Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitars

[Chuckracer]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

John C, I had to read Newc's post a few times before I got it, too.
What he meant was Wayne built bodies and necks before he sold the company to Grover, not the parts.

Newc's been losing us all recently. Ever since NAMM...

[LUVGUN]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

lol

[Hossman]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

Yes, I somewhat agree on that Schecter part. I do
believe Schecter played a large part in the training
of Wayne to make bodies. Just the fact that the
templates were copies of Schecter's Templates speaks
volumes. But as to who taught who the building process
between David and Wayne is in really up in the air.
Possibly they were both learning the craft together at
the same moment.


Let me set the record straight. When I say a "REAL
CHARVEL" I simply mean a Wayne "hands-on" Charvel. I
have no problem calling a legally and officially
logo-ed guitar by it's respective logo.

For example, if Fender bought "Wayne guitars mfg" and
started making them (without Wayne invovled) would
they really still be a "Wayne" guitar? No, not a
"hands-ons" Wayne guitar. That is all I mean about a
Real Charvel.

Certainly and legally the Charvels can be called and
logo-ed "Charvel" guitars so could a Fender owned and
operated ( without Wayne) "Wayne" guitar. Many times
there is no person behind the name. (ex. I believe,
Gary Kramer was gone before Kramer guitars were ever
out for sale). Sometime quality is reflected in the
name but not always. Also, for example, look what
happened to Fender quality when Leo sold to CBS and
there was not an actualy person to back the product.
Not saying that is the reason but it did happen that
quality of Fender continuely declined until Companies
like Schecter and Charvel put a dent in the market.

That is what is good about Charvel. Jackson continued
to improve Charvel and keep it in-line and VHs prior
association with Charvel was of great help which
lasted until EVH was in full promotion of Kramer. So
that was a good (78-83) 5 years before EVH was widely
known in not using Charvel and instead endorsing
Kramer. By 82 Fender and Gibson were no longer King.
Charvel / Jackson was King to the new young gun
players of the early to late 80s. Fender and Gibson
had the years of player history and following behind
them but it was an amazing feat for Charvel/Jackson
to compete with and become the Top Jimmy of guitars
before the mid to late 80s arrived with rival
companies gaining success and the Charvel players
leaving for payola.

The peak selling period for Charvel was 82 to 84. I
believe the sales of Charvel began dropping due to
competition and aforemetion events. Kramer with EVH
and Gibson and Fender getting their acts together and
making improvements etc. Jeff Beck briefly using a
Jackson and Allan Holdsworth taking on Ibanez and so
on. I believe this led to Grover making the marketing
decision to sell and to expand on Jackon's guitars as
well as the contuation of few Charvels from time to
time.

The overseas sell off of Charvel was a good move, mind
you and those Charvel Models certainly rival many
other overseas and USA guitars.

Another Myth is that Charvel and Jackson were
completely different mfgs. or companies, pre 86.

Cheers!!

[John C]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

Lots of great information here, that's for sure! Charvel/Jackson is just a huge part of the guitar renaissance we've enjoyed over the last 20+ years. I suppose I didn't follow out their history as much because most "off the rack" Jacksons have the wrong neck shape for me - I'm pretty much in the 1 5/8" wide and vintage Fender taper "C" shape camp and most Jacksons (and USA Charvels) I've been able to get my hands on have fallen in the 1 11/16" wide slim taper neck camp - instant hand cramps for me.

If you all have any interest, I can post my timeline of how Schecter was the parent (or grandparent) of Anderson (of course), Suhr, and some other builders who play in the "exotic wood" side of the house.

[Jim Shine]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

Play some older models if you ever get a chance. I have an '84 Soloist with a neck that is a dead ringer (except in width) to my '59 Jazzmaster neck. Same thickness, same neck profile.

[jgcable]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

In regards to custom builders, Schecter started it all followed by Boogie. We can't forget Jim Chandler either. He was there behind the scenes from the beginning too. Wayne was the first to get brand name recognition.

[Hossman]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

I give kudos to all those aftermarket guitars and parts companies. The history is cool chat and debate material. Although, who was first is not as important to me as who was using them and how most of those aftermarket brandnames were better quality and less expensive than factory Gibsons or Fenders.

I like the pre 70s Gibson ad Fenders just as much as the mid 70s to early 80s aftermarket companies.

Another Mtyh is that those "kit" aftermarket guitars of the mid 70s to early 80s guitars were inferior to the big guys Fender and Gibson.

[Jim Shine]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

It is also a myth that before those aftermarket companies came around, replacement parts (including bodies and necks) were near impossible to find. Though they did make them easily accessable and offered some nice variations from the standard.

[John C]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

[ QUOTE ]
Play some older models if you ever get a chance. I have an '84 Soloist with a neck that is a dead ringer (except in width) to my '59 Jazzmaster neck. Same thickness, same neck profile.

[/ QUOTE ]

Jim - if I ever get the chance I'll give it a shot; those mid-80s C/Js are getting harder to find. Plus, there was so much hand work that no two are alike.

[Jim Shine]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

From what I hear, the Holdsworth models have a neck more like you and I would apprecaite. I am hoping to try one someday.

[bombtek]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitars

Jackson moved their Custom shop to Ontario CANADA....because of the unquestioned superiority and easy access to Canadian maple....just think of how much they saved on import tarrifs if such maple had to have been shipped all the way to the shop located in downtown San Dimas.....much less ALL the way to Fort Worth Texas .....geez Grover sure was one business saavy dude...just kidding ...I just made this up lol [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

[Final Sacrifice]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

[ QUOTE ]
Myth: Jackson guitars are only good for playing "Metal"
Fact: only if you have a turnip for a brain.


[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not saying they can't be, but who plays stuff other than metal/hard rock on theirs? That's what I'm buying one for.

And about the last post's Ontario, Canada thing, I was so confused when I first started looking into jacksons and seeing that their AMERICAN guitars were made in Ontario. I thought, "man has NAFTA gone this far" then finally I saw someone type out Ontario, California and I felt really stupid. Haha.

[Final Sacrifice]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

[ QUOTE ]
Neckthroughs have superior sustain/tone/quality compared to bolt-ons. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] You can apply that to Jackson neckthroughs versus Jackson bolt-ons, Charvel neckthroughs versus Charvel bolt-ons, Jackson versus Charvel, and J/C versus other brands. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]
NOOB ALERT! NOOB ALERT! Then what's the point? I always thought neckthroughs WERE better, but were usually more expensive and if it broke you're screwed. Please correct me. [img]/images/graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

[Number Of The Priest]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

Noob alert hmmm? Okay...

Would somebody here like to educate both myself the NOOB and Final Sacrifice the expert on the neckthrough VS bolt-on sustain/tone/quality issue? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Final Sacrifice]

Re: Popular myths about Charvel and Jackson guitar

I was talking about me being a NOOB, jeez. I never pretend I know what I'm talking about
And why is there a maximum edit time? 1st time I've seen that on a forum. I was going to make it more clear I was talking about myself, oh well.