upcoming republican convention sched.

[Newc]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

And tomorrow the Democrats will give the guy another fish and $40 dollars, and the "poor guy" won't go buy a damn fishing pole. He'll just come back again the next day for a fish and $60.
BTW, that money comes out of MY paycheck, not off the Guvmint Money Tree.
I demand that my tax dollars go either back in my pocket (remember, it's an interest-free loan to the Guvmint) or to someone who contributes positively to the economy. You cannot draw welfare AND contribute positively to the economy - it's a physical impossibility, like "Democratic Leadership".
Can't follow a parked car very far.

Newc

[OnlineStageGear]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

And the Democrats will say if you happen to catch more fish than the guy next to you, that is not fair and you have to give him your extra fish even though you worked twice as hard for your fish.

Matt

[fett]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

Newc; The basic premise of a society, as compared to a mass of people, is the fact that a society, as a collective group, will look after the ones that need help. They will do this in their own self-interest. While the vast majority will be productive and contribute to it's wellbeing, there will always be "the others". If "the others" get too large, you have revolution. The Great Depression is a great starting point. The Hoovers said, "Let every man stand on his own two feet." When conditions change that are under no one man's control, you can end up with 25% unemployment and people in soup lines. Government had to step in. This is when the population was about 125mil or so. Government, ie: Roosevelt, may have saved the day by providing a safety net. Since then, the population is closer to 300mil. There are even more of "the others". What would you propose to do? There is no question that between the "heavy-handed"Republicans and the "bleeding-heart" Democrats the system is all fucked-up. You can't have all of the advantages of a society without also being responsible for "the others".

[OnlineStageGear]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

I have met way way way way too many of "the others" who didn't need any help, they were just lazy sacks of Rhino dung that refused to be responsible and refused to work. There are very few excuses for needing welfare and too many avenues in this country to make money in.

Matt

[fett]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

You know what we need is a good old real war. That way, we can put everyone to work. All you 20 something JFC'ers can be inducted; your lazy former auto plant worker uncle can build tanks; and "the others" can find work too. Until such time, there are just too many people and too few ways to get ahead. It's a numbers game, and there are just too many of us. "God. It must be nice to be young and insulated from what history tells us is a world that is full of more heartache that joy."

[Evol]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

Originally posted by fett:
Newc; The basic premise of a society, as compared to a mass of people, is the fact that a society, as a collective group, will look after the ones that need help.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You mean socialism.

I'm sick of my check being drained and seeing some FAT fucker in the checkout line spending MY hard earned money to stay fucking fat as fuck! The government is not and should never be a damn charity.
Welfare should be based on charity dollars ONLY never taxes,see how many of the lazy fuckers who don't really need it magically find jobs etc when they are cut off from their ice cream and candy.

I wish just for a year we could vote on what programs our tax dollars go to instead of the govt.having it's way.Give the power back to the people (I know it's not realistic but bear with me)with regards of what to do with their tax dollars and I can almost guarantee you it wouldn't go to welfare and shit that promotes the laziness of our society.

[Newc]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

FDR had a real brainfart that led to the Great Depression - letting the farmers in the Midwest (Oklahomastan, Kansastan, etc) cut down ALL the trees so they'd have that much more land for crops.
I guess you DID have to be a rocket scientist to understand that those treelines broke the wind, cuz right after they cut 'em all down, the harsh prairie winds blew the topsoil away, and took the seed with it, and blew down anything that tried to grow (small plants are very tender) and thus we ended up with a Dustbowl.
Since this was dead farmland, there were no crops coming from those fields, and no crops meant nothing to sell in the marketplace (including canned and raw vegetables, packaged meats, fresh fruits, etc), so the stores have no product to sell, which means they don't make money, which means the store owners and investors and insurers aren't being paid, which means banks are not being paid, which means stocks are not selling, so someone gets the idea that before all the real cash is gone, they're going to call in all "margins" for the stocks (i.e. cash in the I.O.U.s), but it's too late, as everyone else had the same idea, and there's not enough cash in hand to pay off the debts.
Enter Great Depression, thanks to FDR and a handful of ignorant farmers.

Newc

[fett]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

Well, I guess I have been Newc-ed. I don't think that FDR was responsible for the Dustbowl. I don't even think they had bowl games back then. You are making my point. Individuals do what they do. Society has the responsibility to clean up the mess. Administrations and Congress do all kinds of weird shit in the 2-4-or6 years they are in power. You can't have it both ways. You seem to think that it is "Every man for himself." That's great, until it impacts the body politic and the individual who has just been laid off or can't find a job. Then they vote. Then you have "change". I have a novel idea. Let's eliminate Social Security; pension plans; disability and any other outside source of income and see how comfy you will be. Not to mention your relatives.

[the_drip]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

right, The Great Depression is FDR's fault. [img]graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img] Even though he served his terms afterwards. He began his presidency when teh GReat Depression was in full swing.


"Franklin D. Roosevelt

Assuming the Presidency at the depth of the Great Depression, Franklin D. Roosevelt helped the American people regain faith in themselves. He brought hope as he promised prompt, vigorous action, and asserted in his Inaugural Address, "the only thing we have to fear is fear itself."

Born in 1882 at Hyde Park, New York--now a national historic site--he attended Harvard University and Columbia Law School. On St. Patrick's Day, 1905, he married Eleanor Roosevelt.

Following the example of his fifth cousin, President Theodore Roosevelt, whom he greatly admired, Franklin D. Roosevelt entered public service through politics, but as a Democrat. He won election to the New York Senate in 1910. President Wilson appointed him Assistant Secretary of the Navy, and he was the Democratic nominee for Vice President in 1920.





President Bush Biography
Vice President Cheney Biography
Laura Bush Biography
Lynne Cheney Biography





In the summer of 1921, when he was 39, disaster hit-he was stricken with poliomyelitis. Demonstrating indomitable courage, he fought to regain the use of his legs, particularly through swimming. At the 1924 Democratic Convention he dramatically appeared on crutches to nominate Alfred E. Smith as "the Happy Warrior." In 1928 Roosevelt became Governor of New York.

He was elected President in November 1932, to the first of four terms. By March there were 13,000,000 unemployed, and almost every bank was closed. In his first "hundred days," he proposed, and Congress enacted, a sweeping program to bring recovery to business and agriculture, relief to the unemployed and to those in danger of losing farms and homes, and reform, especially through the establishment of the Tennessee Valley Authority.

By 1935 the Nation had achieved some measure of recovery, but businessmen and bankers were turning more and more against Roosevelt's New Deal program. They feared his experiments, were appalled because he had taken the Nation off the gold standard and allowed deficits in the budget, and disliked the concessions to labor. Roosevelt responded with a new program of reform: Social Security, heavier taxes on the wealthy, new controls over banks and public utilities, and an enormous work relief program for the unemployed.

In 1936 he was re-elected by a top-heavy margin. Feeling he was armed with a popular mandate, he sought legislation to enlarge the Supreme Court, which had been invalidating key New Deal measures. Roosevelt lost the Supreme Court battle, but a revolution in constitutional law took place. Thereafter the Government could legally regulate the economy.

Roosevelt had pledged the United States to the "good neighbor" policy, transforming the Monroe Doctrine from a unilateral American manifesto into arrangements for mutual action against aggressors. He also sought through neutrality legislation to keep the United States out of the war in Europe, yet at the same time to strengthen nations threatened or attacked. When France fell and England came under siege in 1940, he began to send Great Britain all possible aid short of actual military involvement.

When the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor on December 7, 1941, Roosevelt directed organization of the Nation's manpower and resources for global war.

Feeling that the future peace of the world would depend upon relations between the United States and Russia, he devoted much thought to the planning of a United Nations, in which, he hoped, international difficulties could be settled.

As the war drew to a close, Roosevelt's health deteriorated, and on April 12, 1945, while at Warm Springs, Georgia, he died of a cerebral hemorrhage. "

[fett]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

Heh!! A few years on this side, a few years on that side of the Depression, the fact remains that a rich bleeding-heart Democrat baled this country out. Between Winston Churchill and FDR, there have never been greater statesmen. You wippersnappers best count your blessings.

[the_drip]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

finally, someone got it right.

go fett, it's your birthday, we're gonna party like it's your birthday! [img]graemlins/poke.gif[/img]

[fett]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

You whippersnappers may too young for this, but I have the Democrat's song. One line was, "Kerry on you wayward sons. Don't you cry no more."

[YetAnotherOne]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

LOL fett - Wanna hear how much those "great statesmen" who "rescued our nation" did for my family? Precisely and exactly: nothing. Not shit. My dad grew up during the Great Depression and the family was so poor they often had to live with relatives (extended family) because they couldn't make ends meet on their own. But they refused to take handouts and the outcome has been pretty good.

Midway through the Great Depression when they could no longer afford to put food on the table they sold nearly everything they owned, boarded up their shack of a home, and drove from the midwest to Phoenix (in a Model A pulling the 9' trailer in which they lived for the next few years) where my granddad had been promised a job in a copper mine near Ajo. When it didn't pan out, my grandfather wound up scrounging for odd jobs while my grandmother, dad and uncle picked up culled discarded oranges from the groves near Tempe, walked the (then) 5 miles back to their trailer in Phoenix and sold them for a penny or two per bucket door-to-door. What little money they managed to save in the couple of years they were there they lost to a fraudulent mine operator (i.e., someone selling shares in a mine that didn't exist). With no jobs to be had and things looking grim they sold their trailer and all of their possessions to raise enough money to return to the midwest (well before the kickoff of WW II snapped the US out of the Depression) and moved back in with the extended family.

Soon thereafter a great uncle with just a bit of property kicked off and my grandfather's brother (part of the extended family with whom my family lived) managed to snake the entire parcel for himself. Rather than whining about it my grandfather, father and uncle started their own business from scratch but WW II intervened when my dad and uncle were drafted. After being shot, patched up, shot, patched up again, shot again, patched up again and finally nearly freezing to death when his severe frostbite forced his unit to abandon him along the road during a forced march across a good portion of France in the winter of '44, dad finally got a chance to come home and get started on his life.

He worked for decades without much appreciable gain. When I was in grade school (late 70s, early 80s) our house still had rooms with no carpet on the floor or light fixtures on the ceiling because we couldn't afford them. We were fairly poor but I never really noticed. My grandfather, having worked literally sunrise to sunset (and often thereafter) with his sons trying to build his business, died before it had any significant success. Today, my dad lives in an inexpensive rural area, and pulls in a few hundred grand/year but it never came easy. No government program was there to pick up the pieces and write checks when the going got tough.

Dad didn't achieve the success he has today because of some lameass government handout, he got there because he kept his head screwed on straight and worked hard his entire life even though he didn't really think he was ever going to get "ahead" and he didn't until after his 60th birthday but that never stopped him from trying (and because his father did the same and never got to experience the success of what he'd helped build). Oh, and the relatives who snarked the great uncle's inheritance? They parlayed it into quite a bit of cash but they're all bankrupt today. There's a lesson in there about having things handed to you, learn it.

There's no conspiracy or "numbers game" that's preventing anyone here (at least the US residents) from getting ahead. More people = more potential customers/clients = more low-hanging fruit = more money to be made by those who're unafraid to try. The only things that prevent people from being successful in the US today are: 1) fear, 2) lack of desire (as demonstrated by a willingness to sacrafice) and/or 3) lack of intelligence. There are quite literally no excuses.

[OnlineStageGear]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

Heh!! A few years on this side, a few years on that side of the Depression, the fact remains that a rich bleeding-heart Democrat baled this country out. Between Winston Churchill and FDR, there have never been greater statesmen. You wippersnappers best count your blessings.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Umm, excuse me, WWII bailed us out of the depression.

Matt

[fett]

Re: upcoming republican convention sched.

Read your history boys. My grandparents and parents went throught the same shit. Remember, I'm 54. If it were not for WWII and the complete mobilization of the country, even Roosevelt's programs would not have baled out the country. All Out War requires the complete utilization of production and the expansion of same. There is nothing like war to get an economy running full-steam ahead. ( In the case of Germany, Italy and Japan. "AND THEN YOU LOOSE!!!".)