So if ALL I want different is a reverse head...

[Newc]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head...

Then I guess the insult is further compounded by NO ONE updating the OFFICIAL website [img]graemlins/brow.gif[/img]

I thought I saw a JS30KV, but had to double-check the site, then didn't see it listed.

Newc

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Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head...

Forgot this awesome thread? [img]graemlins/brow.gif[/img]

http://www.jcfonline.com/cgi-bin/ult...c;f=3;t=000568

[Newc]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head...

Yup. It's such an awesomely forgettable thread [img]graemlins/poke.gif[/img]

Newc

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Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head...

Jealous. [img]graemlins/poke.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/fart.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]

[TheSteveMan]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head...

Jackson Stars in Japan does simple changes for not a whole lot more [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] If all you want is a reverse head on one of their models, they'll do it! It takes extra time to get it, and it costs more, yes, but you don't have to pay like a custom shop price for it at all! (Sorry to bring up an old topic)

[xenophobe]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

First off, Jackson USA Select, may or may not have any presold status, only that they make certain batches at certain intervals. They'll make 15 or 25 or possibly more of a certain configuration and color, and then move to the next batch... when these guitars are finished THEN they figure out where they are going.

With a custom guitar like you're talking about, FIRST the initial guitar must be fully spec'd, someone AT Jackson must look through it, write it back down on a production sheet, fax the order back for confirmation, upon recieving the confirmation, it's put in the queue, as they're going along, they pull the work order and start building the individual guitar.

If you want your "slightly altered individual USA Select", they'll have to start producing it when the work order is pulled regardless of what might actually be in production, so it is NOT just a "slightly-altered" USA Select, it is a custom shop guitar.

Perhaps they could wait up to three or four months for another production run of that USA Select that they alter, then they would have to keep a seperate record of what guitar needs to be built, along with what "batch" of guitars that'll be done...

And while EVERYONE is requesting all this, the paperwork SKYROCKETS, and they would probably need extra personel just to keep track of this extra work, and to make sure that work orders ARE applied to USA Select guitars when they make the batch run.

In relatively high volume manufacturing environment, deviating from what is being produced to make one one-off, isn't as simple as just saying "make it so".

Logistically, there are MANY factors that you people aren't even considering.

[sambencuda]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

Aside from Carvin and a few others no other major manufacturers make "slight" alterations either. Can you order a reverse headstock Gibson Explorer or a Fender USA strat with one hum and one single coil? How about a PRS Custom 24 with one hum? If you did, it would be a custom order. Plain and simple. I think most of us are used to the way Jackson was in the 80's. You got whatever you wanted. I miss those days too, but Jackson is grown up now and operates just like the big boys. Thats why Carvin has that cool little niche that Jackson used to have.

[RP]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

Personally, I just wish Jackson offered a few more options. I can understand how standardization saves money, but I just think there's more demand out there than what they offer products to satisfy.

Going back to the 1980s Japanese Charvel line, I liked that there were variations. If I wanted a two-hum model, they had one. If I wanted a single-hum model, they offered one. I understand that running the Japanese line was different than running the USA line is, but it just seems like some variations should be offered. As it is, if I want a bolt-on Jackson, the two-hum model is really all there is.

I don't expect a "everything I want" or endless variations or even one-offs. I just would like more variation offered through the product line. Just offering more models (really variations on the current models). I'm not talking about one-offs. I'm talking adding some other batches because the Jackson line really is significantly limited in breadth.

But I guess they don't offer them because they think they can't sell them.... except for that the fact that some of the varations are apparently being offered on the Charvel line. Maybe that will be a test bed for a limited set of options on the Jackson line.

[Newc]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

But then the New Charvel line will be the Old Charvel line - almost all the Model models from the 80s became Jackson models in the 90s, and then some.
Charvel had the Fusions, Telecaster, Strat, Flametop Dinky, AND the one-hum wonders until Jackson killed the Charvel line off and basically just re-logoed them as Jacksons. Unfortunately, if they're going to try to resurrect the Charvel line as a test bed to see if a reverse headed Dinky sells more than or equal to a DK-2 or DK-1, they'll have to drop the "swollen penis" PC-1 headstock unless they wanna sell them to Country pickers and that one guy from that TV Variety show that has a Collen.

There's definitely room to add more models to the USA Jackson line without using the Charvels as another Guinea Pig. They've killed the SL4 right? What about the SL3? Reintroduce the SL4 as 24 frets, binding all over, ebony boards, MOP fins, and reverse headstocks with BOTH H-S-S AND H-H configs.

And yes, my theory WAS that they would make those MINOR (as in "limited number of options per piece") changes to the hypothetical Soloist during a scheduled batch of that base model. Set it up so that you can have one or two options ONLY (depending on what they are and how much managerial time/effort it takes to get it from parts to paint).
I still say most of it is as simple as grabbing from a different bin (hardware color, pickup model options) that takes less thought than you would imagine.

Ok, how about this? In order to maintain a daily production schedule, the work is divvied up to fill those 8 hours, but still ship finished product out the door ever day, correct? So you've got someone cutting headstocks all day. You've got someone cutting body wings for neckthroughs all day. You've got someone making fretboards all day (maybe one for ebony, one for maple, and one for rosewood?). You've got another one putting fretboards on necks and neck tenons (bolt on and neckthrough) all day. You've got the guy putting frets in fretboards, and the guy cutting the fretboards and putting the inlays in. Then you've got neck/headstock binding, not to mention assembly including truss rod insertion, joining heads to necks, body wings to neck tenons, and then there's cutting the pickup, control, and bridge holes.

Now, suppose the hypothetical batch of SL2Hs are being made today (or this entire week that is almost ended), and you've got an order that has 2 (maybe 3) options: reverse headstock and maple board with ebony fins.
Now, since those are the only differences in the order from a standard USA Select SL2H, what's the problem in having ONE extra person with little to nothing important to do go to each station and grab the reverse headstock (which would be a lefty head from a pile of lefty heads that have already been made), then grab a neck tenon without a fretboard on it, then grab a maple board. He/She takes those parts to an assembly station where the head is joined to the neck, and the board and trussrod are put on. Then that person takes it to the inlay station where it's tagged "std ebn fins" for Standard Ebony Sharkfin Inlays.

Furthermore, what about an inlay stamping device that fits on the fretboard and contains rubber ink stamps of whatever pattern (fins, reverse fins, zigzags, crop circles, etc etc), and the "setup man" stamps those on for the inlay man so all he has to do is LOOK at the board to know what it takes, how they're oriented, and what color/material they are, and how many (one Iommi Cross in ebony at the 12th of a maple board? Stamped in ink! Reverse Abalone Crop Circles? Stamped in ink!). All the inlay guy has to do is follow the dotted line and pass a color-blindness test. It's a one-time creation of a tool that you can use multiple times, and it doesn't cost a Billion dollars and/or an Act Of Congress to make it.

Everything under the Sun can be streamlined and made more efficient, all it takes is accepting the possibilities. No one has all the answers to everything, so who has the authority to say "It can't be done"? No one. It CAN be done with NO extra cost if it's executed properly. I don't believe in "paper plans". Everything looks simple on paper - it's the Human Factor that screws it up. You can read a book on repairing the Boeing 747 all you want, but you won't know how to fix it until you HAVE fixed it.

It's the same here: you cannot say these changes CANNOT be implemented without exhorbitant cost until you TRY to do it without exhorbitant cost. Even if the extra work involved in getting just a reverse headstock on a USA Select SL2H takes 2 full batches of USA Select SL2Hs to complete, it's a start.
By the same reasoning, no one can accurately say that these changes CAN be implemented without exhorbitant cost until they are DONE without exhorbitant cost.

The deciding factor is the Will To Do.

Newc

[xenophobe]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

[ QUOTE ]
I still say most of it is as simple as grabbing from a different bin (hardware color, pickup model options) that takes less thought than you would imagine.

[/ QUOTE ]

I AGREE with the fact that the actual physical change isn't difficult at all. There are so many other factors involved with having just a single change off production spec, and that is why they WILL do a limited batch run of non-standard guitars, but will NOT just do 1 minor change to 1 guitar.

Come on Newc, it isn't rocket science, but there are many more factors on why it's just not as easy as not routing one pickup route or putting the string-thru template on a body as opposed to a floyd template.

[rhoads56]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

As a luthier who does primarily custom made guitars, but also on a "production line" of sorts, i can tell you it is an absolute PITA to implement small changes to a batch of guitars.

You got a run of 25 guitars and one or two of those need one or two small changes?? If its 25 standard guitars, you just build them. All the workers know exactly what they are doing, and get the job done without even thinking.
Add a single hum option to one guitar, and then each person that touches that batch of 25, HAS to know which guitar is unique, and treat it so. It might add 20 seconds per guitar, per station... 25 guitars, by 15 workstations, is 123 minutes of extra paperwork just to see if the guitars are standard or not, let alone changing factory setups mid run to accomodate small changes.

Add a reverse headstock, and a single hum... What happens when the headstock guy does his job properly, but the humbucker routing guy doesnt read through the ENTIRE custom order sheet? You get a reverse headstock with two hums. Hmmm, throw it away, or keep building it?? Keep building it, sell it to a store that doesnt want it, and your down one guitar on the batch of standards.

By allowing small modifications or options into large production line batches, you are forcing EVERY employee to treat EVERY guitar like a custom shop item.

It really is a huge difference to the production line. I do it every day in my current business, and have also been in charge of a "custom shop" in a production line facility. I know from experience that small changes can create huge headaches, both in paperwork, invoicing, verifying client wants and needs, production line mistakes, stock control, quality control (checking it has been done), and even employee morale, etc etc etc etc.

[Newc]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

So what would make it easier to implement and integrate such changes smoothly into a production line? A tagging system that makes it easier for each station to know what's what? In the case of different pickup routing, could there not be at least one person available to mark a body blank or neck tenon's single-pickup route with "1HUM"?
Masking tape? Put a piece of tape on each piece of the guitar (head, neck, fretboard, body or body wings, etc?).

While it may still be inconvenient, if it can be integrated seamlessly into a production line even though paperwork and/or build time increases slightly, it should at least be given a shot.

I do understand that in any manufacturing facility, profit/loss is based on parts-per-man-hour that actually got out the door (you can make 3000 headstocks a day, but if they're not going on completed guitars, you aren't making money), however, with production streamlining your PPMH does have room for flexibility. There's a difference between losing money and not making as much money as you hoped to, or did yesterday.
If a company makes 10 items per man hour at a cost of $1 per item, and sells those 10 items for $10 each, that's $9 profit per man hour per item - $720 per day (8 hrs). If PPMH drops to 8, but cost remains at $1 per item and selling price per item remains at $10, that's $7 profit per item - $630 per day. You have not lost money, you just did not make as much as you thought/hoped/planned to make.
Once this rule is accepted, so will the changes.

Newc

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Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

Dang, Newc, this seems like a huge obsession for you....why don't you start your own guitar company? [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

You got some good ideas; go try 'em out! [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img]

[Newc]

Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

Yeah that's a great idea! It'd only take me 10 or 20 years to match Jackson's current quality [img]/images/graemlins/brow.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/poke.gif[/img]

Newc

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Re: So if ALL I want different is a reverse head..

I'll wait. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]