Robbin Crosby's Double Rhoads/King V question

[veemagic]

IMO, I think it would have been a hot mess. I'm not thrilled with what's been happening lately (especially with the abortion that Charvel has become), but I don't think that Dave (and iirc, Lloyd and some others) would have been good. Even scarier, Dean was in the running. Can you imagine? Ugh.

Sully

Sully,

See, I think the opposite. I think that Jackson needs to be handled by a smaller group of owners rather than by a large corporation. If Dave would have been successful, he would only have been heading a larger group of investors, and he wouldn't have had much to do with the day to day operations. I would have expected that he would have at least given us more of the same Jackson of the early to mid nineties. He would have stayed put with Jackson, perhaps the custom shop would actually build some of the things that they used to build. Who knows, the best thing we can hope for is that Fender sells them to someone that really cares about them like Dave. JMHO
Kevin

[AIC70]

I meant the black bass in the Looks that Kill video. Hamers - I need to look those up!

[Hellbat]

Wouldn't MegaDave have been in the running at the peak of his substance abuse days? Not exactly the kind of situation you want to have in an owner of a company.

Think of it... "Yeah I shouldn't have sold the design and rights to the Soloist name to Gibson, but I had an itch and needed to score..."

As enthusiasts of the brand(s) it easy to say Fender isn't giving it enough focus or resources, but the Charvel name was utterly dead outside of enthusiast circles, building only imports and Jackson was only building guitars used in extreme metal and in the Slash era resorted to building LP clones. (JJ series, the JoeyZ guitars)

Fender did a decent job of turning that around, the only thing I disagree with is dropping Charvel to Desolation only and having no USA production models. But you can see with the introduction of the USA Select (hmmm, that name seems familiar somehow...) Strats, having a USA Pro-mod at half the price would really cannibalize those sales/profit margins.

[veemagic]

2002 wasn't really the peak of his abuse days, and again it's not like he would have been really running anything. He did have a job after all.

[xenophobe]

Sully,

See, I think the opposite. I think that Jackson needs to be handled by a smaller group of owners rather than by a large corporation. If Dave would have been successful, he would only have been heading a larger group of investors, and he wouldn't have had much to do with the day to day operations. I would have expected that he would have at least given us more of the same Jackson of the early to mid nineties. He would have stayed put with Jackson, perhaps the custom shop would actually build some of the things that they used to build. Who knows, the best thing we can hope for is that Fender sells them to someone that really cares about them like Dave. JMHO
Kevin

Agreed.

Fender did a decent job of turning that around, the only thing I disagree with is dropping Charvel to Desolation only and having no USA production models. But you can see with the introduction of the USA Select (hmmm, that name seems familiar somehow...) Strats, having a USA Pro-mod at half the price would really cannibalize those sales/profit margins.

Fender closing the Japan shop to make cheaper guitars with a higher profit margin? That's a big loss, no matter how good the guitars coming from elsewhere are.

QC has been consistent since the buyout. Custom orders have become stupid. Wait time and prices are stupid. Jackson as a brand name is further diluted... all you usually see anywhere are crap models, half the time they're used and beat up. The prestige of both the Charvel and Jackson brands is far worse off. No new innovation... a few different body shapes and models, but no real technological improvements. They're in the god damned Fender building for christ's sake. They're like the bastard stepchild of a multinational corporation now.

With Fender as owner now, they should basically force Guitar Center to stock USAs and at least a few Customs at each store... they don't.

I half-expect to see Jackson Starter Packages with a cheap guitar, picks and an amp in a box at Costco for $179 or something...

[Devotee]

xeno, living up to your monicker? Fender didn't close the Japanese factory, it closed by itself because of the shitty economy.

[xenophobe]

xeno, living up to your monicker? Fender didn't close the Japanese factory, it closed by itself because of the shitty economy.

And Fender shipping off work to India and China didn't have anything to do with it? If anything they should have opened it up to custom orders...

[Devotee]

Jacksons have been manufactured in India for more than a decade now so i don't really see the connection.

[j2379]

I half-expect to see Jackson Starter Packages with a cheap guitar, picks and an amp in a box at Costco for $179 or something...

GOD NO! Squire by jackson....

[toejam]

I half-expect to see Jackson Starter Packages with a cheap guitar, picks and an amp in a box at Costco for $179 or something...

Didn't they already do that a few years back?

[sully]

Sully,

See, I think the opposite. I think that Jackson needs to be handled by a smaller group of owners rather than by a large corporation. If Dave would have been successful, he would only have been heading a larger group of investors, and he wouldn't have had much to do with the day to day operations. I would have expected that he would have at least given us more of the same Jackson of the early to mid nineties. He would have stayed put with Jackson, perhaps the custom shop would actually build some of the things that they used to build. Who knows, the best thing we can hope for is that Fender sells them to someone that really cares about them like Dave. JMHO
Kevin

I hear ya on the “building some of the things that they used to build” aspect, but then again, that helps me out a little. What would have happened is anyone’s guess, but I do believe that it’s been better for Jackson on the whole. I don’t know that Dave et al would have upgraded the machinery like FMIC did or be able to bring some of the original guys back (Mike was working for Fender at the time). There’s obviously a ton of stuff that we don’t know about as well, but if Dave was the one making the decisions (and that may have been unlikely), I just don’t see that being a good thing. Doesn't matter to me if it's a large company or a small one that owns them, as long as it's run well.

I’d say that QC has probably been a bit better, but I don’t look at every guitar that gets shipped. Custom order wait times were also insane before the buyout, don’t forget.

The starter packs kinda happened with the JS series, I seem to recall…. Either that or Matt was maybe putting together some kind of starter pack around the holidays. My nephew got one for xmas.

Sully

[Hellraiser6502]

Personally my take on it is this....Mustaine is mental patient.....I don't think you guys would want to see that brand run by a psycho like Mustaine. I believe it would be a trainwreck.

Just my opinion.

[shreddermon]

+1 on the trainwreck aspect. IMHO, chances are there would no longer be a J/C, if Mustybones had become its owner.

In any event, I have heard stories -albiet unconfirmed - that the whole rumor about DM trying to buy Jackson was total BS to begin with. You have to remember that rumor coincided with him leaving his former J/C endorsemen. deal in an angry huff. He was PO'd with the reduced deal offered to him by the now FMIC-owned outfit. So one version of events says that, in a crazy "how dare they" offended state of mind, DM made up BS about trying to buy J/C himself, to "get back" at FMIC, possibly a lame attempt to increase what they had to pay to aquire it.

[sully]

From what I recall, based on what I was told by some folks that worked for Jackson at the time) there was a small group of people (including Lloyd from Guitar XPress) that were trying to make it happen. I think it would have been just as much of a trainwreck if Dean actually bought the company (they were in the running). God, what a mess that'd be.

Sully

[xenophobe]

Jacksons have been manufactured in India for more than a decade now so i don't really see the connection.

I meant Indonesia, I believe. So Jackson is manufactured in India, China and Indonesia, currently... is that correct?