Jackson Prices vs. Peoples attitude

[eakinj]

I will be honest, I do not recall where I read the thread, if it was JCF or elsewhere. But I recall a couple years back people complaining about the status of Jackson Guitars. One of the things people went on about was how the prices of Jacksons needed to go up into the Gibson price range so that they were seen as higher end guitars.

Now for the last few weeks I have seen a lot of complained regarding an alleged 25% raise in the CS price. I say alleged because I haven't seen them and am not in any way "in the know" about it.

I for one don't think price has anything at all to do with quality as I have 250 dollar guitars that play better then some of my 1500-2500 dollar guitars.

So I would like to know, hypothetically if the prices on Jacksons went from (and I'm making up these prices) 1800 for a US made to 2500, and a CS went from 4k to 5k or 6k or whatever, do you think generally the perception of the company would change?

I'm not meaning us as in those who buy Jacksons like they might disappear if we don't, I mean those non-jackson people who only want to buy guitars that hold some sort of prestige (ie, morons who think paying a more expencive guitar some how raises their own stock) the PRS bandwagoners types (nothing against those guitars, Jackson has plenty of bandwagoners in the 80's and 90's)

[eakinj]

PS.

This IS NOT TO START A FLAME WAR. So please don't take this as me trying to start any sh*t. I am honestly curious if you think the price of these guitars will affect how they are perceived bythe main stream market.

[Inazone]

I am honestly curious if you think the price of these guitars will affect how they are perceived bythe main stream market.

The mainstream market being Fender and Gibson fans, or just guitarists in general? There are plenty of people out there who will look down on any guitar with a pointy headstock or "unusual" body shape, whether it be Jackson, ESP, BC Rich, Ibanez or countless others. But Jackson has gone down this path for a long time, while other brands like Hamer abandoned the super-Strat designs of the `80s and early `90s in favor of more traditional models. Deviating from the stereotypical Jackson styles has generally not worked out well, as was especially apparent with some of the mid-90s models that were in and out of production almost overnight.

The target audience for Jackson and its competitors are *usually* metal guitarists, often the stereotypical types with limited budgets. Most of them can't afford a brand new USA Jackson, and definitely not a custom guitar. To them, higher prices are just a nail in the coffin. At the same time, there seems to be a lot of guitar snobbery directed against Jackson imports by people who only seem to notice a brand's lowest- and highest-priced offerings, and nothing in the middle. How many Jackson critics whine that the JS cheapies are junk and the customs are too expensive, and totally overlook the mid-priced Japanese models?

In terms of price:

Indian Jackson = off-brand starter guitars
Japanese Jackson = Chinese, Indonesian or Korean LTD/Ibanez/Schecter/Epiphone
USA Jackson = Japanese ESP/Ibanez/Caparison

Jackson guitars are great values, even if you factor in the price of typical mods like OFRs. But at this point, I don't think there will be any winning over of other brands' loyal buyers because of price. Country of origin doesn't matter to most Guitar Center shoppers, so my above comparison of Jackson prices to other brands isn't going to mean much to most potential buyers. Sadly, they want the gear their favorite rock stars play. For most, that is NOT Jackson. And I sure am not seeing any Mark Morton, Kevin Bond or Christian Olde Wolbers signature models in stores around here...in a metro area with three GCs and many other Jackson dealers.

[ABSOLUT CHARVEL]

the perception of the company would change, but for the worst. at least in their current state. you would really need to attach a current guitar hero(s) to associate with a new super strat. this may increase the demand to justify the price.

you can't underestimate the value of the hands that are seen holding the guitar, just like anything else. even old crap stuff goes for crazy dollars if someone who is hot plays it. look what Jack White did with the Airline plastic guitar.

[AK47]

I will be honest, I do not recall where I read the thread, if it was JCF or elsewhere. But I recall a couple years back people complaining about the status of Jackson Guitars. One of the things people went on about was how the prices of Jacksons needed to go up into the Gibson price range so that they were seen as higher end guitars.

I have been a member for a very long time and have never heard people complaing about the low prices of Jacksons and they need to be increase to keep up with Gibson. You must have read this on HC because that is just crazy talk.

[Inazone]

I have been a member for a very long time and have never heard people complaing about the low prices of Jacksons and they need to be increase to keep up with Gibson. You must have read this on HC because that is just crazy talk.

Believe it or not, people have said that very thing. I'm not saying that makes it right, I'm just saying!

[VitaminG]

I have been a member for a very long time and have never heard people complaing about the low prices of Jacksons and they need to be increase to keep up with Gibson. You must have read this on HC because that is just crazy talk.

I do remember that very suggestion being made here.

A thread was started asking how Jackson could improve their profile or business model or something. There were all the usual suggestions that Jackson should sign up a young new guitar hero, someone the kids identified with, like Steve Vai, Jose Feliciano or Head from Kron (y'know, a fresh face) to be the company's saviour.

During the same discussion, it was proposed that if Jackson were to raise their prices, they might be treated more seriously. The general public couldn't respect Jackson as a top-notch instrument because it was just too good value when compared to guitars by makers like PRS & Gibson. Someone pointed out that either Fender or Gibson jacked their prices up years ago, and as soon as folks started dropping big money, the guitars' prestige went up.

[Guitardude86]

If you think the price makes a great guitar.. You don't know what a good guitar is..

[xenophobe]

I for one don't think price has anything at all to do with quality as I have 250 dollar guitars that play better then some of my 1500-2500 dollar guitars.

Obviously you don't understand the difference between quality and playability.

[Guitardude86]

Obviously you don't understand the difference between quality and playability.

Well.. Ok I don't want to start a quarrell here.. but.. EVH's original Frankenstrat cost him around $180 or something like that.. He recorded some of rocks all-time greatest albums with it..
Does that $20 k replica make him a better player? I always thought of Eddie as a DIY, screw the big brands kinda guy.. Not so much anymore..

[delt]

> Does that $20 k replica make him a better player? I always thought of Eddie
> as a DIY, screw the big brands kinda guy.. Not so much anymore..

+1

Jackson has always been reputed for good quality guitars to play HARD ROCK and METAL, ever since Randy's original design in the late 70's / early 80's. If there had to be only one "guitar hero" attached to the image of the company, it would certainly be Randy Rhoads - only that was 25 years ago.

A few years ago before FMIC bought the company, there was a whole bunch of very good (and some very well known) Jackson/Charvel endorsers... Dave Mustaine, Marty Friedman, Alexi Laiho, Roope Latvala, Rusty Cooley, ..... now the only "big guy" left is Phil Collen of def leppard. Dunno wtf happened to all the rest -(

[delt]

+ if you walk into a pawn shop and see a bunch of cheap guitars & one of them is a Jackson, it will probably be the best playing one in the whole bunch... even if it's a cheap performer or JX series.

My first Jackson was a PS-II i bought about 10 years ago used, in a small guitar shop, and even for a low-end guitar i was amazed at how much better it played & sounded than all the other ones (kramer, squier strats, etcetc) in the shop - although a few Ibanez's came pretty close. At that time, Jackson was just another company name for me. I was just getting back into electric guitar playing, and i didn't give a flying f¢k what it said on the headstock

[eakinj]

If you think the price makes a great guitar.. You don't know what a good guitar is..

I agree completely. but...

We live in a day and age where status seems to be more important then substance. It's not a matter of how much money to actually costs to make a great guitar, it's about how it's percieved. I think do to the Ed Romans, and Gibsons, have made people think that to get a quality instrument you have to pay 3k for it or else you're playing something that's below everything else. I by no means think it's right, like I said I don't think the price tag makes the guitar.

And again a disclaimer - I'm not saying Ed and Gibson are bad, they are a business and need to make money to stay in business.

[eakinj]

Obviously you don't understand the difference between quality and playability.

Obviously you are just looking to start an argument.

I have a cheap Kramer Standard that looks a lot better then the US made SG's I have seen at GC, and that standard plays better and sounds better then the SG's. Maybe I got lucky when i bought it (which was on a whim) And they are basically made by the same company in but in differnet countries. So assuming (which I'm not - but for discussion sake) that all the kramer standards played and sounded better then real Gibson SG's (which I am not convinced of) why would I want to spend 1400 dollars on a real gibson SG when the Kramer is less then 300?

The only reason I can see is to be buying the Gibson name. I'm not saying my cheap guitar is going to out perform every other high end guitar out there, but looks and plays better then a lot of the crap I see at GC on the high end wall.

And on the other hand the Jackson LTD I bought in 92 for 2200 has so many mistakes (the fret board as a flat grounded on to it, the upper horn is dented in and this came to me directly from the factory) so I'm not sure high price = any greater quality.

[Strat God]

I see alot of middle-aged guys like myself into higher-priced guitars.
As a rule there is more disposable imcome and at this age we really don't give a sh*t about what our wives think anymore.

I always wanted good guitars as a young'un but couldn't afford them- and now I'm lucky to be able to get (most) of those guitars.

It's a trend I think will continue as we turn into old farts too.