Do NOT deal with Mr. Graphic

[vector]

This is prolly gonna turn into a pissing match but I'm hoping that recounting this prevents anyone from getting the slimy maneuvering and bullshit that I have from Mr. Graphic. If you've read his mini-novel, you have seen the lengths Mr. Graphic goes to to worm out of man-ing up & honoring his word. It's no secret that his post comes in an effort to minimize damage as I told him yesterday that I was gonna bring this to light on the forum.

Bottom line is: he sold me a guitar that was NOT as it was described, from mods poorly done like an sheared off angle bracket used as a trem stop (Mods not by Mr. Graphic, he had NO idea what was done to it- never bothered to look it over before listing) to holes drilled into the guitar's trem cavity and a screw sticking out of the bottom of the cavity. Wanted my money back, simple as that. To his credit- he initially offered it, then offered 75 bucks to keep, which I declined. Then I get a long pm containing opinions and conjecture as to why I was returning the guitar. Seems Mr. Graphic was unhappy that I looked to see what pup was in there.

Once the guitar was returned to him unscathed and fully intact, he refunded all but 50 bucks and the shipping costs, claiming that the guitar was missing the trem stop and required a set up because the strings were not tuned to E 440. Really? A full 50 dollars set up to return the strings to pitch? How do you justify this? Yeah, because de-tuning the guitar for shipping has NEVER been done to minimize tension on the neck. I won't bore you with the details about all the other petty bullshit he's tried to cook up to avoid honoring his word. Rest assured, I have copies of the emails & communiques he's sent. If you're interested and need a good laugh, let me know, I'll share 'em. This is slimy, shady dealing in it's most annoying form. The guitar was NOT what was described and a full refund should have been made promptly and without a mountain of weasel-y, dishonorable bullshit. My greatest regret, other than dealing with this guy, was that it would tarnish an otherwise great source for guitar buying, trading and selling.

[Rich#6]

Vector your post on the guitar and the CS was filled with buyers remorse way above the trem block issue. I was thinking this way before the post in this section by Mr. Graphic. A guitar with a d-tuna would either have to have the trem resting on the body or a trem block, but you being a trem junky has to be able to pull up? This was among many indications that you wanted out of that deal with any excuse. the number of frets, not looking for another one the list goes on. When you buy used wheather it's on ebay or here you should never expect the item description to be 100%. you are a person who should only buy new or play the guitar first. This 100% is what has turned ebay to shit. I don't think Mr. Graphic was trying to scam you in the least. Taking apart the guitar after you where going to return it was complete bullshit. If it was a dealer fine fuckit that's apart of what they have to deal with with returns but this was not. You could have easily chipped the neck pocket.
Lastly bringing up lawyers is really petty. Hearing that I have lost all respect for you.

[Mr Graphic]

I put a modified {by the previous owner, added D-Tuna, upgraded pickups, trem stop} slime green USA Charvel up for sale a few weeks ago for $799.00 shipped. I bought it for my son. He did not like the color. Within a day or two I put it up for sale. I did not dis-assemble the guitar before selling it. It looked, played, sounded great as it was. I described it honestly, and as it appeared to me. Jim {VECTOR} contacted me and said "Hey Bro, I definitely want the Charvel." I replied "Hi Jim, I'd prefer a deposit but I'll hold it for you as long as I don't have to chase you around." He replied in part "No need to chase me around, I want the guitar." I then proceeded to accommodate Jim so he could buy the guitar, holding it for him 2 days on his word. Six hours later I get a PM from Jim... "What model/year is that Charvel? What's the condition? Any dings, scratches or other boo-boo's? How's the fret wear? Are you the original owner?." My response was "Are you still intending to buy the guitar? I have no problem answering any questions at any time during the process, but I'm getting the feeling your backing out. Is that the case? Let me know." He replied "No. Still want the guitar. Just trying to get a handle on the item, it's condition, previous ownership etc. In short, being an informed consumer." to which I said "The reason I asked is that you committed to buying...THEN asked questions. I normally do the reverse. Just thought you might be having second thoughts or a change in finances. No problem, let me know when your ready." Jim's reply was "Guilty as charged- I'm a Madison Ave. marketing firms wet dream- I tend to "buy on sight" and not use my head." He paid me a $50.00 deposit on the 3rd day, and the balance due on the 4th day. I sent the guitar right out. Upon receipt, he had several complaints. "First, I didn't get a trem arm with the Charvel. Second- there has been some extensive modding done to the trem cavity, i.e. the guitar has 6 seperate holes drilled in it near the edge next to/in front of the trem block. Someone installed a trem stop {if you want to call it that- it's actually part of an angle bracket that some one sheared off to fit and then drilled/ screwed it in with some household screws. No telling how deep these screws go or what kind of impact that could have on the wood's structural integrity. It certainly doesn't help the value in the event of wanting to trade it. Lastly, whoever installed the DiMarzio apparently used a non-reg length screw as it protruded thru the cavity by an 1/8th of an inch and I damn near tore my hand up trying to check one of the trem springs. I gotta be honest with you, while the guitar sounds fine and plays okay, other than the rattling of the EVH Dtune whenever the trem is used {I had to take a bar off one of my other OFR equipped axes} it's not really what I thought I was buying. I'm a huge stickler for full disclosure on used guitars. I don't think their was any intentional hiding of pertinent details, as you have to be looking for the issues I discovered, it really was not adequately described either. I'd really appreciate a refund upon return." I replied... "Jim, the tremelo arm & wrench is in a USPS Priority mail envelope in the box. I never ship with that stuff in the case. Regarding the other issues... I had no idea...never looked at things that closely. I purchased the guitar for my son, send it back for a refund {minus shipping}, no problem at all. My apologies...Doug." I then followed up with an offer of a $75.00 partial refund which he declined. I then I noticed Jim posting on the forum about the guitar. This is AFTER he rejected buying it. "the sound/tone I got out of that SanDimas 2H was just pure wet dream awesome. The stock bridge pup had been replaced by a Dimarzio of unknown variety. (will check tonight before I return it) Me like." My immediate thoughts were...At this point you've rejected buying it, you've rejected a $75.00 refund offer, and in my opinion you were amateurish right out of the gate on this deal, so what right do you now have to remove the strings and remove the pickup to view underneath to benefit your own agenda? The guitar had a great set-up and I didn't want him removing the strings and pickup so he could look see what model pickup was in it. I told him he had no right to dis-assemble the guitar after he rejected purchasing it. His reply to my concerns was, get this... "As long as I did no damage or modified the guitar in any way (which I didn't) I am entitled to look at the pup. I was curious and there is no law or rule, written or otherwise, that precludes me from looking at the pup." then followed with "I apologize for removing the strings (and then putting them back on just as they were) and looking at the pick up. I assure you that no damage was done to the guitar." Also in his post he mentions "On the down side, the trem obviously has no rout & was set to dive only. Even if the trem was able to pull a little sharp (some retard had installed, rather badly, an aluminum angle bracket, sheared off to fit in the cavity, as a trem stop) it's not enough float for this Floyd junky. The other unfortunate (but not deal killing) characteristic was the 22 frets. Again, no surprise there- I knew before buying that the promod has 22. But I missed having those additional 2 frets on the SD. Love my 24 fret CS Star ( 95% of all my axes have 24) So, I've been toying with placing another cs order and maybe I need to go with a variation on the San Dimas promod- thinking San Dimas alder body, 24 jumbos on a maple quartersawn (possibly neck thru? CS will not do this at the moment), 2H config w/ Dimarzio in bridge, 59 in the neck, routed OFR, and some snazzy graphic finish, possibly snakeskin or bengal." Sounds reasonable don'tcha think? Return a used promod and in lieu of, order a CS San Dimas? & "Sadly, the clown that put the block in, also misdrilled about 6 or 7 times (or redrilled for a different positioning 3 times over- hard to tell) and the bottom of the cavity where the block attaches looks like swiss cheese. Then there's the missing 2 frets- Nah, I'm returning it - got a custom order I've just put in with Matt for an SD 1-2H with 24 frets, routed OFR, the Dimarzio/Seymour pups and a snazzy custom paint job..." Sounds to me like he regretted buying a guitar that he already knew didn't fit his type. Or he needs the cash back. He's talking all this sh*@ while my guitar is still in his possession. So, I get the guitar back today {packed sloppily, full of dried sweaty handprints and fingerprints} and as a direct result of him removing all the strings, then stringing it up poorly, the set-up is gone...it needs to be set up again. I deducted $50.00 for this, and he's throwing a hissy fit. Here's a few of the things he's said..."given your neglecting to take the time to inspect the guitar beyond a cursory topical observation at the cleanliness of it, I would have to question your judgment & findings in such a case. My brother-in-law, a lawyer and one-time district attorney agrees." & "Hope that defense holds up well in court, Doug. It'll be interesting to see how the membership on the JCF feel about this as well." & "Can't WAIT to hear how a magistrate or judge reacts to that one." & "I will NOT hesitate to recount this transaction in detail on the JCF and let the other members see what a petty and slimy person you are acting like." & "You have until midnight tonight to refund or I commence proceedings to recover my 50 bucks and to expose you as a lousy seller to avoid on JCF." & "Please, don't make me get ugly about this." And the best one of all, when I told him the guitar arrived filthy with his hand/fingerprints, his reply was... "FYI- I have a workshop in the basement that is climate controlled for temp & humidity and the likelihood of me sweating during that inspection is ZERO! Moreover, my skin type is decidedly non- greasy, leaning towards the dry side so the possibility of those being MY prints are slim-to-none." Who can argue with that logic, eh? Jim is so perfect, he doesn't even sweat AND he's "non-greasy"! To sum up, I have bought, sold, and traded guitars for 35 years. I have nearly 2,000 pos. ebay feedbacks {dan-electro}. I have a stellar reputation for buying, selling, & trading guitars. I am considered a world authority on Danelectro's and wrote two books on the subject. I do not need to steal $50.00 by being dishonest. My reputation is important to me. Despite the fact I thought Jim at a minimum, shared equal responsibility over these "undisclosed" issues, I immediately offered two remedies... Both to his benefit. A full refund {minus shipping}, or a partial $75.00 refund. On the other hand, I am not going to be sh#& on by Jim. So, he got a full refund minus shipping and minus $50.00 for my time/trouble to re-set this guitar up. Sure, I certainly could have dis-assembled the entire instrument and gave a more accurate description, but I didn't. Neither did I defraud him. He could have asked anything prior to buying it. I answered EVERY question he asked, I accomodated the hell out of him, that's it. Jim needs to take responsibility for himself. Clearly he buys first, and asks questions later. That's kids stuff, he's a grown man and I'm no babysitter for grown men who buy then ask questions after the fact. I was truthful and honorable in my dealings with Jim. BOTTOM LINE: Based on his removing the strings to see what pickup was in it AFTER he declined purchase, the guitar now needs a set-up. Simple... I'm keeping $50.00 for that. I've included a couple of photos of the cavity and the guitar...

[vector]

Rich#6, I agree with you in that I don't think Mr. Graphic was trying to scam me. Not in the least. But there were significant differences in what the guitar is and how it was described. Regardless of whether we feel it is justified to ask for a refund because of said differences, the refund was offered and accepted. When it was established that the guitar was returned in same state (albeit out of tune) Mr. Graphic withheld 50 bucks claiming it required a set up as part of the process to re-tune the guitar. It then becomes a matter of honoring one's word. Everything else falls by the wayside. On offer was made, there are no relevant mitigating factors to alter it, honor it.

I can't really address your opinion on taking the guitar apart. Exaggeration or overstatement however, come to mind. I looked at the pick up. This involved removing the strings and 4 screws. Everything was put back same-same. Period. Taking the guitar apart after the fact? Really?

Lastly, the lawyer is my brother-in-law and I was using his reference not as a threat but as a source for demonstrating the validity of position.

[LouSiffer]

Once you decided on a refund and MG agreed on it, you no longer own that guitar. Disassembly should have nevet crossed your mind. It should have immediately been put back in its shipping form and forgotten about.-Lou

[z1n]

You guys need to just move on. Lesson Learned. FYI if you returned the guitar with that stop block removed, it's probably gonna be out of tune, esecially after traveling. Also, if Graphic is paying for a setup, then let him keep the money otherwise give the setup fee back to vector. MHO Game Over

[vector]

Once you decided on a refund and MG agreed on it, you no longer own that guitar. Disassembly should have nevet crossed your mind. It should have immediately been put back in its shipping form and forgotten about.-Lou

Fair enough but do you believe that constitutes a reasonable validation for not honoring one's word (Is there EVER a validation for not honoring one's word?) or for withholding 50 bucks? Mr. Graphic claims that because the guitar arrived back to him out of tune that it requires a set up that runs 50 dollars.

I'm not trying to deflect here but this really isn't about my dick-ishly checking out the pickup make/model. Had I damaged the guitar in any way & caused the seller to have to invest any money or significant time to fix something, it'd be different story. This is about OP honoring his agreement and the unwarranted charge of 50 bucks for tuning the guitar back to E440.

[vector]

You guys need to just move on. Lesson Learned. FYI if you returned the guitar with that stop block removed, it's probably gonna be out of tune, esecially after traveling. Also, if Graphic is paying for a setup, then let him keep the money otherwise give the setup fee back to vector. MHO Game Over

Nothing was removed/changed other than not being tuned back to E440. Seriously...

[MakeAJazzNoiseHere]

How did you remove the strings?

[Axegrinder87]

I usually leave the strings on when I pull pickups. I'm lazy.

[Mr Graphic]

Debate all you want. I sent a clean, in-tune, well set up guitar to you. I also accommodated you 100%. I did not hesitate to offer both a full refund {minus shipping} and a partial $75.00 refund. You dicked me around, talked smack on the board about my guitar {while you still had it}, then sent it back filthy, out of tune, that when I tuned it to pitch, the Floyd was pitching forward. How is that just a matter of tuning it back up? You had no right dis-assemble my guitar after declining purchase. Whatever you did screwed up the set-up this guitar had. Defending it shows how flagrant and clueless you are. So I have to spend an hour re-setting up a guitar so you could see what pickup was in it? I don't think so...

[Axegrinder87]

If guitar techs make $50 an hour, I'm game.

It's entirely plausible that temperature/climate/humidity and whatnot had an effect on the neck, causing the pitch you speak of. I think you're just throwing a hissy.

He also shouldn't have pulled the pup.

But you can't charge him for doing so. Just like you can't charge him for what was 99.9999% most likely caused just by shipping. Jackson tunes all of their guitars before shipping out, and I've never had one come to me in tune. That's just wood doing what wood does. Get over it.

[veemagic]

I have been following all of these threads and I must say Vector once you decided you didn't want the guitar anymore, for whatever reason, you had absolutely no business touching it. I think MG is being more than fair on this one. You're lucky he only charged you $50 and didn't send it back to you and said you own it. With that being said I hope you two can find a way to get past this but this road looks long. Good luck and of course this is JMHO.

[dvscool]

I have been following all of these threads and I must say Vector once you decided you didn't want the guitar anymore, for whatever reason, you had absolutely no business touching it. I think MG is being more than fair on this one. You're lucky he only charged you $50 and didn't send it back to you and said you own it. With that being said I hope you two can find a way to get past this but this road looks long. Good luck and of course this is JMHO.

+1

I made the same comment in the other thread... If you didn't want the guitar then why fuck with it? At all?

Having said that, if a full refund was a agreed....then....

This is just a pissing match..over 50 Bucks....CLEARLY the 2 of you will never agree......hopefully you both are wiser.....

Move on dudes.....Go shred.....

[Rich#6]

If you send a guitar back to any of the big companies and it's not how they sent it to you they will charge you a restocking fee right?