Not virtuosi but lazy, dishonest and unoriginal masturbators.

[Scooter]

I think what's really missing is a sense of composition. If you want to do the Classical Shred licks, do it in a more orchestrated format, forgetting about radio-friendly 3 minute crap. Do a concerto or something.

I couldn't agree more.

[MartinBarre]

some true virtuosity... Which Frank had more in his pinky toe nail than your average evh

Come now.

[Hellbat]

I thought that's what the kids were into these days?

But yeah, everyone and their mother shreds the same scales and modes that were old news in '88, and too many people still think that's great. It's not. It's boring.

I think what's really missing is a sense of composition. If you want to do the Classical Shred licks, do it in a more orchestrated format, forgetting about radio-friendly 3 minute crap. Do a concerto or something.

Thats why I was all over Yngwie's stuff he did with orchestras. What blew me away so much when he released his first solo album (Rising Force) wasn't the songs in the rock format like Black Star and Now Your Ships Are Burned and Evil Eye. The first time I listened to that tape I must have rewound and listened to Icarus' Dream Suite Op. 4 like 25 times in a row. And when I got to Little Savage I did the same thing. Especially the outro solo. I just wanted it to keep going. I kept turning it up hoping to hear more haha. Thank god Farewell is a quiet song or I would have killed my ears.

But I knew he could pull off the symphony stuff just from Icarus' Dream Suite Op. 4 and I knew with the right person helping with arrangements he could pull it off for a whole symphony. And he did. The concert with the New Japan Philharmonic was amazing.

[Endrik]

it didn't come across that way yesterday!!!

Oh c'mon now, I was specific about this from the start, people playing simple scales up and down. I didn't mention a word about adapting Schoenberg composition techniques or using micro tones from another galaxy.

[Endrik]

You aint kiddin.

And we're still waiting to hear an example of what you mean Endrik. It doesnt even need to be you playing it, just post a Youtube vid or something to give us an idea of WTF you mean.
I have a feeling it will sound like shit, which is why no one is doing it and sticks to the usual ways.

Take any "solo" from any Debussy composition for example. The focus is on the colour and the tone of the notes and their harmonies, things changing up all the time. There's not a note that sounds shit. He is the prime influence on anyone who composes serious music for films for expressing different moods or love making scenes. Sex is a lot more interesting than masturbation.

[Endrik]

It's a voicing/phrasing issue. A simple example would be how descending C minor arpeggio is played on a guitar.
The standard voicing for descending 5 string arpeggio is G4 Eb4 C4 G3 Eb3 C3 and for descending 6 string arpeggio it's Eb4 C4 G3 Eb3 C3 G2 C2.
Most of the mindless sweep picking wankfests are based on this voicing. It's the easiest way to play but doesn't alway sound the best.

One of the ways I play it is this Eb4 G4 G3 C4 C3 G3 Eb3 Eb2 G2 C2 because it sounds more melodic. Nothing overly complicated, it's all about making things sound as good as possible.

[MartinBarre]

Take any "solo" from any Debussy composition for example. The focus is on the colour and the tone of the notes and their harmonies, things changing up all the time. There's not a note that sounds shit. He is the prime influence on anyone who composes serious music for films for expressing different moods or love making scenes. Sex is a lot more interesting than masturbation.

Fair enough, sounds interesting. Can you post a link to a Youtube vid or something then?

[atomic charvel guy]

Martin, i bet i can come up with a a few zappa tunes you might like, try this one-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdsRppc86uI

[atomic charvel guy]

It's got it all that song- Uncle Remus
great solo, great piano, background vocals, i digress, it's got it all.

[MartinBarre]

Nah I didn't like that song. I hate his voice, and I hate songs with female backing vocals like that.
I did like the guitar solo, but - it was very predictable (in a good way), not really something I would imagine Endrik endorsing in this thread.

[MartinBarre]

Put that Muffin Man on again, you know what it's like - the horrible mid section of Jethro Tull's "A Passion Play". Only even more annoying, less amusing and less interesting musically.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VElJqN5XDdQ

[horns666]

I remember that epic, viral youtube video of Tommy and Endy sword fighting to the Star Wars soundtrack..



..or was that the ambien..:think:

[atomic charvel guy]

Well Martin, then it;'s official, Mr Zappa is not for you, and that's cool, they're your ears,
you're allowed to like whatever you want with them, that's the beauty of music.

[atomic charvel guy]

I remember that epic, viral youtube video of Tommy and Endy sword fighting to the Star Wars soundtrack..



..or was that the ambien..:think:

it was both.
actually , the video was endrik trying to get some kind of sleep in during his visit, that didn't go too well by the way
as far catching some winks at my house at that time. Endy actually told ne he was in total and severe culture shock after
seeing my daily plan of attack to each day at that time in my life.