jackson paint?

[donnieb]

hi, wot kind of paint and primer do jackson guitars use?

[Bengal65]

hi, wot kind of paint and primer do jackson guitars use?

I don't know if they use a Polyester or a Polyurethane. I do know they use a lot of PPG products. I personally use PPG DP series which is acrylic polyurethane. DP48, to be specific because it's white. What ever product you use, the topcoating should be compatible with your base.

[donnieb]

are bothtypes of paint readily available in automotive repair shops?

[dg]

Yes, they should both be available. I'm pretty sure Jackson has been using polyester for quite a while, but used polyurethane early on. I think Sully has mentioned this a few times, and iirc part of the Big Red run involved making sure they used polyurethane instead of polyester on them so they'd be just like Robbin C's guitar.

[Bengal65]

Yes, any automotive refinisher/supply house should have it. Other's (manuf) are Dupont, RM, Sherwin-Williams to name a few. Check with your local supplier to see if they are PPG dealers. It's a 2 part mix. Most repair shops will have it unless they use a specific brand other than PPG, but they can get it.

[Bengal65]

dg,
Have you ever found any difference between Polyester and PolyUrethane? I've been using PolyU for years and in the last year have been researching the polyesters. I can't really find any data on them. I can locate suppliers, but I wonder what the physical differences are and if one effects sound or tone either way?

[dg]

I'm a noob as far as shooting catalyzed paints. I've only used polyurethane myself. This old thread has some good info, from Mark (mm2002) especially:

http://www.jcfonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26132&highlight=polyester

[Learn Guitars]

dg,
Have you ever found any difference between Polyester and PolyUrethane? I've been using PolyU for years and in the last year have been researching the polyesters. I can't really find any data on them. I can locate suppliers, but I wonder what the physical differences are and if one effects sound or tone either way?

Huge difference between Polyester and Polyurethane. The pot life on polyester is about 15 minutes. It hardens like nothing else out there. But it has yellowing qualities. It requires at least a 1.7 tp to spray as well. It has much higher build abilities in a single coat session. It will not shrink back compared to urethanes..especially when used as a sealer. From my own experience, poly-u stays softer and tends to trap resonance. The poly-e is a very hard finish and doesnt dampen body resonance as much.

[RobRR]

Huge difference between Polyester and Polyurethane. The pot life on polyester is about 15 minutes. It hardens like nothing else out there. But it has yellowing qualities. It requires at least a 1.7 tp to spray as well. It has much higher build abilities in a single coat session. It will not shrink back compared to urethanes..especially when used as a sealer. From my own experience, poly-u stays softer and tends to trap resonance. The poly-e is a very hard finish and doesnt dampen body resonance as much.

After hearing that, Id have to say that Jackson (imports at least) are Poly-e because no stripper i could find would even touch the stuff!

[cdwillis]

RobRR, if you wanna strip paint off a guitar get this stuff called Zip n Strip. I found it at my local hardware store and it took the paint off an old Squier body I had like it was butter.

[Bengal65]

Huge difference between Polyester and Polyurethane. The pot life on polyester is about 15 minutes. It hardens like nothing else out there. But it has yellowing qualities. It requires at least a 1.7 tp to spray as well. It has much higher build abilities in a single coat session. It will not shrink back compared to urethanes..especially when used as a sealer. From my own experience, poly-u stays softer and tends to trap resonance. The poly-e is a very hard finish and doesnt dampen body resonance as much.

Wow, thanks Mike! Good info. I had heard that about Polyester. Yeah, the urethane does take much longer to cure than that ester. As you know urethane pot life is about 45 mins. to 1 hour. Interesting stuff. I bet that is why so many manufacturers have been using the ester as a sealer coat.

[Axewielder]

Great thread. So people seem to be using the terms "urethane" and "polyurethane" interchangeably, are those really the same thing?

[roodyrocker]

When I custom ordered my 24 Fret Rhoads several years ago, Tim Wilson told me they like to use PPG paints. At the time, the color I wanted was only available from BASF and the only way I could get it was in automotive touch up bottles. Therefore there is at least one Jackson custom shop that is done in lacquer because I had to send them the paint to do it

[Bengal65]

Great thread. So people seem to be using the terms "urethane" and "polyurethane" interchangeably, are those really the same thing?

Yes! The only differences are the ester's and urethanes. I don't know the difference chemically or how they effect sound. You'd have to ask a chemist From what I remember from organic chemistry, they are molecular differences. They both are 2 part catalytics with some having an additive reducer. Like Mike was saying the esters set up more quickly than the urethanes.
Being that the esters set or freeze more quickly may allow a finisher doing high volume guitars to be able to have the primer/sealer coats cure more quickly, thus allowing basecoats to be applied sooner than if using a urethane.

[sully]

from what i've noticed, urethane is usually thinner (which is part of the reason why you can see the body seams better in the old jacksons compared to the new ones), and as mike said, tends to shrink back a bit more than polyester.

sully