Titanium block on PC1 Floyds?

[vklobucar]

Just caught an interview with Phil Collen and he mentions that a titanium sustain block was added to his Floyd on his PC1. States that there is a massive difference.

Anyone heard of this and when can they be had?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwnACUt7q1s

[Bengal65]

Interesting! The only folks that I can think of that could make one would be these guy's. http://www.k-t-s.com/contents/bridge/indexE.html They might have something if you give them a shout.

I have their Floyd saddle clamps on one Floyd that I bought basically for the strength.

[Jack Napalm]

This if for a strat block. They are not cheap.

http://www.detempleguitars.com/pages/product/titanium/prod_titan-trem.htm

[Learn Guitars]

ouch.....

[Bengal65]

Yep, Ti is not cheap. It's one of the most expensive metals and is very difficult to manufacture. It's also extremely corrosion resistant. If you play your guitar in the rain like SRV's "Couldn't Stand the Weather" video, your in. No rust, ever!

This could be a project fo Budman, Mayday or the other machinists on the forum.

Edit: I did some checking on Ti Grade 2 plate since I'm in the materials business. Prices range from $800-$1000 per square foot for the thickness needed to match a Floyd block. I measure 8.1-9mm depending on the thickness of the chrome plating. I measured several of my blocks.

Still quite expensive.

[jimbilly]

Isn't titanium usually spec'd because: it's really tough (fatique resistant) heat resistant (melts somewhere above 1000deg f?), lightweight, and corrosion resistant? I've got a couple of titanium bicycles, It's pretty well suited to bikes, and perfect for handlebars, but I'm not sure how it's properties would be necessary for Floyd parts, but why-not I guess... I suppose it would have a unique resonance.

[Bengal65]

Yes, it's main advantages over steel is it's light weight and corrosion resistant. It's yield strength is very similar to medium carbon steel. I don't know about Ti's resonance properties, but that would throw out the old brass block sustain theory. I can't imagine that much tone difference over steel and with the outragous cost offsets the whole idea.

[~K~]

lighter than steel twice as tough. I used to machine it for helicopter turbines for the backhawk. Yes it is more expensive than standard metals. I'm surprised to hear phillikes it. If I were to guess I would have assumed Titanium would have a brittle tone property

[dg]

+1

I'd really like to A/B a guitar with a standard block and one with a $300 Ti block. My suspicion is that it's just another one of those "emperor's clothes" things designed to separate cork sniffers from their money. There are ideal materials for any given application, and I laugh at all the different gimmicky things they're using titanium for in consumer products, like razor blades or those cheap ass drill bits where the plating comes off the first time you use them. It can't be the best metal for everything, but "titanium!" sounds cooler than "steel!" or "aluminum!", so there you go.

[madryan]

Titanium as it pertains to bicycle frames seems to suck up high frequency vibration, which in a guitar bridge would tend to make the guitar sound fatter and warmer. At least that's what sounds right to me. I machine the stuff occasionally and it's about like machining Stainless. I could easily use some bar stock to make something like a Floyd block. Maybe I should....

[TommyD]

Titanium block on PC1 Floyds?

> Everyone is right,Ti is phenomenally expensive compared to other materials. At Onlinemetals.com,a .375 rod of 6061 aluminum a foot long is .78 cents right now,the same size and length rod of 6AL4V Ti is 37.58. I can't see a piece big enough to make a Floyd bock being 300 bucks though.

Back when Jeremy McGrath was the dominant Supercross rider,I saw an article where a motocross magazine was test-riding his bike,and noted that literally every fastener on it was Ti. The bike costs less at full retail than his Ti bolt kit. Tommy D.

[Bengal65]

Funny you should mention Jeremy and Motocross. When I started racing MX years ago, like the 60's, I followed the factories through the 70's. Back before the AMA and the FIM stopped the "no rules" R & D, some British (as in BSA's Jeff Smith) and JAP (Suzuki's Joel Robert and Roger DeCoster, as examples) bikes were made out of just about all Ti with engines that had cast magnesuim alloy engine cases. Well, that's not allowed anymore and is confined to fasteners.

Anyway, I just did a little exercise with a local supplier. I can get a 12" X 12" piece of Ti Grade 2 plate in 3/8" thickness (close to the 8mm thick Floyd part) for $1.050.00US. That equates allowing for saw or water jet cutting and milling to size, approximately 35 QTY, 37mm Floyd blocks (37mm X 50mm). This comes out to $30 per piece. Add machining costs (machinist's chime in here) for drilling the 5 spring anchor holes and Drilling and Tapping the 3 plate attachment holes, you could make these (37mm size) at about $130 a piece, considering $50 per hour machining costs. I may not be accurate here not including tooling costs, but this is just a guesstimate. I haven't checked but drilling might need to be done with cobalt drill bits.
If it's done in quantity, obviously there are some cost savings, but not real bad cost wise. Food for thought.

[vklobucar]

I for one would spring for that block if it were in the $150 range. It would indeed be an interesting experiment in tone.

[psychodave]

I know Adam Reiver (lives near by me) and we talked about this about 2 weeks ago. He said both Phil and Warren DiMartini loved the Ti blocks. They will cost around $400 a pop for Floyds... He also said Floyd is making Ti saddles, which will cost around the same. He said the tone is a lot "different" from Brass Alum and Steel. Maybe I will see if I can get a freebie...

BTW, here is a cool link to how to set up Floyds, complements of Adam...

http://www.musicgearsource.com/colar1.html

[åron]

Perhaps Ti would dampen the vibrations carried to the springs and create a trem with better tone and sustain. I know the sympathetic vibration of a trem's springs are a component of the sound of such guitars. Sometimes I like the tone of said vibration, but I don't ausually like the hit to sustain that happens on some notes.