Okay, RR3 help, really needed please

[MartinBarre]

I installed my new Duncan Invaders last week, thanks to help from you guys in here. I've had them in about a week now, and I don't really like them, just like the DiMarzio's I had in previously.

I also posted this in the Seymour Duncan forum:
although for riffing it sounds as heavy as hell, and the neck pup is nice for cleans, I still don't think the guitar is "singing" - the harmonics just don't jump out of this guitar the way I think they should. It just isnt much fun to play - it's as if somethings wrong but not being an expert I can't tell what it is!

Is there any reason why my RR3 doesn't seem to be much fun to play? Anything obvious I mean, obviously it's a hard question when you guys have never played it!

AND:

I just sat down and played the RR3 for a while, just straight into my Marshall AVT20. Then I swapped and played the SL3.
The SL3 practically plays itself! Harmonics just jump out, on ANY of the pups.
The RR3 on the other hand seems no better sounding than any cheap beginners guitar. That can't be right surely.

I really don't know what to do with this thing. Take it for a full check-up at a local repair shop? Or just go ahead and buy different pickups?

Or just sell the thing? I HAD planned on doing that when I ordered the SL3, then the wife told me to keep it so I've ordered custom - red pearl - scratchplate and truss rod covers (the Invaders are both red with black poles). So....I'd really rather hold onto the guitar, but not if it's going to be such a chore to play.

PLEASE SOMEONE HELP ME!!!!



It was suggested I maybe have a dodgy tone pot or switch, would that really affect the sound so much? Everything SEEMS to work as it should.
I'm stumped and it's really starting to annoy me.

[Bengal]

The only thing that really springs to mind is the nut. RR3's have locking trems, right? Maybe the nut isn't allowing good vibration throughout the string. I had a guitar like that once and the nut wasn't properly cut, but that was a hardtail, not a locking trem...

Maybe the guitar is a dog. It might just be a bad guitar...

[Newc]

Does the SL3 have an Invader?

There's a reason they make different pickups - different tones.


The Invader is a high-gain pickup, which means you DO NOT use a high-gain amp setting with them. They are designed to push a non-high-gain tone into a higher-gain stage (actually you're overloading the input with them, which is similar to having a boost pedal in front of the amp).

I've never had an Invader myself, but when dealing with high-gain pickups (Duncan Distortion, Full Shred, etc) I've found that you really have to play around with the pickup height and amp gain to get it to do what you want, and that may include having to choose between the crushing rhythm or singing harmonics, but not being able to have both at once.

This is why you see so many pros using one pickup type on all their guitars.

If you've got a programmable preamp, you'll have to build a patch for the Invaders and a separate one for the SL3.

[Sunbane]

Are there playability issues? Check and compare neck bow and string height over the frets.

Is the RR neck heavy? That's definitely a joy-killer for me. Even though I don't consciously think about it while I play, a neck heavy guitar is more straining to play, and may hamper your fluidity. I had a bolt-on RR that would "plane out" if I let go of the neck. Annoying as hell. A wide leather strap did not fix the problem for me, and I ended up selling her.

Other than that: Mojo.

[CharvelRocker]

As I mentioned on Duncan Forum, it kind of sounds to me like your tone pot or the cap may be fried. Try swapping them both out and see what happens.

[MartinBarre]

Are there playability issues? Check and compare neck bow and string height over the frets.

Is the RR neck heavy? That's definitely a joy-killer for me. Even though I don't consciously think about it while I play, a neck heavy guitar is more straining to play, and may hamper your fluidity. I had a bolt-on RR that would "plane out" if I let go of the neck. Annoying as hell. A wide leather strap did not fix the problem for me, and I ended up selling her.

Other than that: Mojo.

Not really any issues with playability no, other than the sound! The neck is fine, doesn't move much if I leave go of it.

[MartinBarre]

Does the SL3 have an Invader?

There's a reason they make different pickups - different tones.


The Invader is a high-gain pickup, which means you DO NOT use a high-gain amp setting with them. They are designed to push a non-high-gain tone into a higher-gain stage (actually you're overloading the input with them, which is similar to having a boost pedal in front of the amp).

I've never had an Invader myself, but when dealing with high-gain pickups (Duncan Distortion, Full Shred, etc) I've found that you really have to play around with the pickup height and amp gain to get it to do what you want, and that may include having to choose between the crushing rhythm or singing harmonics, but not being able to have both at once.

This is why you see so many pros using one pickup type on all their guitars.

If you've got a programmable preamp, you'll have to build a patch for the Invaders and a separate one for the SL3.

No, the SL3 has the stock JB etc in it. Your answer is food for thought, I appreciate it. I'll mess around with the gain settings, see if I can get a nicer sound from that.

[Newc]

The JB is a Distortion with an Alnico5 magnet instead of ceramic, so they're essentially the same pickup - both are regarded as being high-gain.

However, it's my understanding the Invader is even higher than that, and the huge bolts on top help generate an enormous magnetic field. As I said in the other thread, if the pickups are too close, you're in the inner bands of the field.

If that's the case, the tighter field is most likely degrading the oscillation of the string (think of it as something being caught in the Earth's gravitational field and crashing to the ground, as opposed to something orbiting the planet)

[MartinBarre]

The JB is a Distortion with an Alnico5 magnet instead of ceramic, so they're essentially the same pickup - both are regarded as being high-gain.

However, it's my understanding the Invader is even higher than that, and the huge bolts on top help generate an enormous magnetic field. As I said in the other thread, if the pickups are too close, you're in the inner bands of the field.

If that's the case, the tighter field is most likely degrading the oscillation of the string (think of it as something being caught in the Earth's gravitational field and crashing to the ground, as opposed to something orbiting the planet)

I've tried messing around with the pup and pole height and there doesn't seem to be much difference in the overall sound. These things sound "alright", rather than great. Yes, great for playing something like Deicide's "Scars of the Crucifix" riff - but solos, forget it . The guitar will be getting a check over by some pros, hopefully they will pinpoint a simple problem like a pot or switch. I'll be hanging onto this RR3 until I have my red pearl scratchplate and truss cover, but it's seeming like more of a waste of time every day. When my SL3 is such a joy to play, and the RR3 is such a pain in the arse, well....what's the point in keeping a guitar just cos it looks nice? I could throw more money at buying a JB/Jazz or even Custom or Distortion set but it could still sound like shite.