BC Rich Quad bridge setup questions

[Venomboy]

I have a handmade BC Rich Widow and Beast, both with a Quad. Both guitars from around 2000-ish.

Issues:

The action is higher on the higher frets (12th and above) than on the lower frets.

To get the lowest action possible, I'd like some advice. I'm guessing the truss rod might need a bit of adjusting. Tighten or loosen?

Once that is done and the fretboard is relatively straight, how do you recommend setting up the Quad? Right now on both guitars the Quad pitches forward a bit. Should I lower it all the way, and use saddle height adjustment screws only? Is there any purpose to the small screws at the back of the bridge that "push" the bridge back from the posts a bit?

I've had a few conflicting tips on this in the past. Some people say lower the bridge all the way, raise the saddles as high as possible. Others disagree.

I'm using .009-.042 strings. Changing the gauges ain't gonna happen

I cannot find a shop that agrees with my vision of low action. I've lucked out with some of my guitars where the setup was a breeze and the action is low (the best example being my Moser 10). Most shops raise the action 12 feet and say, boy isn't that low? Uh, no. And no, I don't want to talk about Lindy Fralin pickups or 1 watt lightbulb powered tube amps

Any advice in as great of detail as possible with rationale would be appreciated. Thanks!

[leftykingv2]

First of all if you are paying for a pro set up and the guitar is coming back not to your liking I would refuse to pay until the guitar is set up to YOUR standards. That's just ridiculous. 1-866-722-7424 is the phone number for BC Rich support. I've never owned a B.C. Rich so I couldn't tell you how to adjust the action on that bridge other than turning the studs. It is a common mistake people make thinking that truss rods are for adjusting the action. Adjusting the truss rod does affect the playing action but that's a side effect and not really the purpose for the adjustment. As a rule of thumb once the truss rod and nut are set ALL action adjustment is done at the bridge by raising or lowering the saddle. Intonation is affected by action too so adjusting the action can make the intonation better or worse. If the neck is the problem and the strings are really low at the nut and the last fret and really high in the middle of the neck you have too much relief and the truss rod needs tightened. I would also kindly ask "Hellraiser" (forum member) about the bridge. He has a few BC Rich guitars from what I know and probably knows how to adjust the action on a quad style bridge.

[j2379]

Personally I find with quads lower the bridge and raise the saddles. You want to get a nice hard angle over the saddles. Quads and badass bridges always seem to lean forward a bit. With a quad be sure to make all of the saddle level side to side, if not they have a tendency to rattle against each other. BCR neck angles varied a lot with my older ones the bottom of the bridge is maybe 1/8" off the face of the guitar.

[j2379]

And yes the little screws will let you back the bridge away from the neck like a badass. I screw them almost all the way out to try and have the bridge on the post as far as possible. I think it helps with leaning tho it probably doesn't help much.

Tighten the truss rod just a bit. I find it a bit easier to get super low action with little relief in the neck. Also I find a lot of getting the low action isn't always the amount of relief but where on the neck the relief is the biggest.

In my experience with BCRs neck almost no relief lower the bridge and raise the saddles. I don't know if they changed size but I trip to the auto parts store was needed find Allen key set with those tiny sizes.

[Venomboy]

Awesome. thanks!!!!

[h.e.l.shane]

here's something else to consider

I recommend Tone Pros Locking studs to my customers with single unit bridges, like wraparounds and quads...

the top cap screws into the base and actually locks the bridge onto the studs.. thus, it doesn;t fall off when you change strings, and it transmits more vibration to the body...

Unlike a locking tune o matic, i can actually hear and feel a difference in the guitar once they are installed.

[j2379]

What size are the threads, I would love to use them on some badass bridges but there is no way in hell I'm pulling the bushings out of old guitars.

[h.e.l.shane]

They come in Metric or standard.. I usually leave the bushings in existing guitars to avoid any issues with paint chipping (thus.. I have a bin of tone pros bushings!!!!)

Standard are 5/16 X 24 TPI

Metric are M8 x 1.25

all ya gotta do is get a 5/16 X 24 bolt from home creeepo and if it doesn't fit in the bushing in the guitar.. its metric!

[Newc]

Not familiar with the Quad or BCs in general, but generally speaking, higher action on the upper frets than the lower frets means the neck has too much relief (forward bow).

I'm assuming the bridge is that stopbar+TOM unit that only requires one set of mounting posts, as opposed to 2 sets like on a Les Paul? I had one a while back that had stopbar-style "hooks", but the bridge itself didn't mount to any posts, thus I don't see any benefit to moving the bridge out except to compensate for scale differences (bolt-on 24 3/4" neck on a body that can take either scale), or to get that "Gibson" feel of the bridge being separate from the tail.

Other such bridges I've seen had the bridge mounted on posts and the stopbar tail "floating" instead. In that event, I can't see that backing the tail out would force the bridge harder against the posts, as there's nothing but string pull for force.
But, as I said, the one I had was never mounted, so I can't say for sure.

Mine also didn't have height-adjustable saddles, either, so it could look like a Strat hardtail for all I know.

At any rate, holding the guitar like a rifle, not flat, look from the bridge to the nut along the low E, and see how the neck curves. You'll probably notice it curves out away from the string near the middle of the board. Some people suggest standing the guitar on its end at your feet and looking from the nut to the bridge. Either way works, but just don't hold it up flat so the pickups point at the ceiling or down at the floor, and don't set it down it at an angle as this will influence how the neck flexes. You want it straight up and down if you're resting it on its end.

Since you're most likely going to see that the neck is bowed forward, you want to set it flat to start, so tighten the truss rod (just like a bottle cap or a light bulb - turn to the right to tighten, left to loosen, though if the wrench is pointing at 6 o'clock and you tighten it, you're actually going toward the left :p )

Some people say only adjust the rod with the strings detuned, but I find that counter-productive, as the strings are pulling the neck forward. If you loosen the strings, and the neck straightens out from the release of tension, then you're going to be there a while as you tighten, tune, check, detune, loosen/tighten, tune, check, loosen/tighten, tune, check, ad nauseum.

So with strings tuned to your tuning you intend to use, tighten the rod until the neck appears as straight as the low E string. Since every guy in the world is born with a set of automotive feeler gages, hold down the string at the first fret and the last fret, and check the string clearance from second fret to second-to-last fret. You'll also need to break out your precision ruler to make sure that the string is no more than 1mm off the frets.
:P

Actually, not every guy owns a precision ruler or feeler gages, so just look at the damn fretboard and figure out if the neck is still bowed forward too far or if it needs to go flatter.

If it's a bolt-on neck, and the neck is flat, the bridge is as low as it can go, and the strings are still too high, remove the neck and put a shim under the heel next to the back of the pocket (close to the neck pickup, assuming it has one). This kicks the back of the neck up, and tilts the nut-end of the neck back, which in turn causes the strings to lay closer to the frets.

Break angle across the saddles is subjective. Some prefer a hard break, some prefer a softer break. Some are under the misguided impression that having the strings touching the bridge housing itself before crossing the saddles affects tone.

You want what works for you. A harder break angle will make bends stiffer, whereas a softer angle will make them smoother. A hard angle will also reduce the possibility of the string slipping across the saddle as you bend it, but may cut the string at the saddle when it breaks.

I try to keep a break angle similar to how it breaks across the nut to the tuners, however the head is usually tilted back as well.

As for raising the saddles and lowering the bridge body, that's also subjective. Some people say they hear a difference if the baseplate is resting on the body and the saddles are up in the air vs the baseplate being off the body and the saddles hard against it. Find what works for you.

Once you've tightened the truss rod, be aware that this has also changed the tuning, which means more tension from the strings, which means they're pulling the neck forward. I find that 1/4 to 1/3 of a turn of the rod for each semitone of string pitch, so you're up from E to E-and-a-half with the first turn.

[Venomboy]

Thanks! Exactly the info I was looking for.

[j2379]

The way the quad saddle are if they do not have enough angle on them they can rattle and buzz a bit. also why with a quad each saddle needs to be level, if they lean to either side they tend to vibrate against the adjacent saddles. quads are great bridges but the way they are designed they will rattle a bit if set a bit sloppy.

you can also hold the Es down on the first and last fret, check the distance from the strings to the frets, thats decent way to check relief. Its also nice to check with a few strings so you can see if there is any twist or oddities in the way the neck bows.

TNX for the info on the bridge posts.

[JACKSONFREAK]

I hold the guitar in playing position and press the low string down the first and last frets and look at the relief between the fifth and ninth frets. Should be about the thickness of a business card. If it's more than that straighten the neck. If it's less then put some relief in it. Looking at the neck relief from either end can give you an optical illusion as can the tapered nut. Adjust the bridge so the action is at desired height at the 12th fret without buzz. Adjusting the saddle height will give you a stronger break angle on the strings providing a slightly stiffer feel if you like a tighter tension and a looser feel with lower saddles. also to adjust the radius of the string to match the finger board radius. Adjust the two screws at the posts so there is a slight angle to the bridge treble side slightly closer to the neck.then adjust the individual saddles for each strings intonation.
Gil