Union rant

[txcharvel]

Re: Union rant

So basically you're saying you can't make it on your own and need a socialist type union to pick up the slack, make sure you're taken care of, and earn way more than you're worth...I get it.

No offense [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[Tekky]

Re: Union rant

Well kids... Here's some interesting info... The managers killed!! We had probably a week of training and a couple of weeks of waiting after that. SBC has maintained service levels and average call times as if the union workers never left.

UNIDENTIFIED FAMILY MEMBERS OF SBC MANAGERS STAGE COUNTER-PROTEST

(San Antonio, TX) In the finest traditions of the First Amendment, the husband and three children of an SBC manager are at this moment staging a counter-protest on the sidewalk in front of SBC corporate headquarters at 175 East Houston Street in downtown San Antonio. Walking back and forth alongside the dozen or so red-shirted, chanting CWA "strikers" *, the four silently carry signs reading "Don't Give In, E.W.", "SBC Rocks", "Thank You For A Nice Life, SBC", "I Miss You, Mom", and "I Hear Enron Is Hiring." Local news media have arrived and are covering this event. Chairman and CEO Edward E. Whitacre, upon hearing of the counter-pickets, took a break from the labor negotiations to visit with the family members in front of the building.

Thus far no incidents have been reported, although several officers of the San Antonio Police Department are nearby to preserve order, and to keep traffic moving at the intersection of Houston and St. Mary's Streets, crowded with weekend tourist traffic.

-30-

* The word "strikers" is in quotes because, according to local labor relations experts, a "real strike" does not begin with a pre-announced end date.

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[A. Pulver]

Re: Union rant

"I Hear Enron Is Hiring." Local news media have arrived and are covering this event. Chairman and CEO Edward E. Whitacre, upon hearing of the counter-pickets, took a break from the labor negotiations to visit with the family members in front of the building.


I love the Enron refrence.
A company run by greedy pig executives into the ground, destroying the lives of thousands of families, while the executives get to keep their mansions, mercedes and million dollar bonuses.

In other words, this is the only gig around and you had best take what they offer.
They want to cut your job and outsource it.
They want to make you pay up the wazoo for your medical coverage.
In effect, they want the workers to approve of having their job taken and their effective income reduced. Yeah, where do I sign. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img]
They made 8.5 Billion in profits last year.
Share the wealth...

[Tekky]

Re: Union rant

Sorry AP, but you're really not looking at all the facts on this.

- Anything that SBC has outsourced has not been taken from Union workers.
- Currently, union members do not pay a monthly premium for healthcare. they just pay a co-pay. In case you haven't heard, healthcare costs are rising. SBC is asking them to pony up a little more for co-pay which translates to roughly 10% of their total healthcare costs. (from what I believe) I myself not only pay a co-pay, but I also pay a premium of about 40%.

[lerxstcat]

Re: Union rant

AP, it's no surprise you want to stay on the gravy train; it's to your benefit to maintain the status quo. What happens when your pensions have been robbed by your union leaders and you're left SOL though? Or when the day comes that your union's customers realize it doesn't take rocket scientists to do what you do, and start hiring non-union shops to do your jobs? This has been the trend in America
for about 30 years now. If the trend hasn't reached you yet, good for you, but it will.

In areas where the choice is $10/hr. or NO JOB, well $10/hr. beats starving. I guess if you can stay with your parents and live on them you can be picky, but in the South jobs have always been harder to come by, so we're apt to take what we can get. That doesn't make us rats, it means you're spoiled by a paradigm that mostly no longer exists. Lucky you, again IF your union leaders don't loot the pension fund and head to the Bahamas. I hope they don't, but union beauracracies can be as corrupt as corporate boards. Since
you're sneering at the non-union folks, it would almost be appropriate. No offense, of course.

[Tekky]

Re: Union rant

update...

i'm home, i'm tired, my liver says "no mas por favor" (i'm not sure why my liver thinks it's spanish), i'm going to bed

[LarryL]

Re: Union rant

A week in Redford will do that to you.

[Trypp Powell]

Re: Union rant

As far as not having unions in the South is concerned, that $10.00 an hour will go a lot farther here than in Michigan, New York, or New Jersey.

There are a few Unions around here, though. Every Union hall around here has a sign stating that no foreign cars are allowed on the premises. Do they do this everywhere? What if a guy in the Union wants to buy a Honda and drive it to the meetings?

[A. Pulver]

Re: Union rant

I've never heard of having a problem with owning a foreign car.
Hell, I don't think there is a full sized pickup made in the USA anymore.
I know at the Ford plant, the good spots are reserved for fords only.
If you drive another brand, they make you park a mile away.
I'm not trying to crap on anyone, just point out the benefits of a union.
BTW Todd, I'm glad it's over for you, but I also hope those workers get everything they are after.

[Tekky]

Re: Union rant

Well, here I go again. I'm on full alert for strike duty... Instead of CWA, it's now IBEW.

What's different this time is that unlike with CWA, there is no 30 day notice before going on strike. Which means, at 11:59 on Saturday, they can strike and I have to be in the garage (thank god it's here in Chicago this time) at 7am the latest. With my situation I'll need to arrive earlier. Since I don't have a car, I'm going to have to walk through what could possibly be a picket line.

UGH!!!! I really hate what the Unions have become...

[img]graemlins/rant.gif[/img]

[A. Pulver]

Re: Union rant

IBEW all the way baby. [img]graemlins/headbang.gif[/img]
Local 1xx here. [img]graemlins/images/icons/tongue.gif[/img]
Cross that line and you're a Scab!!! [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
Muuuuuuahahaha

[lerxstcat]

Re: Union rant

You know, Reagan fired the air traffic controllers... and Bush calls himself the heir of Reagan...

That'd be funny as hell if the President fired the whole union, wouldn't it?

It's probably a lot easier to be an electrician than an air traffic controller anyway! [img]graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] j/k!

TEKKY, if you're walking through the picket line, take your walking stick; I know your leg pains you sometimes! [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

[Deneb]

Re: Union rant

my union, the SEIU, has a bit over 1.6 million members. We represent LOADS of different types of workers.

People die for the 8 hour work day. Tekky, you did other peoples jobs (you say), which means you took work from another person, and possibly jeapordized their jobs.

The raise to pay for health care is true. My insurance has risen 3 dollars a month, and my prescriptions went up 15$, and copays up 10$. I could care less about 3$, but if I need to see a doctor, I pay double now (20$), and prescriptions are 25$ now.

I understand, I still have it well, but the labor union helps the workers.

The job outsourcing is ridiculous, ruining peoples jobs and sending them out is bullshit. People SHOULD earn a living wage, and yeah, a small raise may seem like shit to you, but it means the workers have moved ground with the bosses.

All to often bosses fuck their employees, and it's ridiculous. Look at Wal Mart, each person is worth over 20 Billion $, but they fuck their employees left and right?

You may be upset about it, and yes I can understand it, but it's for their rights, and maybe...your management needs to unionize.

My labor union has asked us to boycott coke, I don't do a good job of it, BUT, listen to why. In other countries, people form death squads. Just because Coke employees tried to organize...Coke had death squads kill the employees in question *big media article, and I can give facts on this if anyone is interested*.

I can say it sucks for you, and I can understand you feel the union has done shit for you, sometimes I question them as well, but you have to understand, contracts are not negotiated overnight, workers deserve good pay, Health care is a RIGHT not a privilage. And you say you were union before right? What about if you didn't have a union then...would you have made what you did then?

I know this is stupid of me to even post an opinionated reply, and even more moronic of me to do it to a forum admin, but please understand, the union is NOT useless, and if the union where you work has instructed people to go on strike, then the bosses must be screwing the employees, they are more than likely making more money, but the employers make the same. They probably have received health insurance increases, with no raises.

I apologize in advance if I offend you, but you guys are always saying how this is America, how it's great, and how it's the land of the free et cetera.

Don't you think that in America, the worlds more than likely most advanced country, should have good wages, and health care for it's employees?

[Trypp Powell]

Re: Union rant

Living in an area where unions aren't very common (and where they apparently don't have much influence), I am really interested in this discussion.

I still need to find out why the few union halls around here have large signs saying that no foreign vehicles are allowed on the premises.

Also, are there jobs where you live that require you to be in the union? I really don't see how that is legal. After all, if it is illegal to prohibit people from unionizing, then shouldn't it be illegal to make someone join a union in order to work? Again, this is all very unfamiliar to me.

[Deneb]

Re: Union rant

Okay, now that I'm a little less pissed off about the topic, and can think a little more clearly (Sorry if I was a dick before, but I'm VERY pro union). I want to say, that temporarily I'm not a union worker. I'm a salaried employee, since I took a new job for 5.5 months. If I work one day a week, or 7, I'm still going to get the same amount of money per week.

1; Job outsourcing (sending jobs overseas, for cheaper labor) is NOT because of unions. It is because of greedy bosses. Tech support calls are handled by NON union people in INDIA for American problems. Labor is sent over, because it's even CHEAPER to pay someone what you pay another country, than to pay MINIMUM wage here.

Job outsourcing is primarily a problem due to presidents who give large tax breaks to companies who fuck over their American employees. It's a result of a government that hates Unions, and the right to organize. It's the result of a government that would like to privatize everything, because then there would be more money to be had, and without labor unions, instead of fucking out of country men, you could fuck your own workers.

2; There are plenty of unions who are crappy, and there's corruption everywhere (Unions tie directly to politics, so please understand where this is coming from) if you speak of union corruption, you must speak of political corruption. That's something that we just have to try and deal with, and punish the people who do it.

IBEW(Brotherhood of Electrical Workers) is still up there in the top 10 size of the unions, however, it's not the biggest. The 3 biggest are, SEIU, AFSCME, Teamsters. It would benifit if you were in one of those unions. However, even the union I'm in (the largest) still has shitty contracts in shitty facilities.

We have issues of mandatory overtime in Nursing jobs, where nurses are full time workers (40 hours a week), and they are doing 60-90 a week. That affects the quality of care they give. This is not bullshit made up by a union, it's a fact, surveyed, and studied. This applies to any job where overtime is a crucial and integeral part of the job, and this is because of staffing shortages, et cetera.

3; Health care is an issue, for alot of people. Why do politicians have awesome benifits, but the people they represent have shit benifits? Why is health care so hard to come by? I can tell you. The government (sorry, but this is fact) Republicans, have made it so you cannot negotiate the price of prescription drugs. In Canada, or Europe you can.

It may not make sense at first...but I can tell you why. The pharmaceutical (spelling) industry is HUGE. Mega bucks. This next statement is a GENERALIZATION NOT APPLYING TO ALL BUT SOME. Most rich are republicans, most workers are democrats, and in the middle you have the idependents and others. Bush's tax cuts (FACT) apply to mainly the top 1% of the population who makes...over 150$K a year. The other 99% of the population (the part that needs the tax cuts) really didn't see shit. Why is this? If you give rich (businesses) perks, and they do well, more often, you do well. If you screw the people around on their prescribed drugs, you make sure the pharmaceutical (spelling) companies make big money. Health care is a problem, plain and simple. It's all to often a privelage only the rich, and lucky enjoy.

4; Corruption in unions. It happens in unions, in non unions, in anything. It's a fact of life, that too many people are in it for themselves, and not for their fellow man. It makes me [img]graemlins/images/icons/mad.gif[/img]

5; Outlived, outliving usefullness. I don't think so. I think some unions take things too far sometimes, but for the most part, I can tell you, I would like a raise. If any of you know, I was bumped from maintenance, to groundskeeping. It irritates me, however I'm happy to still have a job. If my workplace could, they'd drop all of our wages, and raise theirs. Tekky, you should feel privilaged that you have a job at the end of the day. (in fact, any of us with stable jobs should).

6; Anyone saying anything about refining fuel needs to talk to the Bush administration, who has it so Iraqis are getting gas at 5 cents per gallon (yes, it's five cents, as in, a nickle, five pennies, half a dime) and our tax dollars are paying for it. We're paying to rebuild their schools, and refining their schools, when our classrooms are over crowded, and our gas prices are up (thankfully they're a bit down).

Tekky, I know you're upset about having to possibly do someone elses job. It sucks, it sucks big balls, but, sometimes people need something more. I don't know who you work for, what union it is, or more semantics of it. I can tell you this however.

More than likely, it costs more to live now where you are, than it did, OR, health care went up, OR, the people at the top are making more money. I know if I worked for a place, and the people at the top started making more money, I'd want a bigger piece of the pie too, if I was working for it.

Right off of the bat. This is NOT a bash Bush thing. It's not an endorse Kerry thing. Infact, I don't much like Kerry, I like a few plans he has, but in the end, I still like a few things Bush is doing. Everything I said is factual, and can be backed up, with documents, not some bullshit story, some fuck brain made up. I chose what I said very carefully so I did not offend too many people. If I did, I apologize in advance. I'm not bashing the war, if that's what it looks like. I do find it suspicious the 9-11 panel, found no link between Sadaam, and the terror attacks on the US, however, Sadaam needed to go. Kerry wants to make the US the united states of the UN, I like Bush's take charge, get it the fuck done attitude, I just personally, don't like his policies that fuck me left and right. I don't like the anti union, anti overtime bullshit he's trying to pull. It leads to privitazing, and if you don't think it's a problem, because you're a salaried employee, or you're a union employee, you just wait until it goes through (hopefully it won't).

Sorry this is so long, the rant is off. [img]graemlins/rant.gif[/img] If you would like, I can source you any of my information.