Possibility of FMIC killing J/C or selling?

[Accept2]

If you look at what Fender did to Guild and Gretch, it will play out the same way. Before Fender both brands were pretty hard to buy. Guild was producing very low numbers and they couldnt keep up with demand. Im not even sure there was any Gretch production anymore pre FMIC. After FMIC took over, stores filled up with them. Fender even brought the DeArmond name from the moth balls (like they did with Charvel), and they subsequently killed the brand off. No big loss though, since the brand was inactive before they bought Guild. On the downside, and this is highly subjective so dont start ragging, Guilds started coming out of China, when in the past Guilds were a US made guitar only. Gretch had the same thing happen only they were now Japanese. As well the question is always asked if a guitar coming off of Fender lines, can possibly be a Guild (also applies to Jackson). The answer is subjective. When the answer is subjective, then the result is that FMIC will not kill off Jackson. It will only happen in the minds of those who subjectively believe the Fender made Jacksons arent real Jacksons. Since the availability of the product has been increased, those people will be in an ever decreasing minority because more and more people will be coming into the Jackson players family.................

[CMB]

Yes, they are. Think of the situation now as the same as it was with the original San Dimas Charvels. They were all custom orders, but dealers would place some orders on spec so they would have some guitars in stock to sell. A lot of the plain jane Charvels were ordered like that by dealers.

Thanks. I guess it makes sense to me since I see Charvels as pretty individualistic - the ones that are most 'desirable' are the ones that stand out i.e. graphic, or matching headstock, or whatever. How many guitars get posted here and someone replies "That would be my dream guitar if only it had ___!" - order from the CS and get exactly what you want.

Of course if I had to duplicate my Charvel through the CS today I'd never be able to afford it.

craig

[slayer]

Well, my take on it is:

I don`t know if the Jackson name will die out or not, my guess is it will not, but i for one am very angry over the CS price increases as I feel the prices were high enough already. I am right on the edge of ordering another new CS Jackson or Charvel, depending on the % of CS price increases. I am still not sure of what the % of increase is-20% ? If people want to pay crazy money for a CS Jackson or Charvel, be my guest, that is your choice, but I may have to take my hard earned $$$$$ elswhere if the price increase is too much. I can`t believe how many members here actually embrase or are like "oh well" on the CS price increases, doesn`t make sense to me. Jack.

[ABSOLUT CHARVEL]

:ROTF:
Thanks Tim, I needed to clean off my keyboard anyway...

Tim,
that was funnier than hell!!!!!! I too spilled on my keyboard. Thank God it is a Microsoft wireless keyboard. They can take a beating and you can type up to 33% faster. I suggest eveyone goes out and buys one.

[skorb]

Guilds started coming out of China, when in the past Guilds were a US made guitar only.

Accept2, your whole post was excellent.

one thing, I think FMIC is making US Guilds (the expensive ones with block inlays and fancy woods) at the Tacoma guitar factory (which they also own) in Tacoma, WA.

and yeah those shitty chinese Guilds are an abomination. I got me a killer 1977 F212 off ebay last year, because those old US Guilds are legendary.

as for Charvel discontinuing the standard line due to low sales, what did they expect when charging that freeking much for a solid color bolt on pointy? the obvious occurred - few bought them. I might have considered buying one but I already have a $350 Model 2 that is every bit as good as any of the new standards.

maybe if FMIC had the sense to bring back the full Charvel Model range, MIJ as they were, they would see the revenue from that side of the house that they wanted to see back when FMIC un-mothballed the brand.

[Mike]

US guitars > Chinese guitars

[AK47]

US guitars > Chinese guitars

Chinese guitars = more money for FMIC.

Therefore to FMIC Chinese guitars > US guitars

[VitaminG]

Chinese guitars = more money for FMIC.

Therefore to FMIC Chinese guitars > US guitars

which is a moot point in regards to Jackson if FMIC are killing off the brand anyway

[AK47]

I was replying to chvl91 on how FMIC views their product thats all.

[peedenmark7]

I dont believe fender will do away with jackson, charvel or besmirge the line names.
jackson is a lost leader line [at least for now], a prestige name that only adds to the image/worth of fmic.

personally I would love to see them do away with both usa lines.
theyre cookie cutter clutter and slow the custom shop down.
it would be nice to see only custom shop guitars pouring out of the factory once again.
that would force the dealers to be fully hands on in the custom ordering process , as they would order guitars they knew the could sell rather than getting stuck with the boat anchor store stock thats rammed down their throats.
back in '85 we couldnt get these guitars fast enough...
2 soloists and concert bass would trickle in with 3-4 charvels and in a couple weeks they were all gone , and empty space on the wall waiting for more to arrive.
they also sold at full retail, just as the deans did during their hey-day in the late 70s.

along these lines hamer is owned by kaman... its been made very clear they dont care how much hamer makes each year... they've given them the green light to say NO to whatever they dont care to build... its a prestige line under the wing of a financially stable parent company.

far better q/c with a hamer though.
I'd sure like to feel comfortable ordering some new j/c stuff... but I think until someone like tim wilson is back in charge of that ordering process, theres gonna be snags...
fmic will come around eventually.

[AK47]

I agree with you Peedanmark7 I would like to see the same thing but those damned lawyers cant order nothing from the custom shop without them insisting on "their way"
I wish it went to a boutique line like it was and they would truely let you order anything you wanted not how they or the lawyers wanted.

[jrnic]

as for Charvel discontinuing the standard line due to low sales, what did they expect when charging that freeking much for a solid color bolt on pointy? the obvious occurred - few bought them. I might have considered buying one but I already have a $350 Model 2 that is every bit as good as any of the new standards.

maybe if FMIC had the sense to bring back the full Charvel Model range, MIJ as they were, they would see the revenue from that side of the house that they wanted to see back when FMIC un-mothballed the brand.

I agree, I love my 1988 Model 2. It is a great freakin' guitar. I would love to see the old Charvel Model series re-introduced and made in Japan. The price would be a whole lot consumer friendly. I really wanted one of the new re-introduced Charvel single humber guitars, but I could not justify that high of a price. That's why I got my Model 2 from eBay for $290. I'd consider paying a bit more for a new " Japanese made Model 2" though. A lot of American companies are supplementing their American Made models with Japanese/Korean/Chinese imports a-la PRS with their $500 SE series.

[ABSOLUT CHARVEL]

with fender as the parent co. of J/C, i don't really see them killing the line. Remember when AMF bought Harley Davidson and basicly almost ruined HD? AMF was out of their element. Not the case with Fender. They know guitars and the know the market.

what would be interesting is if they went the route like Carvin with the Charvels. it would be nice to be able to get replacement necks, bodies, etc.
it would be like Charvel had gone full circle.

[skorb]

A lot of American companies are supplementing their American Made models with Japanese/Korean/Chinese imports a-la PRS with their $500 SE series.

exactly.
this is precisely where the geniuses at FMIC and JCMI are missing the boat.

have you ever picked up one of those PRS SE's? they are kickass guitars for the money, just like the Model series used to be. they could do US customs only and then the Models for the normal folks.

seems to work very well for PRS, the big money guys get their 10 tops and custom pieces and regular people can afford an SE which is a good guitar but not a US quality piece.

but leave it to JCMI/FMIC to fail to pursue such a successful strategy.

[iced_earth]

As far as I know, Fender bought Jackson to better compete in the Heavy Metal guitar market as the Fender name has never been popular for the Heavy Metal crowd. Fender selling the Jackson name or killing the line is tantamount to Fender giving up on the metal guitar market, something I highly doubt they would do at this point.