San Dimas RR1 w/EMG's wired 3x's and still a hum!!! Help please

[tonesfoyobones]

Hey everyone and thanks for taking a minute to go over my situation.....

I have a '85 San Dimas RR1. It was original set up with passives and while in I had no issues. I just wanted to try something different. I had it changed over and set up with an EMG set. After 3 complete re-wires and 2 new pots it has a hum when I let go of the strings when the volume is off. When I touch the strings it stops.... typically a ground issue. The tech that re-wired this guitar 3 times is more than capable for the job. He builds costume pedals and does alot of special electrical work for noted celebs. His work is spot on and super clean. He just installed actives in 3 prior Jackson King V's for me and they all came back perfect. For what ever reason my RR is proven to be difficult.

what I know:
1- no shelding in any of the cavities or any ground wires under my pickups like my King V's have.
2- New pots (volume,volume)
3- New input jack (it hummed with 2 seperate input jacks)
4- shielded input jack wires
5- guitar ground is connected. I know EMG says not too but it hums connected and disconnected. (it runs up under the "V" plate where my strings come up through and simple sandwiches between the guitar and the plate)

Everything by his account is connected correctly and we are stummped as to why I am still having some hum. I have tried all of my guitars in my rig and none of them hum. Just my RR.

Attached are some pics. If anyone has any valued input please let me know your thoughts. I would have no problem going back to passives but I would really like to find out why my RR wants to be difficult.

Thanks in advance!

RR1 wiring 001.jpgRR1 wiring 002.jpgRR1 wiring 003.jpgRR1 wiring 004.jpgRR1 wiring 005.jpgRR1 wiring 006.jpgRR1 wiring 007.jpg

[tonesfoyobones]

***UPDATE*** I just went ahead and snipped the bridge ground wire that EMG says not to reconect. It still hums but now on stops when I touch the input jack or pots. I also just noticed that wne I have the toggle in my bridge position and my neck volume is up I am getting volume bleed through. When reversed and I have the toggle in my neck position and turn up the bridge volume I get no bleed through. Q: is my 3-way bad?

[rdamaral]

I have this same issue with the ZW set in a LP that I cleaned up. I even went as far as to send them back to EMG for testing. Nothing. I got them back and they are still humming. I finally just put the pot knobs back on and left them alone. I only got a ground hum through the pots when I touched them, a little at the bridge and nothing when I touched the strings.

[tonesfoyobones]

*** Also to note..... there is no body ground in my RR. Is that normal? Is the bridge ground my body ground??

[h.e.l.shane]

Ok.... I'm a bit curious why its using a pickup selector switch for a gibby 3-pickup SG or Paul??? (the cavity depth requires the SG style switch, but not the 3 pole one you have)

If you do not have shielding in your cavities, you will not have a body ground, just a bridge ground


Are you running stereo jack?

(i'm not suggesting you are an idiot with these questions, I just see wiring mistakes all the time in my shop)

[tonesfoyobones]

Ok.... I'm a bit curious why its using a pickup selector switch for a gibby 3-pickup SG or Paul??? (the cavity depth requires the SG style switch, but not the 3 pole one you have)

If you do not have shielding in your cavities, you will not have a body ground, just a bridge ground

What values are the pots?

Are you running stereo jack?

was curious to the toggle as well. That's what was in the guitar when I got it.
25k pots.
stereo jack .

was actually going to replace the toggle today.

[h.e.l.shane]

if you have a DMM, its good to check every ground point to the jack and make sure you have continuity.

This may be trivial, but it can make a difference.... Have you tried switching the ground and the battery negative locations on the jack?

and.... double check that you go the output wire on the tip slug of the jack... reversing the polarity here can cause a hum


Looks like you got a white wire spliced to the battery going through the body to the jack.....

my #1 rule when wiring, Black is ground, white is hot

Why... Because i got tired of running two white or two black or two green wiries to the jack and then trying to figure out which one was what!!

also.....at least once a month, I get a guitar with a hum in for repair... and find the polarity screwed at the jack. (and sometimes its a re-repair from a local music shop!!!!!!!!)

[tonesfoyobones]

if you have a DMM, its good to check every ground point to the jack and make sure you have continuity.

This may be trivial, but it can make a difference.... Have you tried switching the ground and the battery negative locations on the jack?

and.... double check that you go the output wire on the tip slug of the jack... reversing the polarity here can cause a hum


Looks like you got a white wire spliced to the battery going through the body to the jack.....

my #1 rule when wiring, Black is ground, white is hot

Why... Because i got tired of running two white or two black or two green wiries to the jack and then trying to figure out which one was what!!

also.....at least once a month, I get a guitar with a hum in for repair... and find the polarity screwed at the jack. (and sometimes its a re-repair from a local music shop!!!!!!!!)

I checked the ground connections and they all read 0.3 Is that normall?

I have not tried to reverse the battery connection at the jack yet.

[tonesfoyobones]

Something else to note:

What threw me off to the toggle switch was that I am having volume bleed through.
- when toggle is in bridge position and bridge volume is off I can turn up the neck volume and get bleed through.
- when toggle is neck position and neck volume is down I can turn up the bridge volume and get bleed through.
- when toggle is in the middle position I get no bleed through.

[h.e.l.shane]

hmmm... to you have tone continuity on your DMM.. I don't consider the ground good until i get tone and it reads 0

I just had this problem when taking a set of EMG's OUT of one of the new Mexi Kelly's and put a set of CS Invaders in!

I kept getting hum and it would go away when I touched the strings (meaning a bad ground), even after re-installing the bridge ground i could not get tone between the bridge and the jack.

Finally, I took a wire wheel on the dremel and removed all the black coating of the outside bridge body inserts, ran a tap down into the threads, ran a die over the threads of the thumbwheel, took the coating off aroud the center of the thumbwheel top, did the same to the underside of the bridge and THEN gopped it up with electrolytic grease and "beeeeeeeeeeeeeeee: finally got tone... (and REALLY quiet invaders!)

If you don't play clean a lot, you might also try changing the wiring to the modern style with the hot wire in the #1 lug of the volume pot and the output on the center. (ill have to check one of my 50's wired guitars tonight to see if there's bleed through like you describe.. theoretically, there shouldn't be.. but...... )

but.. there is a grounding issue here somewhere.. i can smell it!!!!



Also... those look like older EMG's with the wire coming out of the epoxy rather than the three pin connector

If so.. 1) Awesome.. I think they sound better and 2) could have a bad pot


Its at this point where I, personally, would say screw it, pull it all apart, put in new pots and switch, and ensure that my grounding gets tone at every location

and while doing that.. add a tone pot!!!!! (If you have room to lay the battery sidways under it and put a piece of foam on top!)

[leftykingv2]

I would get all new pots a new toggle and a new jack and start from scratch. The stuff you have in that guitar looks ancient as hell. Also the first time I put EMG's in a guitar was 1990 and they were the old style one like you have. My friend who does all of my electrical work told me to get all new pots switches and a new jack that were made for EMG's. I got my hardware directly from my EMG dealer who recommends different hardware with actives. In fact I do this every time I get a set of EMG's for a guitar. I never use the hardware that was on passive pick ups for actives. Maybe I am just goofy but like I said I've never had a problem and I have 7 guitars that are wired with EMG's. All the guitars I have that are wired with EMG's are very quiet as well.

[tonesfoyobones]

I would get all new pots a new toggle and a new jack and start from scratch. The stuff you have in that guitar looks ancient as hell. Also the first time I put EMG's in a guitar was 1990 and they were the old style one like you have. My friend who does all of my electrical work told me to get all new pots switches and a new jack that were made for EMG's. I got my hardware directly from my EMG dealer who recommends different hardware with actives. In fact I do this every time I get a set of EMG's for a guitar. I never use the hardware that was on passive pick ups for actives. Maybe I am just goofy but like I said I've never had a problem and I have 7 guitars that are wired with EMG's. All the guitars I have that are wired with EMG's are very quiet as well.

Pots are brand new..... EMG's are brand new....... input jack is brand new........ just replaced the toggle switch to but no improvement so............ I pulled the shit out.
Everyone that I have spoke to and who have seen the guitar is stumped and I have lost all my patience in trying to track down the problem. I just ain't gonna throw anymore coin at it. Tech say's he want's to shield the cavities and put a body groung lug in. I ain't buying in.

EMG's are out and now back to passives. Never have I ever had such a time with a pickup install over all of my years in doing so.

Thanks for the input and suggestions.

[leftykingv2]

I don't know what to say about that man. Have you tried talking to Dave Manella of Manella Guitars? He's the Jackson expert around PA. or so I hear. Also man just a thought have you tried checking the pick ups on a multi meter to see if they're working properly? I know that's unlikely with a new set of pick ups but try anything you didn't think of.

[tonesfoyobones]

I checked the pickups and they are fine. I even swapped them out for a set of Blackouts and they did the same thing. So strange. I even went over every solder connection several times and re did them to no change.

The only thing that I did to this guitar that I never did on a pickup change before was that I had to slightly dremel out the corners of the pickup cavities to allow the EMG's to fit. I exposed the bare wood on those corners. Is there any chance that could be the problem??

[leftykingv2]

I don't see how that would make a difference. If I were you I'd hit Straycat up. He's a member here and does this stuff for a living.