Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

[Chuckracer]

Fender has dropped the bomb on Lenz Guitars. Who's next? Suhr? Anderson? Tyler? GMW? We're not just talking headstocks here, either.

From the Lentz Site yesterday...

"I have been contacted, as to the making of the 2 pup and 3 pup model of my guitars. I will no longer advertise,take orders, or make these guitars immediately!It is not my intent to blame or talk poorly of this action, It is my wish that my friends not go on forums and speak ill of this action! I will not address this matter on my forum or discuss this matter further on the phone. Any dialog with me will only be addressed by phone, as I will not reply to emails.( 760 743 1598)
I will as always accept refinishing and some repair, until the new designs have been checked out by an Attorney!
I ask for your patience and understanding through this difficult time,
Scott Lentz
Lentz Electric Guitar"

[dinkyjacksonman]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

Wat kind of guitars do they make?

[Mr Graphic]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

All the recent legal actions regarding guitar design ownership is probably the best thing to happen to the guitar market since Stratmania in the 80's. The values on most "pre-lawsuit" guitars will increase, strengthening the used market, and the guitar buying public will see many more original designs. This is a good thing...

[Firebird V]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

I was thinking about the Lentz line the other day (keep asking Scott to build one more Firebird for me but he won't do it right now... )and was wondering when this was going to happen. There are alot of Fender players over on the Lentz board and it was only a matter of time until he was nicked. That sucks.

[j2379]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

so with 1pup its OK?

[Chuckracer]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

No, he's talking strat-style and tele-style guitars. Body shapes is what Fender is now going after.

[dinkyjacksonman]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

This thing has been happening to many companies.
GMW has been trying to come up wth new headstocks.
I can imagine Suhr(Classic Strat), Anderson(Tele body),Tyler(Classic) will be targeted anytime soon and it has been discussed on Suhr Board for months.
I personally think Fender(Jackson) and Gibson should sue ESP for selling rip off of Fender,Jackson and Gibson but why these smaller companies(builders)?
I am sure because Fender is concerned of these smaller companies(builders) building better(quality) Fender style guitars.

[fuel0707]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

Anybody have actual knowledge of how long Fender will retain the rights to the body shapes? Will the shapes ever become public domain?

[jackson1]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

[ QUOTE ]
but why these smaller companies(builders)?

[/ QUOTE ]

Fender could be targeting the easy (small) ones first to gain experience and to build a list of successfully completed cases. Showing that list in court might help create a precedent, helping Fender in future cases against bigger companies with better lawyers.

[Chuckracer]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

Here's the most info I've found in one place:

http://p070.ezboard.com/fjohnsuhrgui...icID=267.topic

Yes, they've been talking about this for months, and the headstock thing has been on-going but we're talking entire body shapes now, and Lenz is the first victim of an outright Cease and Desist concerning body shapes. I think ya'll are missing the point here. This is huge.

How many companies make variations of the offset double cutaway we call the strat-style? In theory you can kiss them all goodbye.

Can we include Jackson and Charvel in this? They also make offset double cutaway body shapes. Will they have to be "licensed" now? Lots of questions...not many answers yet.

[Venomboy]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

I've spoken to Neal Moser a lot about this issue.

The law says if you change 10% or more of the design, then you're okay. Problem is that nobody really agrees what 10% or more means.

[sully]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

law says that it also has to be a discernable difference from fifty feet away.

they're probably also going after the smaller guys because it's easier to put suhr, lentz, etc, out of business than ESP.

jackson shouldn't have a problem with the dinky, as it's their design variation and certainly discernable from fifty feet away.

i'm just surprised that they're doing this; the legend has been that past practices can impact how successful you are in trademark enforcement. if they haven't gone after these folks for so long, how much of a case could they have now?

also, with the internet, and forums like these, more of the little guys are going to get shots fired at them. i'm told that part of the reason lee lost his dealer status (which he was planning on not renewing) and got into strathead heat was over pictures posted here. we weren't the main reason, but icing on the cake.

so... when you get guitars from the little guys and want to post pictures, you may want to do some cropping first.

sully

[slayer]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

Allo f these companies sueing each other over design is just sickening, stop it already, I like copies of popular guitars by many companies. Jack.

[markb]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

[ QUOTE ]
Can we include Jackson and Charvel in this? They also make offset double cutaway body shapes. Will they have to be "licensed" now?

[/ QUOTE ]

I wouldn't worry too much about Jackson/Charvel, since they are Fenders, and part of the same bottom line.

Anderson and Suhr I hope they work around it. If Gibson can beat PRS in court over the singlecut, which really doen't look much like a Les Paul, then any vague offset doublecut could be in trouble.

It's funny, The PRS singlecut probably resembles a Les Paul more these days, since Gibson has stopped putting pickguards on their Pauls. Which was complete deference on their part to the standard for looks PRS has set.

To patent a shape 50 years past market introduction I think should not be legally allowed. It defeats the purpose of allowing copyrighting in the first place.

[Grandturk]

Re: Fender tells Lentz to Cease and Desist...

This really isn't that surprizing - its happened in the past after all. Ibanez and Tokai were sued back in the 70's - the result was they both stopped using the fender headstock, and Ibanez went on to make some pretty kick ass guitars of their own. I don't think that Charvel stopped using the strat headstock on their own as well.

So its really no surprise that Lentz and GMW were served with a cease and desist order - they played it cute, not showing the headstocks in their advertizements, but that only bought them a few years in the market.

I agree with Fender's right to preserve their trademarks, but I also think GMW's were pretty cool as well.