, and they last longer and the attack sounds better.

Oh, and for the record, palm muting on my USA Jacksons sounds fine - and I pick VERY hard. [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

Mike

[RR05xx]

Re: Palm Muting

I agree that pickup and amp is very important to this equation. However, I have found that I get alot better crunch out of my either my 2001 SL2 (with whatever Dumncans come stock in those) and my 89 KV with EMGs as compared to my 84 RR with the old Duncans. I would also say that body wood is also a factor and if you are not into the "brighter" attack, I would stay away from lighter woods and maple.

I think that while my newer SL2 is a great player, I have found that I need to tweek the amp more to tone down the "brightness" and what I consider to be gain that also distorts the sound as compared to the other guitars that I play, but that is just me and since most of my guitars tend to be made of heavier wood and use EMGs, that could contribute to the darker sound that I like.

Also technique as well, but you can experiment and chage that around in 10 secs so should not be an issue.

Not to pigeon hole, but what sound/album are you trying to get? (I am not a big fan of Mustaine or Ian's sound either).

BTW: Dunlup Green .88 Rules!

[Inazone]

Re: Palm Muting

My experience has been that I get a better palm-muted crunch with a Floyd than without. I've also had better results with the Seymour Duncan Full Shred than the Duncan Custom or JB. But hand placement seems to be crucial. Even with a mild pickup like a Screamin' Demon, in a basswood body with a hardtail bridge, I can palm mute fine.

[Chameleonfong]

Re: Palm Muting

La la la lala la!! Lalalala!! Sorry, kinda lost it there..

We're talking about palm muted so it should be..
Jug jigga jug jigga jug jigga jug jigga JUG JUG!!

That IMHO is the best palm muted tone courtesy of Strong Bad


Fong

[StuTDavis]

Re: Palm Muting

Your palm muting sound quality is going to bounce on a lot of different factors. Whether you like the sound of one guitar vs another will depend on what palm muted sound you want to hear, and those factors. Most of these same factors will determine just about everything, as far as what gear you might or might not like. Here are some things to keep in mind...

Human factors:
Technique
Your ears
Your taste

Gear factors:
The guitar's construction (wood, parts, quality)
Pickups
Amp
EQing
Other gear (effects, BBEs etc)

Everything else kept constant in your gear--using the same amp, EQing etc--and nothing about you, your taste, or technique changing, you should notice a bit of difference in palm-muting on the V vs. the Exp.

Assuming your Exp is the standard mahagony/mahagony/rosewood with set-neck, that combination and tons of wood on the Exp make it a "warm" guitar. Depending on what pickups are in it, they could either be adding to that warmth or taking away from it. And, no offense, but depending on whether it's a USA Gibson or an el-chepo knockoff can have an affect as well.

Alder is a more "all around" sort of wood. Higher in the highs and lows, not so midsy in general--not as "warm" as mahagony. The neck is probably maple as well as that fingerboard being maple, and those will brighten it up quite a lot. Plus it's a V shape. I don't know about anyone else, but Vs always seem brighter than their strat or other shaped counterparts--maybe the lack of wood "up top" on Vs? I dunno, but Vs always just seem brighter to me. Those factors take an "all around" guitar and do just what you said--make it more "twangy"--"brighter". Depending on if it's bolt-on, neck-through, or set-neck, those factors will add or detract from the brightness somewhat. Again, depending on the pickups, they could round out some of the brightness or accentuate it even more.

Most that I've heard about Korina on your new V has always seemed to tell me it's a fairly bright wood in general. Somebody correct me if I'm off base, but what I've heard is it's more along the lines of maple or ash--some of the brightest woods generally used for guitars. Along with that, you'll have a maple neck and an ebony board, with neck-through construction. All of that says "bright" in general, though neck-throughs don't tend to be quite as bright as their bolt-on counterparts, to my ears. Plus, again, Vs just are always brighter to my ears, I think it's the shape. I'm not familiar with the pickups you're getting in it, but they could, again, make it brighter or warm it back up a little. Overall, I'd just guess you are probably looking at a guitar that's even brighter than your King V and, sad to say, my guess is you will like the sound of palm muting on it even less than your King V. Just a guess...

Stu

[Iced In Flames]

Re: Palm Muting

Stu. I'm not really looking for a sound. I've got a sound I like but I'll go along with it if ya can help me out [img]images/icons/smile.gif[/img]

Right now my rig is
ENGL Powerball
Gibson USA Explorer
Mahogany, Rosewood board, etc.. standard specs
I have a custom pickup in it. Its basically a 500-T but hotter.
Di'Adarrio Medium Jazz strings

Thats all I use. It was either get rack gear or a custom Rhoads so I chose the geetar.

I like my setup to have a smooth distortion. Listen to Iced Earth for an example. In particular, Hold At All Costs and Jack. I already have that kind of tone, but I want to know if my Rhoads will sound anywhere near like this while palm muting.

Specs are
Korina neck and body
Neck thru, and string thru
Ebony fretboard
25.5 scale
Tone Pros bridge
Bartolini ZBS-80 pickup

Korina is pretty much like Mahogany execpt I believe it resonates a bit better and sounds very warm like mahogany but maybe more.


Just wanna know if it'll be good sounding while palm muting. I like the simpleness of my gear and its sound thus far. Just wanna know when compared with other axes if it will sound how I'd like it to.

I mean listen to Zakk Wylde, his palm muting is way too grainy for my tastes. Now listen to Puritania by Dimmu Borgir. Borgir have a lot nicer sound, and I know they use Rhoads and V's with mahogany. The V's are the Mustaine sig ones. Or maybe the Iced Earth tunes.

[StuTDavis]

Re: Palm Muting

Well, like I said, all other things kept constant, whether your new guitar will sound the same as or different than your other guitar will be determined by the guitar itself. The wood, the construction, the pickups etc.

I wasn't suggesting you were looking for a different sound, only trying to point you in the right directions to be able to predict how this guitar with your setup will sound VS your other guitars. You take the sound you have, compensate for the expected differences in the new guitar VS your current guitars, and should be able to predict the end result fairly well--at least that's the theory, and it generally works for me.

As in, if you have a warm guitar now, and you like a warm sound, then you get a brighter guitar, you should expect the output sound through your speakers to be brighter than the other guitar. Simple logic, really.

Assuming that you're right and Korina is possibly even warmer than mahagony, that should tone down any other brightness in the new guitar some. I think what you're asking about is the "texture" of the sound while palm muting. The reference I usually use for palm muting is simple open palm muting on the low E string...

Some guitars/setups will have a rounder, more boomy low E string palm muted sound. Most likely, the setup has a more rounded (less defined) sound altogether, as well, as opposed to a brighter or more "thrashy" (scooped mids) kind of sound. It only stands to reason that a rounded overall sound will give more rounded palm mutes, right? For a brighter or thrashy (more defined) overall sound, you can expect sharper, more harsh sounding palm mutes. A change, then, from one guitar to another, will change the texture of that palm muting sound somewhat, since the guitar will somewhat change the overall sound VS another guitar. So, if you have a brighter guitar, giving you harsh and sharp edged palm mutes, then get a more mellow sounding guitar, the palm mutes with this guitar should sound more rounded than with the other guitar. Make sense?

So...figuring all of this, what could you expect out of your new guitar VS your current guitars?

Stu