Yet another bitch about Jackson thread

[kelly user]

or tell pablo there that if hes a master builder what is he doing with a dead beat company. $3000, $4000, $1000, $500 price doesn't matter perfection is a must. i just bought a gibson explorer and there was fucking paint on the 18-22 frets and the clear was right over it. What the hell............... i remember when guitar making was an art, a highly respected art.................. now it's build it, paint it, let it sit for a couple months................ ship that bitch out, and wait a couple months to see it it comes back

[xenophobe]

JCF-02, under FMIC, had its share of problems too. Let's not forget that they were all painted with the wrong finish and had to be stripped and refinned. Wrong tuners too. Just sayin'.

And I'm not arguing that either. I'm just saying that Jackson's track record on limited series has been bad no matter who the owner was.

[Budman68]

[shreddermon]

OK, so getting back to the original topic, we can summarize the umpteenth discussion on this issue as follows:

- Most folks agree that J/C has a QC problem. The only debate is the severity of the problem. Some folks think it's at a crisis level. Others think that improvements are needed, but it's not a crisis.

- Most folks agree that the QC problem shows prominently on special runs. The only debate is that some think the severity of QC problems on special runs is indicative of the same level of problems on custom shop orders and/or USA Selects. Others think it has been worse on special runs.

- Some folks think that the QC problem is long-standing, with roots back to AMIC's ownership. Others think that it has gotten worse under FMIC's ownership.

- Most folks also agree that there’s a significant customer service problem, as well. This includes getting quotes/work orders done timely, resolving repairs/rebuilds adequately and timely, building guitars to spec, shipping damages, hefty price increases when QC needs to get better, etc.

All of the above-mentioned are based on individual opinions.

When you sum things up like that, does it really seem like this stuff is worth all of the negativity, accusations, name-calling, and bashing that goes on associated with it? Can’t we all – whatever our opinions - throttle our attitudes back enough that we can treat each other respectfully? And just agree to disagree? I mean, it seems some of this has even gone so far as to strain some long-time friendships. Is it really worth that much? And, in doing so, can we also try to engage in these discussions in a way that’s constructive to J/C fixing the problems, and not bomb-throwing?

[kelly user]

i can see the faint like where the neck slopes in to the body and it looks rather straight, i don't think it was cut wrong, i think it was painted wrong

[mattsmusiccenter]

In regard to the discussion about small batch QC problems, I think the owners of the new Copperhead run are going to be VERY happy.

[kelly user]

shreddermon

things suck, but some of the hardcore J/C fan are reluctant to say their pride and joy of a company have gone down hill.

[Budman68]

When you sum things up like that, does it really seem like this stuff is worth all of the negativity, accusations, name-calling, and bashing that goes on associated with it? Can’t we all – whatever our opinions - throttle our attitudes back enough that we can treat each other respectfully? And just agree to disagree? I mean, it seems some of this has even gone so far as to strain some long-time friendships. Is it really worth that much? And, in doing so, can we also try to engage in these discussions in a way that’s constructive to J/C fixing the problems, and not just bomb-throwing?

Excuse me, Pat but that's why I asked that simple question yesterday to try and be more productive and YOU just laughed it off

Originally Posted by shreddermon
Good question, Dave. Maybe there is and, so far, it ain't working.

.....I'm all for trying to figure how to get them to listen but when nobody has any ideas, this is what happens..

[Budman68]

i can see the faint like where the neck slopes in to the body and it looks rather straight, i don't think it was cut wrong, i think it was painted wrong

ding ding ding! we have a weener -

[kinde69]

THANKS Dave!!! That I saw too! This just shows that there are some quality problems with the painting in the guitar which was in NAMM...Hopefully the rest of those 24RR´s doesn´t have that kind of mistakes...

[shreddermon]

Excuse me, Pat but that's why I asked that simple question yesterday to try and be more productive and YOU just laughed it off.

Sorry, Dave, but you misunderstood my post. I thought your question was an excellent one. I wasn't "just laughing it off". That was intended to be tounge-in-cheek sarcastic humor. But it does reflect my actual opinion. i.e., I expect they probably have been trying to improve QC - and, if so, it hasn't been working so far.

[Budman68]

Sorry, Dave, but you misunderstood my post. I thought your question was an excellent one. I wasn't "just laughing it off". That was intended to be tounge-in-cheek sarcastic humor. But it does reflect my actual opinion. i.e., I expect they probably have been trying to improve QC - and, if so, it hasn't been working so far.

Ok, understood, thanks for that.

Anyone have any ideas?

[mudkicker]

When you sum things up like that, does it really seem like this stuff is worth all of the negativity, accusations, name-calling, and bashing that goes on associated with it? Can’t we all – whatever our opinions - throttle our attitudes back enough that we can treat each other respectfully? And just agree to disagree? I mean, it seems some of this has even gone so far as to strain some long-time friendships. Is it really worth that much? And, in doing so, can we also try to engage in these discussions in a way that’s constructive to J/C fixing the problems, and not bomb-throwing?

Great point, now I nominate bloodsplatter, les paul custom, and any other long standing members who were apart of the FMIC bannings to have their memberships reopened. They were unceremoniously banned for making the exact same arguements made in this thread about QC problems. Obviously it wasn't a witchhunt on their part as they were accused of, they recognized the QC problems sooner than the rest of the board.

[hippietim]

- Most folks agree that J/C has a QC problem. The only debate is the severity of the problem. Some folks think it's at a crisis level. Others think that improvements are needed, but it's not a crisis.

I asked you this question earlier but you didn't answer. How much worse does it have to get to be a crisis?

- Most folks agree that the QC problem shows prominently on special runs. The only debate is that some think the severity of QC problems on special runs is indicative of the same level of problems on custom shop orders and/or USA Selects. Others think it has been worse on special runs.

It's hard to say one way or another. But even if it's just the limited runs, it is still a pitiful track record.

- Some folks think that the QC problem is long-standing, with roots back to AMIC's ownership. Others think that it has gotten worse under FMIC's ownership.

That's a purely academic debate. And while it is perhaps interesting, it has no relevance to the guitars they are producing today.

- Most folks also agree that there’s a significant customer service problem, as well. This includes getting quotes/work orders done timely, resolving repairs/rebuilds adequately and timely, building guitars to spec, shipping damages, hefty price increases when QC needs to get better, etc.

All of the above-mentioned are based on individual opinions.

I disagree. There are plenty of facts here. It is a fact that almost every run that folks around here have witnessed has had fuckups. It is a fact that there are plenty of fucked up individual Custom Shop guitars. It is a fact that they do a shitty job packing and shipping. It is a fact that they have bad turn around times on quotes, work orders, and problem resolution. It is a fact that they raised prices when their QC is not acceptable.

When you sum things up like that, does it really seem like this stuff is worth all of the negativity, accusations, name-calling, and bashing that goes on associated with it? Can’t we all – whatever our opinions - throttle our attitudes back enough that we can treat each other respectfully? And just agree to disagree? I mean, it seems some of this has even gone so far as to strain some long-time friendships. Is it really worth that much?

Oh please. You've thrown your share of negativity into these discussions more often than not. I think a lot of us that are getting the fucked up guitars and shitty service find it a bitter pill to swallow when you post on these discussions about how folks are nitpicking, things aren't really that bad, etc. What long-time friendships were strained in any of this? I'm not aware of any.

And, in doing so, can we also try to engage in these discussions in a way that’s constructive to J/C fixing the problems, and not bomb-throwing?

A lot of us have had discussions on and off the board about how to improve things with folks from Jackson, dealers, fellow customers, etc. It is clear that things are not on path to improve so I say fuck it and fuck buying any more of their new guitars.

[neilli]

I think that's the paint - if you look you can see a horizontal ridge coming from the 'point' on the black paint at the left. The black on the right doesn't extend far enough. Still crap though....

Go me!