String tension issue.

[Donovan]

I have an old RG3120 that is as will always be my #1 guitar. Love it. To try something new, I bought a Charvel ProMod CoCal mostly because I love my old Charvels and I liked the look. (Jake E Lee fan) Well this one is not so much agreeing with me. The tone aside... the neck feels weird. The string tension seems to be extremely high with the same gauge strings and the same scale length. Both have a 25.5 scale. Any ideas as to what I may be doing wrong here? Both guitars have the same strings on them and the same 440A tuning.

[murkat]

Check, measure, compare the pitch of the neck in relation to string height off the body
from the bridge of each guitar in question.
Usually, a little higher, a little looser in feel.

[toejam]

The Floyd springs might be stiffer since they're new. You could always remove a spring, too.

[Donovan]

The Floyd springs might be stiffer since they're new. You could always remove a spring, too.

How does this change the spring tension? I've heard it from many places so I can't disregard it, but I don't understand how this will change anything in a blocked dive only trem?

[toejam]

The more springs on a trem, the harder it is to press down on the bar. I prefer my Floyds to have 4 or 5 springs, but other people use 3 or even 2.

[Donovan]

The more springs on a trem, the harder it is to press down on the bar. I prefer my Floyds to have 4 or 5 springs, but other people use 3 or even 2.

OK but how does this affect the actual playing string tension across the fretboard? I meant to say "string" tension not spring. My argument is that if it takes 20 lbs of SPRING tension on the claw to hold the STRINGS in pitch, it's going to take 20lbs weather you have 2 SPRINGS or 40. The overall pull will always be the same amount to balance the trem. I've heard that this somehow affects STRING tension but I don't get how it could. Thanks guys.

[84sups]

Because the floyd is a pivot the springs being stiff would cause the strings to be stiff. More pull from the springs and the strings will have more tension and vise versa. Pretty simple concept

[Chad]

All else equal, with less springs, the claw will be screwed in further, which generally means that the springs will be more "open". A spring that is already open will flex easier than one that is more closed.

Springs don't affect the actual tension of the strings (pitch, string mass, and scale length are the only contributors to that), but they do affect the elasticity. i.e. with less springs, the trem will flex easier. This will make bends seem easier.

[VitaminG]

it's a question of the amount of counteracting spring tension that you're fighting against when you fret a note. A full contracted spring is harder to pull against than one that is extended. The fewer springs, the more those springs must extend to balance out the tension of the strings. The more springs, the closer they are to fully contracted and the stiffer the bridge feels.

What the number of springs actually effects is the amount of "give" in the bridge. With fewer springs & greater spring extension, it is easier to press down on the bar, as toejam said. So when you are playing there is less resistance to movement in the bridge.

Bending strings provides the clearest example. When you bend a note the bridge will naturally depress slightly as you increase the string tension by pushing on it. If you've ever felt frustrated playing compound bends when the held note dips as you bend the other string, this is why. The more springs, the less the bridge will dip as you bend. But even when you are not bending, by pressing down on the string you are slightly increasing string tension by deviating the string from it's straightest path. Remove some springs and you are fighting less spring tension. You perceive this as less string tension.

[straycat]

+1 G said it all right there.

[Donovan]

I don't think you guys are understanding that the bridge is blocked on both guitars. The trem block is butted up against the inside of the trem rout and doesn't pull up at all. The springs are tight enough to pull the strings hard enough that they bridge does not move at all unless I gram the arm and do a dive. So then... the tension of the springs should in fact have zero effect on the way the strings feel.

[Donovan]

Because the floyd is a pivot the springs being stiff would cause the strings to be stiff. More pull from the springs and the strings will have more tension and vise versa. Pretty simple concept

In a free floating pivot example, the more spring tension, the more pull on the strings, pulling on the strings would cause them to go sharp. If i tighten the spring claw on my guitar with a floating bridge, I'm going to pull the strings sharp. Once the bridge is out of room to move, the bridge will stop pulling sharp and the springs will just get tighter which at that point will not affect the tension of the strings. You cannot simply add more tension (pull) to a spring and have the string remain in the same spot. It's a pivot held in place by the opposing force of the spring pulling on the string with the string being a constant in order to keep it in tune.

[84sups]

I don't think you guys are understanding that the bridge is blocked on both guitars. The trem block is butted up against the inside of the trem rout and doesn't pull up at all. The springs are tight enough to pull the strings hard enough that they bridge does not move at all unless I gram the arm and do a dive. So then... the tension of the springs should in fact have zero effect on the way the strings feel.

If it's too tight it'll make the bridge not pull up in a bend making it seem stiffer. I set mine up so they just touch the body and pull up slightly when bending so it's not as stiff.

[j2379]

If the Floyd is blocked it shouldn't move when bending at all, at least that's how I set it up blocked. It maybe a different brand of string. Different core size or hex vs round cores will be at difference tensions even tuned the same w the same scale. Some of it could be action and fret board radius not actual string tension but perceived tension.

[VitaminG]

I don't think you guys are understanding that the bridge is blocked on both guitars. The trem block is butted up against the inside of the trem rout and doesn't pull up at all. The springs are tight enough to pull the strings hard enough that they bridge does not move at all unless I gram the arm and do a dive. So then... the tension of the springs should in fact have zero effect on the way the strings feel.

if both trems were completely blocked maybe so. Then it could be the other facts that j2379 mentioned coming into play. But blocked to dive only, everything I mentioned earlier could still affect it.

How many springs on your Ibanez?