NAMM Show J/C Guitar specs/prices

[Newc]

Ok, so someone go into explicit detail about what makes the NAMM models so much better than a Custom Shop order that someone like me would place (i.e. not the starry-eyed drooler with more money than brains).

Are we being told that the money we spend on a Custom Shop order is not enough to get the same materials and quality as what goes into a NAMM model?

And yes, if anyone buys these overpriced models, they're effectively telling JCMI that it's a reasonable price, just like when people started shelling out $1500 for the Charvels they were buying a year earlier on Ebay for half that.

Is Jackson going back to being a boutique "rich and famous or just rich and stupid only" builder?

[hippietim]

You got that right Shawn, we are not the customers. The dealers are.

Oh no they aren't. Not in the long run anyhow. If dealers can't sell them, at some point they won't buy more.

[surfreak]

I think those prices break one of the few axioms in the guitar-making world, i.e. that a new guitar which is supposed to be the replica or reissue of a vintage one, cannot cost more than the vintage guitar itself!

Gibson introduced the historic R9 Les Paul because very few people can afford a real '59 Les Paul, just like Fender has the time machine series because real pre-CBS strats are too expensive for the average musician.

These J/C prices are instead on the same level, if not above, as a real San Dimas strathead with the same features.
This is what makes me think that they won't sell.

[Shawn]

I think those prices break one of the few axioms in the guitar-making world, i.e. that a new guitar which is supposed to be the replica or reissue of a vintage one, cannot cost more than the vintage guitar itself!

Gibson introduced the historic R9 Les Paul because very few people can afford a real '59 Les Paul, just like Fender has the time machine series because real pre-CBS strats are too expensive for the average musician.

These J/C prices are instead on the same level, if not above, as a real San Dimas strathead with the same features.
This is what makes me think that they won't sell.

VERY wise observation.

[VinceV]

Shawn, I know you're not one of the "doom and gloomers". But do the math, bro. Take #83- San Dimas Black, for example. A basic black Charvel strathead? Spec that same guitar out using the new Charvel custom shop pricelist - the NAMM price is nearly double what you get from the pricelist! That's happening with all of the NAMM guitars - they're all well above "normal" pricing.

The days of getting NAMM show guitars for regular custom shop prices are gone, my friend. But these NAMM guitars are NOT an indication that current custom shop pricing has gone that high. Not even close. Heck, I just ordered a pretty tricked-out strathead and, even with all of my options, the list price was well under that plain-jane black, single-hum VT NAMM piece.

Sorry, Shawn, but just trying to dispel how the BS pricing rumors get perpetuated.

The thing is even if what you are saying is true, NAMM is public face of these companies in a sense. So when you put up a bunch of way overpriced pieces, it will have a negative effect on how people view them. All over the internet there a guitar boards waitng for pics and prices and whatever news they can get today. So yes even though NAMM is a trade only/not open to the public show, tens of thousands of guitar buyers will get there information from this show. I can't believe dealers would weven want to purchase these pieces, knowing they will be sitting on them forever, as shown by many high priced NAMM pieces still in stock at store from years past, and those prices were no where near these. Plain and simple Jackson/Charvel does not have the "name" to be charging these kind of prices and that's it. Even if they are just diplay guitars they should not be priced in a way to turn off potential buyers, hell if they want to show what they can do, put a dam not for sale sign on it.

[hippietim]

First off, anyone that buys one of these is just fine with me. Buy them. I don't care about the ramifications you guys are talking about. Really. If this sort of thing causes JCMI to continue in this fashion and they are successful, I really don't care. Charge $10k. Charge $20k. If they sell, wonderful. To those that buy them, congrats on your successes in life - enjoy the fruits of your labor, diligent savings plan, inheritance, lottery winnings, robbery loot, or whatever.

As someone that has bought a number of USA selects, limited runs, etc. I can honestly say that I'm very satisfied with my guitars and the amount I paid for them. I'm also perfectly content if it turns out that I've bought my last new Jackson/Charvel. I've got some fantastic guitars and am very content with the J/C guitars I have. Would I like some of the new stuff? Sure. But it ain't gonna bother me one bit if I don't get another new one.

Let's face it, the newer J/C guitars aren't exactly taking the world by storm. DCGL has a summer 2005 NAMM guitar for sale at cost for like a year. They can't sell a Strathead retro star for cost either. Music Zoo, Fullers, etc. all have had a lot the same $3-4k Jacksons sitting for a very long time. They pop up on Ebay all the time and get zero bids. Apparently Shawn and Tracy either don't like those guitars or they already have a couple of them

I got calls from several dealers regarding the current NAMM show sheet. Each was calling to take the pulse of their customers regarding these guitars. They were basically saying they had no intention of buying any booth guitars unless they got specific customer commitments (aka. $$$). And these are guys that used to duke it out to get whatever they could.

One note on the pricing. These are all priced as Fender prices so-called Master Built guitars. I had priced out a Tele with Fender about 6 years ago and as a Master Built guitar it was going to be $7200 list. If I would have gone with a regular CS/team built guitar it would have been $4800 list. So I would guess that the NAMM guitars were all built by guys like Mike Shannon and Pablo Santana.

[Zerberus]

Is this practice for a future EVH signature axe thread??? I see the same groups of people, just a different looking target :ROTF:

[hippietim]

Sorry, Shawn, but just trying to dispel how the BS pricing rumors get perpetuated.

Sorry, what BS pricing rumors are you referring to? Everyone has seen the Charvel pricesheet. It's no secret that they start at $3k. Now everyone has seen the NAMM show price sheet. It's no secret that they start at $5.5k. I think everyone realizes that the NAMM show guitars are priced particularly high - if not, then they need to work on their remedial arithmetic skills.

[shreddermon]

Again, I'm not defending the NAMM prices. I think they're crazy, too. Just pointing out that they're not "normal" pricing.

[Jack Napalm]

Wasn't there an announcement a few months back about a High-End Custom Shop gallery that would combine all of FMIC's custom guitars under one umbrella? Maybe these guitars were destined for that? They must think they have at lease some market for them at these prices. The members of the the JCF are online a small portion of their customers.

At these prices I would rather spec out a guitar and wait for it. There are some damn cool NAMM guitars but I can always find one or two things I would like to change to about them.

[shreddermon]

I think everyone realizes that the NAMM show guitars are priced particularly high - if not, then they need to work on their remedial arithmetic skills.

Tim, go back and re-read some of the posts here. Some folks clearly don't realize that the NAMM guitars are being priced with a hefty premium over regular custom shop prices.

I won't comment on their math skills ( ), but some folks don't bother to do the math at all. They see these prices, and immediately assume they reflect this year's long-rumored and debated custom shop price increases. And that kind of silliness is exactly how the "$8k base price" rumors got perpetuated. It's like the freakin' phone game from grade school, ya know.

[GuitarWizard]

I think we all understand the NAMM markup, personally I'm wondering what their smoking to ask $5000.00 for a Charvel that's black with a gold logo and dosen't even have a Floyd.

[jwoods986]

That's the one that got me. I'm scrolling through the list thinking the prices are crazy but they probably try to justify them as works of art or whatever. But then you get to the end and see a plain black, one hum, strat-head, v-trem, with a $5500 list! People like to bag on Gibson and Fender prices (I've been guilty of it) but that's more than the list on a new LP Custom, which is made in Gibsons CS now.

[Joe_Steeler]

Oh no they aren't. Not in the long run anyhow. If dealers can't sell them, at some point they won't buy more.

I could not agree with you more on the end result (customer) thinking.

Unfortunately that is not how they think, absurd? yes, narrow minded? yes.

While there are people out there (whether USA, Japan or Europe) buying these incredibly out-of-the-park priced things (i.e. NAMM, new price list and artist replicas) therefore validating their pricing & profit making strategy they will continue doing it.

Nothing could be more intriguing than Eldred and Co. hauling ALL of these NAMM pieces back to Scottsdale (or whatever this Master CS Death Star is located) and wondering what the fuck happened, "where did we go wrong?".

[ken]

The Music Zoo has had a couple of Rat Rods for the past 6 months. can't move them?

One of them was there in late March, early April '06. Not my cup of tea. Or anyone else's by the looks of things!

Eh, sorry for the minor aside in the grander scheme of things.

Just out of interest, are you sure those "prices" aren't just made-up guff? Were there prices available before the show on last year's NAMM pieces and were they significantly less? Is it still not possible that there won't be crazy increases across the board?