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**etepbbb** · 09-27-2009, 09:29 AM

My experience with repair shops is that they can be really difficult to deal with sometimes. I would bring it back to them, but I wouldn't expect them to warranty it. If the job is that big and difficult that will cost to much labor, they'll tell you that its your water pump thats the problem, and therefore won't be covered under warranty. Although some shops make there techs. responsible for covering there own workmanship, which doesn't cost them anything other then not having a tech, while he repairs something.
Can you get at the mounting bolts at all, just to try and tighten them alittle more, could be just a loose bolt. Maybe check hose clamps, and other easy stuff. It might worth spending 20 minutes messing with it before you go back to the shop. Good luck.

**roodyrocker** · 09-27-2009, 11:38 AM

Originally posted by etepbbb View Post

My experience with repair shops is that they can be really difficult to deal with sometimes. I would bring it back to them, but I wouldn't expect them to warranty it. If the job is that big and difficult that will cost to much labor, they'll tell you that its your water pump thats the problem, and therefore won't be covered under warranty. Although some shops make there techs. responsible for covering there own workmanship, which doesn't cost them anything other then not having a tech, while he repairs something.
Can you get at the mounting bolts at all, just to try and tighten them alittle more, could be just a loose bolt. Maybe check hose clamps, and other easy stuff. It might worth spending 20 minutes messing with it before you go back to the shop. Good luck.

I'm not really familiar with Neon motors but if its leaking from the gasket mating surface and its not too bad of a reach, you may want to clean the area thoroughly then apply a little RTV sealer. RTV can be your friend sometimes

This is assuming you tried tightening bolts, clamps, etc... as previously mentioned. Also, most water pumps have a weep hole that they leak from when they go bad, does this water pump have that? If so, make sure its not leaking from there because if it is then the pump is bad and not the shop's workmanship. Bummer but sometimes even these "new" parts can go bad quickly especially since most are re-manufactured and not truly new.

**jgcable** · 09-27-2009, 12:05 PM

Originally posted by roodyrocker View Post

I'm not really familiar with Neon motors but if its leaking from the gasket mating surface and its not too bad of a reach, you may want to clean the area thoroughly then apply a little RTV sealer. RTV can be your friend sometimes

This is assuming you tried tightening bolts, clamps, etc... as previously mentioned. Also, most water pumps have a weep hole that they leak from when they go bad, does this water pump have that? If so, make sure its not leaking from there because if it is then the pump is bad and not the shop's workmanship. Bummer but sometimes even these "new" parts can go bad quickly especially since most are re-manufactured and not truly new.

The waterpump on a Neon is behind the timing belt cover. In order to change it or even get to the bolts the entire timing belt, tensioner, lower crank pully, power steering pmup, passenger tire, inner wheel housing and motor mounts must be removed. Its basically the first thing you do when you have to replace the timing belt because you can't get to it until everything is removed.
One guy told me that some shops will hold the mechanic responsible for the job if its not done correctly. This is assuming its leaking from the water pump gasket. I bought a UV die kit and I am waiting for it to stop raining so I can run it through the cooling system to see where its leaking exactly.

**Trussrod** · 09-27-2009, 02:02 PM

It's obvious you know what you are talking about. Good luck and don't get stressed before hearing their response. Hopefully they will take care of this at no charge.

I had a timing belt break on an interference engine and it didn't do any damage. So I'm not inclined to change these parts before they fail. Good luck.

**DonP** · 09-27-2009, 02:25 PM

Welcome to being F'd by mechanics. I coughed up $3K on maintenance to the 2003 Tahoe.

Can you say "Grab your ankles"?

**LouSiffer** · 09-27-2009, 02:59 PM

As burnt out as I am working on daily drivers, I always do the work myself. The last stint with a dealer that tried to charge me over a grand for a bad spark plug renewed my faith in the fact that most of those guys either don't know shit ( I was a technician for a dealer where most of the guys didn't with the exception of a couple really smart ones ), or they just like to throw parts at a car rather than diagnose the single piece.-Lou

**Jason1212** · 09-27-2009, 04:13 PM

I know that you are confident in the water pump but check with the maker of the water pump. Sometimes they offer reimburesments if the part is defective. Was the pump new of reman? I would also go to a third party to have it inspected and repaired. A third party has nothing to gain or lose based on what or who is at fault. If it is a defective part they get paid, if it was poor installation they still get paid. Let the shop that did the repair know about the situation and how you will address it.

**roodyrocker** · 09-27-2009, 09:50 PM

Originally posted by jgcable View Post

The waterpump on a Neon is behind the timing belt cover. In order to change it or even get to the bolts the entire timing belt, tensioner, lower crank pully, power steering pmup, passenger tire, inner wheel housing and motor mounts must be removed. Its basically the first thing you do when you have to replace the timing belt because you can't get to it until everything is removed.
One guy told me that some shops will hold the mechanic responsible for the job if its not done correctly. This is assuming its leaking from the water pump gasket. I bought a UV die kit and I am waiting for it to stop raining so I can run it through the cooling system to see where its leaking exactly.

I know what you mean. I hate cars that have sideways mounted engines with front wheel drive

This is why I love V8 rear wheel drive

Sorry about your water pump problems, I know it sucks!

**jgcable** · 09-28-2009, 08:01 PM

Well, of course, just like I thought the repair shop says its a faulty water pump. I still think it was installed incorrectly but there is no way for me to prove it.
Here is the question....
If the repair shop supplied the water pump they would have replaced it no charge. Because I supplied it.. they are wacking me for another $250.00 in labor + $44.00 for a new water pump. I contacted the company I ordered the water pump from and I expressed my dissatifaction because there is no way to tell a water pump is defective until after its installed. The water pump I purchased has a 1 year warranty.
In my business.. if I sell a faulty part to a customer and they install it they will send me a bill for the labor to rip out the faulty part and reinstall the new part. I take that labor charge and pass it along to the manufacturer of the faulty part and they take care of it pending inspection of the faulty part. 99.9% of the time I have no problem with that procedure. I asked the company I got the water pump from for the same thing because I did bring my car to a reputable repair shop who is also a registered Connecticut State Emissions Inspection Station. I think the manufacturer should cover the fees. What do you guys think?

**LouSiffer** · 09-28-2009, 08:28 PM

They should cover it ,but, some state laws vary. Generally, when I have had issues like this, I had to pay out of pocket and send the supplier a detailed bill.
It also depends on the company. These fucks will use any wording necessary to avoid taking a loss...even if their product is defective. They know the odds are you will not mess with small claims courts.

However, I would attempt a small claims. Especially if they are based far away as someone will have to be subpoened into court. If nothing else, they will spend just as much , if not more just to have to show up.-Lou

**Jason1212** · 09-28-2009, 09:44 PM

If it only had a one year warranty it was probably a rebuilt pump. Those companies generally do not pay if their part is defective. At least none of the companies I used when I worked in automotive would.

**bcrich1975** · 09-29-2009, 12:32 PM

Was the water pump you purchased from Rock Auto new or reman.? I work for Carquest and out of our two store chain, we will NOT sell reman. water pumps anymore at all. They are absolute junk regardless of supplier.

If you did purchase a new w.p. and can confirm that the water pump itself is to blame, you will probably have to foot the labor bill but I'd file to labor reimbursement. Someone else also mentioned adding dye to the cooling system. I'd do that before going any further. Add the dye, run the engine and check it with a UV light/glasses to confirm the exact location of the leak.

I also worked for Chrysler for quite a while. Number one problem with Neon's was head gaskets. I know thats bad news but for years we were doing about two a week....every other one (on avg.) needed a new head or be sent out to the machine shop because the head would get pitted very bad from the gasket gradually getting worse and worse over time. Chrsler admitted fault to this and would pay for the parts and the cust. would pay for labor but only if they were a loyal customer with regular service history.

I agree with the comment about rear wheel drive cars. The engine was installed in the right direction. Sideways engines suck to work on...unless you're just changing spark plugs on a 4cyl.

**LouSiffer** · 09-29-2009, 06:34 PM

I loved that Chrysler Recall on the Neons. That was the biggest scam in history: We supply the parts which usually only consisted of about $50-75 bucks our cost, and you pay the labor..... Which I think was 6-8 hours at about $80 an hour depending on where you live. -Lou

**bcrich1975** · 09-30-2009, 10:50 AM

Lou...
Scam is right...well unless Chrysler had to foot the bill for a new head or the machine shop work but the head set(gaskets) alone didn't cost much at all. You're right on the money there. Chrysler didn't issue a "recall" on those cars either. A recall only applies to a safety issue and a leaking head gasket didn't fall into that category. Only the people who were smart enough to bitch and whine continuously would get assistance with the repair from Chrysler. I was the service manager and went to bat for a lot of these folks. I knew the original gasket installed on these cars was junk in the first place. We charged "actual time" for the job and didn't make a killing on labor. I worked for what you could call one of the more honest dealers. I've seen some shady stuff in my time. Funny though, for an economy car, aside from the head gasket nonsense, the Neon's were ok cars. I could always share the Grand Cherokee brake rotor story for anyone who cares. Oh, the crap manufacturers put on the dealers is amazing.

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waterpump problems.. bummer

waterpump problems.. bummer

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